Best Su-17/22

[MarcV]

Hi all,

 

Sorry if this is the wrong forum but any suggestions as to the best Su-17/22 kit (and suggestions as to where to post the question outside RM?).

 

Outside KittyHawk, I see SMER and Mister Fit, any ideas if these are any good?

 

Thanks.

 

 

[Mike]

1 hour ago, MarcV said:

Sorry if this is the wrong forum

If you could make the effort to familiarise yourself with the forum structure in future, I'll move this to the Cold War section.

[Giorgio N]

In 1/72 the very best is the Modelsvit kit, far superior to the competition. Not cheap but worth the money.

The Smer/Mistercraft/Master/ecc. kit is very basic, with almost no detail. The mould originated with Pantera, that sold the kit with PE parts. None of the reboxes include these.

The Bilek/Italeri kit is overall better than the Pantera clones, still nothing great though and far from a modern kit.

This if you want a Su-17 or 22, if you want a specific variant or a specific user the story is more complicated as not all manufacturers have covered all variants.

In 1/48 the Smer/KP/Mistercraft kit is useable but not particularly detailed, looks a bit like a large 1/72 kit.

Edited April 25, 2021 by Giorgio N

[Pin]

In 1/72 it is Modelsvit, others are simply not worth considering.

 

[John Masters]

10 minutes ago, Pin said:

n 1/72 it is Modelsvit, others are simply not worth considering.

 

Very true.

2 hours ago, MarcV said:

the best Su-17/22 kit

See above...I have done 'the research.'  The MisterKit is barely usable.

[Muzz]

I take it your talking about 1/48 kits seeing as you mentioned the Kitty Hawk kit? I have built the KP (which is the SMER boxing), Kitty Hawk and Hobby Boss UM version. I found the Kitty Hawk to be the best for me but you have the issue of needing to buy an AM shock cone to complete the intake assembly. As long as your careful with construction (I assembled the fuselage half’s before joining the two fuselage half’s together.) You won’t have any issues.

 

Muzz

[exdraken]

It would  suggest to add a bit more info to your wishlist...

Scale?

Operator?

Variant?

 

In 48th there is Kittyhawk and HobbyBoss with modern toolings.and then the Smer/ Kopro/ Kp kits

In 72nd, there is Modelsvit... and then long time nothing...

[RAGATIGER]

11 hours ago, Giorgio N said:

In 1/72 the very best is the Modelsvit kit, far superior to the competition. Not cheap but worth the money.

The Smer/Mistercraft/Master/ecc. kit is very basic, with almost no detail. The mould originated with Pantera, that sold the kit with PE parts. None of the reboxes include these.

The Bilek/Italeri kit is overall better than the Pantera clones, still nothing great though and far from a modern kit.

This if you want a Su-17 or 22, if you want a specific variant or a specific user the story is more complicated as not all manufacturers have covered all variants.

In 1/48 the Smer/KP/Mistercraft kit is useable but not particularly detailed, looks a bit like a large 1/72 kit.

 

Hi there

 

 

Let me say a bit of old Pantera/Mastercraft/Mistercraft kits there are let say early and late type. early type 1/72 scale they have as diference the nose intake, dorsal spine and of course the small canopy, they go good for Fitter C. D and F

 

Then we got the late type Su-22 M2, M3 and M4 

 

The rest of the kits are the same

 

You need for both kits Pavla Ejection seat SK-3 I think if memory don't fail me its a different from KM-1 or KM-36

 

In any case the original issue I hadn't the chance but got some etched parts from Jadar Hobbies brand PART really nice

 

Mastercraft included a leyend with a cuppon on its instructions for Serious modelers claiming for the Su-17 stencils so I send inside an envelope and received back those stencils but never been able to get any comprensive instructions on how to use them

 

Btw Bilek its the same Italeri kit a better kit but can say more as no have the Modelsvit kit

 

Regards

 

Armando 

 

 

[RidgeRunner]

Modelsvit - no doubt at all

18 hours ago, Pin said:

In 1/72 it is Modelsvit, others are simply not worth considering.

 

Agreed

[modelldoc]

The first of all Su-22 kits was from Hobbycraft.

The made a single and a two-seater.

Here is the single version with decals from Kanda:

(Build decades before)

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/21603181@N08/13383337333/in/photolist-moD6Vp

 

modelldoc

[Shorty84]

Hi @MarkV,

 

are you talking about all scales? From the companies you've mentioned I guess you talk about 1/48? In this case you have only the following choices:

 

• KP (reboxed by Smer/Eduard/MisterCraft/Karaya): The oldest of the lot. Based on inaccurate 4+ plans, not easy to build (lots of gaps on all joints), crude detailing. Best avoided.

 

• Kitty Hawk: Modern tooling but a typical KH kit, slightly overengineered which makes it a bit fiddly to build (e.g. the multipart fuselage halves). Has some well known issues (incorrect nosecone, curved belly, ...).

