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A Couple of Gals - Two Revell B-17Gs


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Sorry, Ced - me again. 
 

If you wish to depict ‘Sleepy Time Gal’ accurately you’ll need to stagger the waist guns. The right waist was moved 

forward on later batch G models - the Revell kit has them opposite. You have the correct single-pane waist window supplied in the kit. 
 

For ‘Little Miss Mischief’ the Revell waist guns will be fine OOB as they were the opposite earlier set up - again use the single pane window as this was retrofitted after she had the ‘new’ rear fuselage fitted. 
 

Happy to help if you need/want more info. 
 

All the best,

Tom

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The large number of pieces requires laborious work, but that's it. These ("new") forts from Revell are great kits, the parts fit well and pose no problem. Easy.

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Good morning, CedB

 

I will follow your editing with great interest, because I am currently building ... two Flying Fortresses at 1 / 72 too.

I have already built seven B17s at 1/72, and I consider today that Revell model is one of the best, because it allows for a great opportunity for variations.

The most important thing is to have fun, unless you like to be in pain.

Revell parts are thin and well molded. The kit looks like a B17.  Tomprobert look over your shoulder and communicates his knowledge. That is fine with me, because I still have a lot to learn about the B17.

I actually build the Airfix model, and I made sub-assemblies before painting, because the parts are not clear, a little stuck. So I made a great preparation of parts.

The other is a Revell one.

 

It will be a bit difficult to represent "Sleepy Time gal" from 381BG with accuracy and starting with this Revell kit, because this airplane has staggered waist guns, as pointed out by tomprobert.

The staggered waist guns appeared from B17G-25-DL s/n 42-37989. "Sleepy" is a B17G-35-DL radiocall 42-107112. 

I will personally use the Academy model to represent it, although there are many things to review about this kit (eg: there are NO air intakes for oil cooler ). however this model has pre-marked cutout windows.

The tail turret is not a Cheyenne one, but Revell provides the good pieces ( 164, 166 and clear part 167).

 

Your work will be my motivation, and I am waiting for photos of the construction .

 

Regards,

Eric-Snafu35

 

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9 minutes ago, Snafu35 said:

and I am waiting for photos of the construction .

Be assured that you will not be the only one Eric   ;)

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Hello Ced. This is of course one for me. Or two? Call me in here. Should be fun. Nice start.

Cheers

Edited by bbudde
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Hi Ced,

 

You must be one of the most prolific builders on BM, I struggle to keep up - but it's always worth the effort!

 

Will be following as close as I can

 

All the best

 

Geoff

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On 30/03/2021 at 16:12, giemme said:

Not the typical Revell amount of flash, judging from your pics - good for you! 👍

 

Ciao

Looks good doesn't it? We shall see :)

 

On 30/03/2021 at 18:03, Brandy said:

This looks like fun - for us at least!

Carry on Ced, we're behind you all the way (at the bar, supping beer!)

 

Ian

Thanks Ian - I'll be pinching your wood effect method later so thanks for that too :)

 

On 30/03/2021 at 18:23, alt-92 said:

Not one, but two heavies!

Don't mind me, just taking notes from the back. 
 

Thanks alt :)

 

On 30/03/2021 at 19:41, rob85 said:

Nice Ced! I really wanted to build ‘sleepy time gal’ but went with ‘mah ideal’ as the airfix kit only supply’s the later rear gun (I mean it’s moulded and added separately they could have just thrown in the early turret!). I’m not familiar with the revell kit? Does it have the correct rear gunner? 
 

the transfers have it shown wrong by the way that’s what got me.

 

really looking forward to you building these! 
 

Rob

It looks like my plans will be fooled too Rob - see below :)

What does 'the correct turret' look like? Did you find any pictures please?

 

On 30/03/2021 at 20:38, Biggles87 said:

Two! That should take you at least three weeks. I’ll just sit at the back and try not to fidget or interrupt.

 

John

Thanks John :D

 

On 30/03/2021 at 21:42, tomprobert said:

Sorry, Ced - me again. 
 

If you wish to depict ‘Sleepy Time Gal’ accurately you’ll need to stagger the waist guns. The right waist was moved 

forward on later batch G models - the Revell kit has them opposite. You have the correct single-pane waist window supplied in the kit. 
 

For ‘Little Miss Mischief’ the Revell waist guns will be fine OOB as they were the opposite earlier set up - again use the single pane window as this was retrofitted after she had the ‘new’ rear fuselage fitted. 
 

Happy to help if you need/want more info. 
 

All the best,

Tom

Ah, thanks Tom. I've spoken to Jim about this - see below :)

 

On 30/03/2021 at 21:47, Convair said:

The large number of pieces requires laborious work, but that's it. These ("new") forts from Revell are great kits, the parts fit well and pose no problem. Easy.

A bit at a time Convair, that's the way to do it - I think! :)

 

On 31/03/2021 at 08:48, Snafu35 said:

Good morning, CedB

 

I will follow your editing with great interest, because I am currently building ... two Flying Fortresses at 1 / 72 too.

I have already built seven B17s at 1/72, and I consider today that Revell model is one of the best, because it allows for a great opportunity for variations.

