Bozothenutter Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 Inspired by the ' the Grand Duke' comics, I want to build a Dora in the main characters scheme. As you can see there is a lot going on in this scheme and I'm not really up to speed on late war ('44-'45) Luftwaffe camo. Using some sites with RLM colours on I came to this: Wings top: RLM 81 Brunviolett RLM 75 Grauviolett Wings bottom: RLM 79 Sandgelb Aluminium Fuselage top: RLM 81 Brunviolett RLM 80 Olivgrun Fuselage sides: RLM 05 Elfenbein RLM 81 Brunviolett RLM 80 Olivgrun Fuselage bottom: RLM 05 Elfenbein RLM 78 Hellblau Does this correspond to any actual scheme? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werdna Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 Fuselage sides look like RLM '84' (aka 76b etc), upper fuselage maybe 81/82, wing uppers maybe RLM81 and 75 (or some might say 76). Not familiar with any Dora scheme which calls for RLM79 on the underwing surfaces. Typically, the front third of the lower wing was just a wrap around of one of the upper wing camo colours, like 81. The scheme appears broadly similar to some of the renditions of 'Blue 12' - which is well documented and for which there are colour pics and cine footage available. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tempestfan Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 The head-on picture suggests the front underside wing colour is indeed 81 wrapped around. The lower cowling possibly is meant to be 76, though it looks quite blue, and the underwing picture suggests so is the rear wing half. The yellowish/ivory tone on the fuselage sides and lower rear may be meant to be 02, which I think was also used as primer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 And why not build it in this scheme? Enjoy yourself. That is some lovely artwork BTW. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 23, 2021 Author Share Posted February 23, 2021 Been fruitlessly clicking through scalemates looking for a white '9' (or six) without a black outline. While US and UK generic numbers are freely available, Luftwaffe less so, no decals, stencils, nothing really... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 15 minutes ago, Bozothenutter said: Been fruitlessly clicking through scalemates looking for a white '9' (or six) without a black outline. While US and UK generic numbers are freely available, Luftwaffe less so, no decals, stencils, nothing really... Fantasy Printshop does a full range of Luftwaffe numbers and letters, in every style, size and colour 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 24, 2021 Author Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, Black Knight said: Fantasy Printshop does a full range of Luftwaffe numbers and letters, in every style, size and colour Thanks for that, apparently they are not indexed by Scalemates. edit Hmmm, no German numbers in 48th....they have Romanian though edit2 nevermind, they are under the 72th header..... edit3 curiouser and curiouser....they do letters in colours, but numbers only in black? Edited February 24, 2021 by Bozothenutter 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 That looks like an interesting and fun project. I've never seen the comic but I do like the artwork that you have posted. I would be going with RLM 81 dunkelbrun and RLM77 dunkelgrau for the top of the wings with the 81 wrapping around the leading edge. The power egg in RLM76 graublau lower (I don't think it looks too blue) and RLM82 olivgrun on top with the 'buff' coloured strip in between being the "RLM84" hellgrunblau late war oddity (which Mr Paint do 2 versions of). Under wings would be RLM81 for leading edge, natural metal for centre section and flaps with the ailerons in RLM76. For the fuselage aft of the power egg I'd go with RLM81 over the hellgrunblau but if you want to replicate the artwork as you see it use a buff colour. I suspect the artist is well aware that the buff colour was a non standard so is using his artistic licence on that. I've used the names and designations as per the colour chip chart from the Merrick/Kirroff Classic Colours book for clarity sake. Fantasy Printshop did do the complete range of number and outline decals as I have them so maybe they are just between prints at the moment? It's probably worth emailing to ask them if they intend doing another run of them soon. I look forward to seeing how you get on with this fun project. Duncan B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SafetyDad Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 +1 with @Duncan B's take on the colours - logically and clearly explained. @Werdna's comparison of this scheme to that of Blue 12 is a good one. There's a growing understanding now that RLM 77 pale grey may well have seen wider use than was previously thought as an upper wing colour. David Brown in Canada (whom I think may post here but I'm not certain) has an e publication covering this - very convincing in my view. SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SafetyDad Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 Bozo - there's also a Ta152H in a similar black-tailed scheme in the 'Grand Duc' series - might make a nice pair? SD 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 24, 2021 Author Share Posted February 24, 2021 12 minutes ago, SafetyDad said: Bozo - there's also a Ta152H in a similar black-tailed scheme in the 'Grand Duc' series - might make a nice pair? SD don't....dooooont!!!!😉 my Ta-152 will be standard fare, but I might do one of Lilya's planes maybe the P-39 from the same volume. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 24, 2021 Author Share Posted February 24, 2021 what with her being Russian, it should be the La-5FN really....... the one she chopped the tail off the He-219 with. now look what you did! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLinevitch Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 (edited) In the Second World War, Soviet aviation did not use yellow RIE (rapid identification elements), because yellow RIE's were used by the Luftwaffe. The only exception, yellow was used as squadron markings in aircraft numbers (red, blue, yellow). If we take the last picture, then the plane also has an absurd type of camouflage. Edited February 25, 2021 by DLinevitch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 They look like a fun series of comics. Duncan B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share Posted February 25, 2021 16 minutes ago, DLinevitch said: In the Second World War, Soviet aviation did not use yellow RIE (rapid identification elements), because yellow RIE's were used by the Luftwaffe. The only exception, yellow was used as squadron markings in aircraft numbers (red, blue, yellow). If we take the last picture, then the plane also has an absurd type of camouflage. But she chopped the tail off a He 219 because her guns froze! Who cares about absurdity? I bet that squadron didn't exist either....😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDriskill Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 (edited) On 2/23/2021 at 2:23 PM, Werdna said: Fuselage sides look like RLM '84' (aka 76b etc), upper fuselage maybe 81/82, wing uppers maybe RLM81 and 75 (or some might say 76). Not familiar with any Dora scheme which calls for RLM79 on the underwing surfaces. Typically, the front third of the lower wing was just a wrap around of one of the upper wing camo colours, like 81. The scheme appears broadly similar to some of the renditions of 'Blue 12' - which is well documented and for which there are colour pics and cine footage available. For whatever my opinion is worth: I agree 100% with Werdna's color choices. Per JaPo's books on the Dora, on many wings it seems that the darker upper camo color was actually applied first to the whole top surface, and wrapped around the leading edge, possibly in part to help check the finish smoothness of the front portion of the skinning. The lighter upper color was applied on top of this later. Several possibilities have been discussed for this lighter upper wing color: a late pale version of 75; 76; 77 (a pale bluish gray previously used for markings); or another light gray of unknown provenance - possibly mixed from other colors. Pure speculation on my part, but I wonder if the so-called "84" green-gray would not have made sense for this. In the new second edition of Valiant's Fw 190D / Ta 152 book, Steve Evans built the 1/48 Zoukei-Mura Ta 152H in "Grand Duke" colors! Makes a great-looking model. Edited February 25, 2021 by MDriskill 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share Posted February 25, 2021 found number and letter airbrush templates with Solidscale...😃 48 minutes ago, MDriskill said: In the new second edition of Valiant's Fw 190D / Ta 152 book, Steve Evans built the 1/48 Zoukei-Mura Ta 152H in "Grand Duke" colors! Makes a great-looking model. Cool!, I have them on the way too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDriskill Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 (edited) 23 hours ago, Bozothenutter said: found number and letter airbrush templates with Solidscale...😃 Cool!, I have them on the way too! I am generally not one for made-up schemes...but gotta say the all-black tail is rather fetching! Plus, it neatly solves the ugly little explaining-the-hakenkreuz issue that models of WW2 German aircraft can present. To me, much of the comic art's appeal is the careful attention to correctness in the rest of the scheme. If you have access to either the JaPo or Eagle Editions books on the Dora, the artist has closely followed the schemes used by Mimetall (MME)-built aircraft with serials in the 50xxxx range, which include "Blue 12" as mentioned already. Edited February 26, 2021 by MDriskill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 26, 2021 Author Share Posted February 26, 2021 Small bump, my go to store in Germany didn't have the Eduard kit they advertised, when I pointed out the Revell kit they did have, they packed that instead and refunded the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tempestfan Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 I wasn't aware machine guns is "mitrailleurs" in Dutch, when Dutch generally is quite similar to German in many cases. Live and learn. --- Does your go-to store happen to be at Frankfurt/Oder, by any chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truro Model Builder Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 Superb artwork. Build what you like as you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozothenutter Posted February 26, 2021 Author Share Posted February 26, 2021 (edited) 12 hours ago, tempestfan said: I wasn't aware machine guns is "mitrailleurs" in Dutch, when Dutch generally is quite similar to German in many cases. Live and learn. --- Does your go-to store happen to be at Frankfurt/Oder, by any chance? Tbh, that is a bit of an old fashioned word, nowadays we use the much more German sounding 'maschinegeweer' ( might have been Flemish translator) My go to shops are Sockelshop and Modellbau König, no idea where they are really. What shop is in Frankfurt? Edited February 26, 2021 by Bozothenutter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAG Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 On 2/23/2021 at 6:44 PM, Bozothenutter said: Been fruitlessly clicking through scalemates looking for a white '9' (or six) without a black outline. While US and UK generic numbers are freely available, Luftwaffe less so, no decals, stencils, nothing really... FCM Decals from Brazil have a Luftwaffe numbers sheet without outlines, here's a link: http://www.fcm.eti.br/48.html You have to scroll down a bit, it's sheet number FCM48024. Assuming you're building in 1/48, of course. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 That comic looks rather cool. Is it available in English? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tempestfan Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 On 2/27/2021 at 12:32 AM, Bozothenutter said: Tbh, that is a bit of an old fashioned word, nowadays we use the much more German sounding 'maschinegeweer' ( might have been Flemish translator) My go to shops are Sockelshop and Modellbau König, no idea where they are really. What shop is in Frankfurt? König is at Delmenhorst I think - I bought from Sockelshop at Lingen last time around, but do not know where their shop is. MTL Onlinehandel is at Frankfurt, he has great prizes on e.g. Czech kits. If you happen to come to Lingen - provided it happens - let's meet for a coffee and a chat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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