Hawker Hurricanes around the world

[ModelingEdmontonian]

This photo more-or-less sums up my work the last couple of days.

Clockwise from top left we have:

• Poland (AZ Mk I) where the work has focused on those darn exhausts. What you're seeing on there are the spare exhausts from my Fly Mk IIb kit. I ruined the original parts, so started again with these. In essence I cut off the inner half and glued what remained. In both cases the three stacks broke between the front two and last one, so they've been glued on in two pieces. At this point they look okay, but will need some filler and I'm really not sure how they'll end up looking, but moving ahead... Can't believe how much work and frustration exhaust stacks can create!
• Egypt (Legato Mk IIc) and Iran (Arma Mk IIc) with a few coats of midstone (Tamiya XF59) up top.  
• Soviet Union (AZ Mk IId) which is really part of the next phase has had the big parts assembled and is here because I was fiddling with the exhausts on this one to see how they were. Didn't want another case of having to figure these out after camo was on... Turns out working on these pre-emptively seems to pay off!

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

1 hour ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

Pledge that would be the same thing:

Thats what Ive been using forever, used to be called future here in the states. This is what my bottle looks like. 
 

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Pledge-Revive-It-Floor-Gloss-Restores-and-Protects-Sealed-Wood-Floors-1-Bottle-27-oz/15136693?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&wl13=1401&adid=22222222421449455996&wmlspartner=wmtlabs&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=501107745824&wl4=pla-293946777986&wl5=9021610&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=local&wl12=15136693&wl13=1401&veh=sem_LIA&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_-eGgJjo8AIVcG1vBB3qGQoiEAQYASABEgLF7_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Edited May 26, 2021 by Corsairfoxfouruncle

[dogsbody]

3 hours ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

I'm not sure we have Klear in Canada, but presumably there are similar products. Look like we have something called Pledge that would be the same thing: https://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/pledge-floor-wax-795-ml-0530350p.0530350.html#store=467.

 

Future, Pledge or Klear. It's all the same thing, an acrylic floor shine. Just different names at different times and places. There are probably other products with other names that would work just as well.

 

I've got this old bottle that I've had for awhile now:

 

 

 

 

 

Chris

[ModelingEdmontonian]

I never, ever want to do exhausts like this again, but I do think it is working. Here she is after some Perfect Plastic Putty was applied:

 

And now after that was cleaned up and the camo repainted.  Next step will be to (carefully) paint the stacks.

 

I received my stands in the mail today--I'll use these so that I can model two or three of the 'canes with wheels up. I assume I can use all three sized stands for my 1/72s; not clear how well they'll balance as I've never modeled anything on a stand before. Was going to do Belgium this way, but might be Kingdom of Yugoslavia now... either way they'll be for Airfix rag wings so that I can "hide" the erroneous four spoke wheels and also provide a bit of variety. That said, I'm not that committed to historical accuracy, so there probably will be some four spoke wheels where there shouldn't be.

 

Also, in opening the Fly Mk IIb kit to steal the exhaust stacks for Poland, I noted the instructions seem to suggest there should be a sticker or something for the IP, but I can't find such a thing. Do they just expect me to cut this out and paste it?

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

I should be getting back to modeling tonight, I will be starting the Greek Hurricane soon. Thanks again for the decals, I will tag you in the thread in case you were interested.  

[ModelingEdmontonian]

33 minutes ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I should be getting back to modeling tonight, I will be starting the Greek Hurricane soon. Thanks again for the decals, I will tag you in the thread in case you were interested.  

Awesome, sounds good! Looking forward to it, @Corsairfoxfouruncle!

[ModelingEdmontonian]

As Poland is rapidly progressing moving forward at a turtle's pace, I'm beginning to think about how to orient the Polish square insignia. I'm not even sure I know the vocabulary to talk about this intelligently, but I believe I've seen both red square top right and white square top right on the fuselage/fin sides so I want to get this correct.