The most important thing is to have fun, unless you like to be in pain.

Revell parts are thin and well molded. The kit looks like a B17.  Tomprobert look over your shoulder and communicates his knowledge. That is fine with me, because I still have a lot to learn about the B17.

I actually build the Airfix model, and I made sub-assemblies before painting, because the parts are not clear, a little stuck. So I made a great preparation of parts.

The other is a Revell one.

 

It will be a bit difficult to represent "Sleepy Time gal" from 381BG with accuracy and starting with this Revell kit, because this airplane has staggered waist guns, as pointed out by tomprobert.

The staggered waist guns appeared from B17G-25-DL s/n 42-37989. "Sleepy" is a B17G-35-DL radiocall 42-107112. 

I will personally use the Academy model to represent it, although there are many things to review about this kit (eg: there are NO air intakes for oil cooler ). however this model has pre-marked cutout windows.

The tail turret is not a Cheyenne one, but Revell provides the good pieces ( 164, 166 and clear part 167).

 

Your work will be my motivation, and I am waiting for photos of the construction .

 

Regards,

Eric-Snafu35

 

Thanks Eric, very useful information :)

 

On 31/03/2021 at 08:59, perdu said:

Be assured that you will not be the only one Eric   ;)

Thanks Bill :)

 

On 31/03/2021 at 12:46, bbudde said:

Hello Ced. This is of course one for me. Or two? Call me in here. Should be fun. Nice start.

Cheers

Cheers Ben :)

 

3 hours ago, Kitsticker said:

Hi Ced,

 

You must be one of the most prolific builders on BM, I struggle to keep up - but it's always worth the effort!

 

Will be following as close as I can

 

All the best

 

Geoff

Thanks Geoff :) Retired, so I have little else to do, usually!

 

 

So, discussions required. You can see the problem here:

 

51087508666_2bec569b5d_z.jpg

 

The starboard waist gun opening is too far back.

Rats.

I had considered cutting things up but the panel lines make it tricky.

Emailed Jim.

As Eric pointed out the Academy kit has you cut the opening in the appropriate location.

Jim responded saying that he has a Hasegawa kit with staggered windows:

 

51088334629_32a20e9e05_z.jpg

 

…and would I like him to send it to me? :frantic: :mental:

I've suggested we choose another scheme for the kit and I'll think about the Hase kit when I've finished these.

If I'm still sane…

 

Jim also replied "I shall consult the B17G Serial Number and Modification Oracle, (Cheyenne Tail Guns and unmodified Waist Gun Position)" and he'll find some suitable decals.

 

So, I can do the insides can't I?

Wood floors Tom says.

Ian posted his 1/72 wood effect method some time ago but I bookmarked it.

Looks good to me.

I also have some oils to try. Maybe.

On with the base:

 

51088256051_790e9a3364_z.jpg

 

Have I missed a bit? I think the bomb bay walkway is a black floor?

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That’s good news re the Hase kit, Ced. It’s fairly basic but not bad for its age. 
 

The newish Airfix kit would be ideal for the Fort you pictured - Cheyenne tail turret and staggered waist ‘comes as standard’ with their recent release. It’s the most accurate B-17 model out there in my opinion - a stunner!

 

Like the wood effect so far - don’t forget the black anti slip mats too. 

 

Tom

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Thanks Tom :) I'll be painting the mats in later - do you have any links to good (non-restored) reference shots please?

 

 

What's this?

 

51090064358_d827033c44_z.jpg

 

BIG tools! Don't worry, I'm attempting to repair Mrs B's mannequin thingie - the dowel broke:

 

51089595509_4ddb3e3df6_z.jpg

 

Brutal!

 

In more scale news, the 'leather' coat has been added to the 'wood':

 

51089839741_fff7c8bac0_z.jpg

 

Still wet but you'll see the effect later. I also tried some Gouache:

 

51090661095_30acffb611_z.jpg

 

Hmmm, we shall see.

 

Aluminium has been started:

 

51090689540_2467615f0f_z.jpg

 

I got some way through the bulkheads before I realised that I have no idea which bits will show so I think I'll wait until I start assembly - the wax dries pretty quickly.

 

'Olive drabish' added to the cockpit areas:

 

51089910741_ddffaa5bed_z.jpg

 

I don't think I'll have much time over the weekend so Happy Easter all and see you next week :) 

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Thanks John :) 

Still a coat of clear orange to do, soon.

 

The dressmaker's dummy is done though:

 

51091717563_39e9a0fb67_z.jpg

 

End of 1:1 modelling for a while!

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Here we go, Ced: https://inchhighguy.wordpress.com/2019/09/11/b-17-flying-fortress-interior-colors-part-i/amp/

 

Lots of great pictures and information here - this seems like a really accurate source of B-17 interior colours and certainly corresponds with all that I have found over the years. 
 

There is a mix of all models here - make sure you refer to the G-specific info! 
 

You’ll also see there’s not a spec of Interior Green in sight and the cockpit is the only area on the G models that has any type of paint - all other areas of the fuselage are bare aluminium. 
 

I hope that’s useful.