 

• Hobby Boss: Another new tool but unfortunately based on the same incorrect plans as the KP kit, therefore sharing similar shape issues. Main offenders are a too small windshield, incorrect fuselage cross-section (not round) and an engine nozzle which looks nothing like the real deal. Another thing is that the HB kit is 8mm shorter than the KH kit, making it somewhat "chubby" in comparison. The general level of detail is below the KH Fitter. Still, it is much simpler engineered than the KH kit and therefore much easier to build.

 

I have both the HB and KH kit and personally prefer the KH kit. It simply looks the most like the real deal when finished, although it is harder to build. In the end it depends on what is most important to you: shape or buildability.

 

Hope this helps!

 

 

Cheers

Markus

[MarcV]

markus and all, thanks that helps. indeed the intention is 1/48th and i guess the kh kit is the best option,

 

i also want to start on the eduard weekend edition 1/48 mig-21. that also appears to have its issues.

 

thanks all,

 

and apologies for caps on my keyboard crapping out on me

 

marc.

[Shorty84]

Hi Marc,

 

the Eduard MiG-21 kit is one of the nicest kits you can get. I don't think there is anything fundamentally wrong with it. Most issues seem to gravitate around the subtle differences between the MiG-21MF and MiG-21bis.

The most well known difference is the noseshape, which can be corrected with the resin part from CWS. Other differences are much less obvious and maybe only of interest if you are really deep into the subject. If interested I recommend this thread which shows a parallel build of an MF and a bis, explaining the differences. Ya-gabor has the advantage of having some MiGs in his backyard, so he knows more about them than I will ever forget: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/241176-eduard-mig-21-bis-and-mf-in-parallel/

 

Cheers

Markus

[RidgeRunner]

On 4/26/2021 at 6:35 PM, Shorty84 said:

Hi Marc,

 

the Eduard MiG-21 kit is one of the nicest kits you can get. I don't think there is anything fundamentally wrong with it. Most issues seem to gravitate around the subtle differences between the MiG-21MF and MiG-21bis.

The most well known difference is the noseshape, which can be corrected with the resin part from CWS. Other differences are much less obvious and maybe only of interest if you are really deep into the subject. If interested I recommend this thread which shows a parallel build of an MF and a bis, explaining the differences. Ya-gabor has the advantage of having some MiGs in his backyard, so he knows more about them than I will ever forget: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/241176-eduard-mig-21-bis-and-mf-in-parallel/

 

Cheers

Markus

Is this 1/72 you are talking about? 

[Shorty84]

4 hours ago, RidgeRunner said:

Is this 1/72 you are talking about? 

No, 1/48. As far as I know the bis-variant is not released yet in 1/72, so we will see if Eduard tweaks the moulds for this boxing or not.

[RidgeRunner]

9 hours ago, Shorty84 said:

No, 1/48. As far as I know the bis-variant is not released yet in 1/72, so we will see if Eduard tweaks the moulds for this boxing or not.

They have told me a definite “no”!!!!!

 

Martin

[Shorty84]

Doesn't surprise me to be honest. I still remember when they proudly proclaimed to honour the differences in noseshape between the MF and bis on the 1/48 kit only to proclaim the difference to be negligible some time later (guess the expense for modifying the tool "only slightly" for a single variant wasn't deemed economical).

[RidgeRunner]

They have told me that the SMT is next on their list with no bis in sight!

[RidgeRunner]

On 4/26/2021 at 6:35 PM, Shorty84 said:

Ya-gabor has the advantage of having some MiGs in his backyard, so he knows more about them than I will ever forget: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/241176-eduard-mig-21-bis-and-mf-in-parallel/

Ouch, my head is aching after reading through the superb and very comprehensive diffs dialogue by Gabor (@ya-Gabor, once of this forum). I need to write myself a summary but it looks like a MF to Bis conversion of the Eduard kit Is on my build list now!  

 

Martin

[Seawinder]

On 4/26/2021 at 1:13 PM, MarcV said:

markus and all, thanks that helps. indeed the intention is 1/48th and i guess the kh kit is the best option,

 

i also want to start on the eduard weekend edition 1/48 mig-21. that also appears to have its issues.

 

thanks all,

 

and apologies for caps on my keyboard crapping out on me

 

marc.

I built the Eduard 1/48 MiG-21 SMT and thoroughly enjoyed it. I used the Profipack and would recommend it (if cost is not prohibitive) because it supplies a multi-part PE cockpit that fits together remarkably well and IMHO really looks good. The only issue is there are a few small pieces that need to be painted to match the PE color (which is pretty good). I just saw a post somewhere with a recommended paint mix, but I can't find it.

[Shorty84]

A 50/50 mix of Gunze H25 (Sky Blue) and H46 (Emerald Green) seems to be a very good match for the Eduard PE: https://studiogekko.blogspot.com/2011/04/eduard-mig-21-cockpit-colour.html

 

Cheers

Markus