 

Does the AZ guide reflect how it should be? To me, I would describe the fin as red square top right and the white square top right on the upper wings, and one each way on lower wings! So, I'm a bit skeptical this is correct, but hoping some brilliant minds can help me out!

 

On Arma's PZL P.11c guide the insignia is all oriented the same with white square top right (https://www.scalemates.com/products/img/6/8/3/1321683-10-instructions.pdf) so that's probably the way I'll go unless anyone tells me otherwise! 

[dogsbody]

Some marking intel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Air_Force_checkerboard

 

 

 

 

Chris

[ModelingEdmontonian]

4 minutes ago, dogsbody said:

Some marking intel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Air_Force_checkerboard

 

 

 

 

Chris

Awesome, thanks Chris! I believe that suggests a) it does matter; b) it should be consistent; c) AZ has made mistakes on the fin and port underwing; and d) Arma has it right! Interesting though that it switched in 1993!

[2996 Victor]

30 minutes ago, dogsbody said:

Some marking intel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Air_Force_checkerboard

 

 

 

 

Chris

Interesting, Chris, not only regarding the orientation but why it was changed in 1993 to conform with heraldic rules. Every day's a school day  

 

18 minutes ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

Awesome, thanks Chris! I believe that suggests a) it does matter; b) it should be consistent; c) AZ has made mistakes on the fin and port underwing; and d) Arma has it right! Interesting though that it switched in 1993!

Hi ME, I'd say AZ has got it a bit muddled and Arma has it correct. However, and I'm sure those more learned than I can confirm or correct, did not the chequerboard appear asymmetrically on the upper wings of Polish aircraft pre-War? I've often wondered why this should be, but I presume it was a trompe l'oeil to put off attacking enemy aircraft?

 

Cheers,

Mark

[ModelingEdmontonian]

1 minute ago, 2996 Victor said:

Hi ME, I'd say AZ has got it a bit muddled and Arma has it correct. However, and I'm sure those more learned than I can confirm or correct, did not the chequerboard appear asymmetrically on the upper wings of Polish aircraft pre-War? I've often wondered why this should be, but I presume it was a trompe l'oeil to put off attacking enemy aircraft?

I've read that as well, although I don't believe it seems to have been consistent from what I've seen, and I read someone speculating that it would be unlikely for these Polish Hurricanes to have insignia painted on asymmetrically out of a British factory, which made sense to me!

[2996 Victor]

16 minutes ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

I've read that as well, although I don't believe it seems to have been consistent from what I've seen, and I read someone speculating that it would be unlikely for these Polish Hurricanes to have insignia painted on asymmetrically out of a British factory, which made sense to me!

It would be interesting to find out if the positioning of the national markings was specified by a Polish Air Ministry directive. If so, I would presume that that would be issued to any manufacturer supplying aircraft to the Polish Air Force.

 

That being the case, if the asymmetrically-positioned markings were an Air Ministry specification, presumably the Hurricane would have been so marked.

 

All entirely hypothetical, of course!

 

Cheers,

Mark

[ModelingEdmontonian]

On 5/26/2021 at 4:30 PM, dogsbody said:

 

Future, Pledge or Klear. It's all the same thing, an acrylic floor shine. Just different names at different times and places. There are probably other products with other names that would work just as well.

 

I've got this old bottle that I've had for awhile now:

 

 

 

 

 

Chris

Can you brush future/klear/pledge? Picked up a bottle today. Looks thin and brushable, but don't want to ruin anything! I think some put this on canopies too?

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

10 minutes ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

Can you brush future/klear/pledge? Picked up a bottle today. Looks thin and brushable, but don't want to ruin anything! I think some put this on canopies too?

Yes thats what I do, I use a wide flat brush. The benefit is that it takes a little while to dry so self levels leaving none or minimal strokes. I used to spray it through my A/B but started having serious issues getting it cleaned before I could remove 100% of the residue. With canopies pour some into a glass jar and use tweezers to lower the canopy into it. Then use kitchen paper towel to wick the excess off the edges of the canopy. Once done place it into a clean box I use an old plastic cookie tub from the store. Let it dry in there for a few days in a low humidity environment to cure/harden the pledge. Ive been doing this for years and have never seen any fogging or yellowing on any canopies. Sometimes if the temperature drops while its wet you will get a white spot on the finish. Don't panic its easily fixed, hot water to soften and remove. Then reapply the pledge and let dry.  