 

Tom

 

 

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Nice dummy work Ced, I perzooms the footwear in that space belongs to Madam B.

 

Although there is no accounting...

 

The B-17?

 

Of ziss I know nozzings...

 

But looks like a good start.

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Great start Ced. No body does wood more good. (Or was that Willie  rushton? 🤣)  Nice fix on the 1:1 scale too. Correct me if I’m wrong but are you priming things these days? Interiors etc. sometimes I can’t be bothered then the paint goes on and I remember why I need to. “Enquiring minds are the devils tea spoon”. Or something like that. 😀 

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6 hours ago, CedB said:

 

51091717563_39e9a0fb67_z.jpg

 

Bloomin 'eck Ced... does nothing survive with legs intact in your house?   

 

What was your excuse this time - wouldn't fit in the family limo?

 

(apologies for not being able to keep up recently. I'll try harder in future)

 

 

 

 

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CedB, I am going to follow along—along with some of the discussion topics on this thread which are a Britmodeller 1st for me 🤣 really impressed so far with your progress.  Really looking forward to how you will sort out plexi glass nose cone issue—the clear rim is a common pic at the Revell kit—I was not able to figure it out on my 1/72 Chow Hound—but if there is anyone who knows how to resolve this, it’s you—best, Erwin 

Edited by VT Red Sox Fan
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Hi Ced,

 

May I squeeze in somewhere?

 

I have the same kit sitting on my SOS about 1/3 done. I lost one half of the fuselage, which takes some doing (later found down the back of the stash). But not before I'd carefully painted the inside - interior Green!

 

On 3/30/2021 at 10:18 AM, tomprobert said:

Wartime B-17s were unpainted internally and the standard ‘interior green’ that so many B-17 modellers have used in the past was never, at any time, used in B-17 production.

 

You live and learn. I'll tag along and hopefully learn some more.

 

Best wishes for the B-17 production!

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Hendie beet me to it. There must be a big container chez Ced with nothing but legs in it!

 

Looking forward to seeing how the woodwork turns out

 

Ian

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Well, I'm here, I wasn't going to be, I mean, B-17Gs, I'm not interested in them, I've already got the Academy C/D & E to do in RAF finish & what do I need a -G for & I know if I follow this, before I know it I'll find I've a "need"?  Ced builds do that to me. :unsure:   Sooo, maybe I'll hang around for a bit. ;) :D

Steve.

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On 3/30/2021 at 10:18 PM, tomprobert said:

Wartime B-17s were unpainted internally and the standard ‘interior green’ that so many B-17 modellers have used in the past was never, at any time, used in B-17 production. There is some limited evidence that some Douglas-built B-17s had the radio room and parts of the rear fuselage painted too - however there is nothing definitive. 
 

The whole fuselage, from nose to tail, was left in natural aluminium. The only painted area was the flight deck and this was bronze green for exposed metal, and an olive drab-ish sound deadening material on the sidewalls. Floors were natural wood with black anti-slip matting. 

Did this apply to early model B-17 & if not, from when did it apply? Thanks.

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7 hours ago, stevehnz said:

 Sooo, maybe I'll hang around for a bit. ;) :D

Steve.

I'm at the bar, what you having?

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8 hours ago, stevehnz said:

Did this apply to early model B-17 & if not, from when did it apply? Thanks.

All B-17 models were devoid of interior paint - right from the prototype through to the final G to roll off the production line. 
 

Models up to mid-batch Fs had sound deadening in the nose cabin and radio room, but this was often removed in combat. This was dispensed with altogether from mid F batches onwards. 
 

Cockpits on all models were bronze green (or dark dull green) on exposed metal with olive green sound deadening material on the sidewalls - this remained until production finished. 
 

Interestingly, again up until mid-batch F model production it appears bomb bays were painted neutral grey, but I can’t pin down exact specifications for this. Memphis Belle, for example, had a grey bomb bay, but later Fs were aluminium. Confusingly, there are also numerous images of Bs, Cs, Ds, Es and and Fs with aluminium bays - therefore I conclude that there was much variation between manufacturing plants and batches!
 

Some Douglas-built F and early G models appear to have had their radio rooms painted, but again I can’t find specific productions blocks to confirm this. 

Do ask if you have a specific airframe in mind as I may be able to provide more accurate info for that particular model. 

Tom

 

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Ced that floor is looking nice, and sorry to hear you have bumped into the same issues I ended up with re scheme. Below is the picture you linked to. ‘Sleepy time gal’ is at the front of the formation VE-O
696zfhj.jpg
this is how she is shown on the decal sheet. 
XTruMJx.jpg

It’s shown with the more rounded Cheyenne turret.... but on closer inspection of the above picture.....

3r9vVFa.jpgit doesn’t have that! Now weather the decal manufacturers know something we don’t is another thing, but I couldn’t find a picture of it with a new shiny Cheyenne. One thing I will say is if you look at the tail number and letter they are a different size and shape to the decal sheet, so maybe they are working off different reference shot?

 

anyway all that is probably null and void if your doing a different scheme due to the staggering of the waist positions!

 

cheers

 

Rob

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