Luc Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 Hi to you, hope all fo you are doing good, such great furom you have! So here is my problem, I'm trying to do my first camouflage on a Harrier and I'm struggling to get a smooth surface with my badger 150 (and crappy Passche Talon too). I'm using Vallejo model air mostly and when I'm doing a camouflage patern I can achieve a good contour but when trying to fill the inner space I'm doing many passes and I got some "mirror" effect and rought surface. So my question is: should I use more Airflow Improver than Thinner? Which have the greater impact of surface quality? And what about the PSI? Here is my setups: I'm shooting mainly at 13-15 PSI. With my badger: 0,35mm needle 10 drops of paint, 2 drops of Improver, 1 drops of Thinner With my Paasche: 0.21mm needle, 10 drops of paint, 2 drops of Improver, 3 drops of Thinner My Paasche Talon GF seems to get better results but I have to struggle with nozzle/aircap and seem to be more tricky with dilution. (really disapointed by this product... especially with nozzle air Aircaps...) Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharknose Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 Ditch vallejo. Life = improved. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 Can't get Life products in Canada... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Miggins Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 I use model-air a lot. I find that some spray fine from the bottle and others need thinning. I would try a few drops of thinner first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobL Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 (edited) Eyeball your mix in a cup of some sort (I use plastic shot glasses) and listen to your airbrush - as long as it's thin enough, (most people use milk as an example) and your airbrush isn't sounding like it's having difficulty spraying it (compare how it sounds to spraying water) then you're golden. However, you mention a rough surface. Try getting closer to the model. With that low a psi the paint could be drying before it reaches the model, thus giving you the rough surface in places. Or increase your psi (and watch out for spider webbing). I spray Vallejo Model Air and spray at about 20-25psi, only reducing it via the mac valve on my airbrush when I need to get up close. I generally don't thin Vallejo Model Air paints, or add extra flow improver. Only very occasionally do you get a bottle that needs it. Most are OK (after a thorough shake). Although I've had a white and yellow that were too thin. Edited June 11, 2021 by RobL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 Thanks, I will keep an eye on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 Switch to lacquer, and forget about tip drying and mixing eg MRP 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pappy35 Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 All my surface texture problems when away when I started using MRP. I can't explain why, but I have never been able to shoot any Vallejo product. My two go-tos are MRP for lacquer and Tamiya thinned with Mr. Color Leveling Thinner or their acrylic thinner (X-20A?). Just a few days ago I tried Tamiya LP-# (silver, I don't recall the number) and it was amazing. In that same session I also tried Mig Ammo (or is it Ammo by Mig?) thinned with their thinner, water, and neat. Worked great too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Quack Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 Another vote for MRP. At all events, keep the paint thin, keep the pressure low and don't spray too far from your model. Q Who is still learning just like everybody else. PS ..... MRP! Brilliant stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Posted June 16, 2021 Author Share Posted June 16, 2021 MRP seems to be great product but I can't get it in canada. I can get Mig products and I will give it a try for sure. For now I've tested AK primers and paints and I'm very pleased... But I definitively try lacquers after, maybe I will switch to this as I have many vallejo and AK in stock. Thanks to you guys I will try playing with pressure and distance. Your help was great! And for camouflage I saw a guy using blue mastic to delimitate the pattern, seems to be intresting as I don't have to be precise and too close to the model so more pressure will help me getting better surface...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daneel Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 Try Gunze, Tamiya, MRP or Hataka, some of these paints must be available in Canada.. Like others said, if you continue trying with Vallejo, or AK... you're only making life hard for yourself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werdna Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 I really don't think it's a case of switching paints. The suggested paints are probably great, but there is nothing inherently wrong with Vallejo either. I wouldn't expect to spray it straight from the bottle without issues though, especially in warmer weather. I usually thin it with about 30% thinners (ie 3 drops thinners to 7 drops paint) and sometimes more for certain types of application and generally get a good surface finish. If ever I don't, it's usually because I've gone wrong somewhere, not because of the paint. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steben Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Model Air smells good though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob K. Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 I guess it is all down to preferences. I really like Vallejo, but only for brush-painting (Vallejo model Color). For airbrushing, mr Color or Tamiya lacquer paints are so much easier to airbrush provided their thinned with their brand levelling thinners. MRP would probably be the same. I do use the proper mask & Filter cartridges. As a base mr surfacer or tamiya fine primer from the spray can - light sanding of the primer coat before applying the lacquer paint and that works for me. For airbrushing metal finish AK xtreme metal anytime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookenbacher Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Vallejo is vary convenient and is water based, but can be finicky to airbrush. I think you may be happier with a bit more thinner, but every color is different. Like you, I like to build up my paint coat slowly, but this can lead to 'orange peel' where bits of atomized paint dry in the air before hitting the plastic. You can mitigate this with a little with more thinner, flow improver or some retarder, or wait for cooler more humid conditions to spray in. You could also go for a thicker 'wet' coat, but you run the risk of flooding the surface and getting runs and pooling, so it takes practice too. This dilemma is present for all paints, but is especially pronounced with water based acrylics like Vallejo. Here are a couple podcast episodes that may help if you have the time: https://www.plasticmodelmojo.com/754676/7474723-plastic-model-mojo-episode-30-dr-strangebrush https://www.plasticmodelmojo.com/754676/8475404-plastic-model-mojo-episode-37-return-of-dr-strangebrush 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev The Modeller Posted June 27, 2021 Share Posted June 27, 2021 (edited) Luc Take a look at these and my posts in them, what you're experiencing is very common. Here and Here Edited June 27, 2021 by Kev The Modeller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Brown Posted June 27, 2021 Share Posted June 27, 2021 Vallejo is really nice and smooth if used with W&N Flow Improver. It does need a good key though, or it can rub off until fully sealed. I avoid MRP as it's like gnats pee and doesn't cover well. I know that may raise a few hackles, just my own experience with a 1/35 tank. It's fine if airbrushed over a similar colour Tamiya (that's thinned with lacquer thinner). But then you may as well just use Tamiya.... Rick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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