[2996 Victor]

Is this the same stuff:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Johnson-Pledge-Beautify-It-Multi-Surface-Floor-Polish-750ml-Long-Lasting-Shine-/361619671188?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286

 

Thanks, and apologies ME for a thread hijack.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[ModelingEdmontonian]

On 5/29/2021 at 3:16 AM, 2996 Victor said:

Is this the same stuff:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Johnson-Pledge-Beautify-It-Multi-Surface-Floor-Polish-750ml-Long-Lasting-Shine-/361619671188?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286

 

Thanks, and apologies ME for a thread hijack.

 

Cheers,

Mark

Don't apologize, Mark, sorry for the delay in responding. Beautiful weather here so was spending a lot of time outside and less time in front of my computer  

 

Here is what mine looks like if it helps! Looks like the same thing, although interesting to see the difference in label (floor polish vs. floor gloss).

 

[ModelingEdmontonian]

On 5/28/2021 at 8:53 PM, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Yes thats what I do, I use a wide flat brush. The benefit is that it takes a little while to dry so self levels leaving none or minimal strokes. I used to spray it through my A/B but started having serious issues getting it cleaned before I could remove 100% of the residue. With canopies pour some into a glass jar and use tweezers to lower the canopy into it. Then use kitchen paper towel to wick the excess off the edges of the canopy. Once done place it into a clean box I use an old plastic cookie tub from the store. Let it dry in there for a few days in a low humidity environment to cure/harden the pledge. Ive been doing this for years and have never seen any fogging or yellowing on any canopies. Sometimes if the temperature drops while its wet you will get a white spot on the finish. Don't panic its easily fixed, hot water to soften and remove. Then reapply the pledge and let dry.  

Thanks, @Corsairfoxfouruncle! My wife took the plunge and started brushing some on her kit last night. 

 

What are the advantages to applying it to canopies? I assume you do it prior to painting?

 

Does it take a few days to dry in all cases? 

[2996 Victor]

1 minute ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

Beautiful weather here so was spending a lot of time outside and less time in front of my computer  

Hi ME,

 

Me too (no modelling at all this weekend! ) but it's great to get outside and enjoy some decent weather!

 

I'm thinking I'll get a bottle of the stuff and give it a go!

 

Cheers,

Mark

[ModelingEdmontonian]

I got some gunmetal onto Poland's exhaust stacks and honestly this seems to be working out better than I hoped!

 

I (mostly) finished touching up the upper camo and took off the masking underneath. I was using the underside pieces from the Eduard Hurricane mask set I bought. I haven't bothered using it on top, but I am quite impressed with how well it worked underneath--nice and crisp! I am TERRIBLE at masking (try not to anytime I can, because when I have to it never seems to work well!), so nice to have it work out for once!

 

Getting close to UC install. I'm using an Airfix rear wheel on this AZ kit, and had to drill that hole bigger. Meanwhile 5-spoke wheels needed some black, so may as well blast some other wheels/props/gun sights at the same time.

[ModelingEdmontonian]

11 minutes ago, 2996 Victor said:

Hi ME,

 

Me too (no modelling at all this weekend! ) but it's great to get outside and enjoy some decent weather!

 

I'm thinking I'll get a bottle of the stuff and give it a go!

 

Cheers,

Mark

I still got to the modelling bench, but stayed away from the computer desk! Probably healthier all around to be outdoors though!

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

3 hours ago, ModelingEdmontonian said:

Thanks, @Corsairfoxfouruncle! My wife took the plunge and started brushing some on her kit last night. 

 

What are the advantages to applying it to canopies? I assume you do it prior to painting?

 

Does it take a few days to dry in all cases? 

It makes the canopy much clearer, how I'm not exactly sure. Probably by removing/filling in blemishes. You can sand blemishes out with fine sanding sticks and this will restore clarity as well. Ive actually dipped canopies both ways dip first then paint, or paint then dip. It doesn't effect the paint assuming the paint is cured. Ive also found a dipped canopy is less prone to fogging when glued in place, I currently use Tamiya extra thin on canopies but have used gel superglue to spot glue canopies and have had no fogging after dipping them.
       Drying relies on ambient humidity and temperature, the warmer and drier a room is the quicker it will dry. I usually give it 2-3 days in the drying box in my house. I forget to add that i use cut lengths of sprue to rest the canopies on so the touch a minimum of surface while drying. The pledge can act like a glue if it adheres to something. Not hard to break the connection if it happens but best to avoid it if possible. 

[Troy Smith]

16 minutes ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

It makes the canopy much clearer, how I'm not exactly sure. Probably by removing/filling in blemishes.

as Kleer/Pedge etc is self levelling, it makes for a smoother surface, and, as you surmise,  this means 'filling/levelling' the clear parts, so they become smoother, and thus optically  clearer    Anyway,  the point is, it works. 

 

18 minutes ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I currently use Tamiya extra thin on canopies but have used gel superglue to spot glue canopies and have had no fogging after dipping them.

Unless you really need a strong joint, high grade woodworking PVA works well,  I use a 5 minute fast grab waterproof  PVA, but I already had it for woodworking jobs.   Can also be used to fill the gaps.  Microscale Krital Kleer is basically posh PVA which perhaps dried clearer thanstndard PVA.

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

15 minutes ago, Troy Smith said:

Unless you really need a strong joint, high grade woodworking PVA works well,  I use a 5 minute fast grab waterproof  PVA, but I already had it for woodworking jobs.   Can also be used to fill the gaps.  Microscale Krital Kleer is basically posh PVA which perhaps dried clearer thanstndard PVA.

Ive tried PVA several times only to have the canopy pop off a few days later. I don't know why but the PVA’s/white glues I've worked with just don't do anything for plastic. Maybe its a different formula (doubtful), maybe its not available here (possible). Ive used PVA for gap filling but the paint keeps it in place after the fact. 

[Troy Smith]

19 minutes ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

I don't know why but the PVA’s/white glues I've worked with just don't do anything for plastic.

Hmm, I have used it over paint. Maybe that's the difference, it stick better to the paint.   It's not a really strong bond,  but I have a vac canopy on Morkomorane that's been in a box for years and that's still stuck.

But, it is high quality strong woodworking glue, and you can certainly get these in the USA, a look on Amazon turns up this for example

https://www.amazon.com/Elmers-E7310-Carpenters-Interior-Exterior/dp/B0045PXPH6

  Maybe worth giving a go if you end up with some from DIY,  I used it because I need it to fix stuff around house.   There may well be better products, and as my sig line says... what works for you is the 'right' product.

 

@ModelingEdmontonian regarding the mug warmer, perhaps you could ask to try it out for decals, to see if it helps, as I presumby now rapidly cooling coffee is not a major issue, unless there is overly efficient aircon, and if so get one.  I only mentioned using the coffe machin hot plate as it seemed a way to keep my decal water hot.

 

I often use what I have around the house anyway, like the PVA, or duct tape.  i was using my cordless drill with abit of bent copper wire to stir paint, but mainly as I can't remember where I put my pendulum jigsaw, whic I was going to try as a paint shaker....   always worth thinking laterally.

[dogsbody]

1 hour ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Ive tried PVA several times only to have the canopy pop off a few days later. I don't know why but the PVA’s/white glues I've worked with just don't do anything for plastic. Maybe its a different formula (doubtful), maybe its not available here (possible). Ive used PVA for gap filling but the paint keeps it in place after the fact. 

 

 

Have you been using Elmers School Glue? The stuff they give to pre-schoolers to stick paper together?

 

 

 

Chris