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Metal rigging query.


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Hello chaps and chapesses,

Just building up my stamina 🏋️‍♂️ to undertake building the WNW Sopwith Camel. The rigging is worrying me a tad.  :blink: I've used plenty of stretched sprue in the past but something of this standard requires that "little bit" more. I've found EZ line frustrating to use on biplanes and using droplets of super glue has been a "hit and miss" affair for me.

So...............................................

I'm considering using the AIMS metal rigging set. Would you recommend this and can it be affixed with white glue rather than super glue. Comments, thoughts, suggestions really appreciated. 

Cheers all 😃

Paul (AKA Bertie)

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Hi Paul, well, you have kind of opened a can of worms here. Let me try to explain, and I am sure (also hope) others will chime in too. First off, PE or rather Photo Etch metal, rigging wires can be rather fickle things. Yes, they look really good. yes, they are of the right profile when made right....buuuuttttt.......they are rigid. THAT creates issues. The fact is that plastic expands and contracts rather a lot ( engineering wise) with temperature. Yeah, so what? you say. Well, the PE wires do so  much slower and at less distance. Which means that the wires bend and twist as the plastic moves. So.....what needs to be done is some way of making the end joints move to allow for the different expansion rates. To my knowledge the ultimate method has yet to be invented. Which is why almost everyone uses elastic thread or fishing line under tension. 

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The best/easiest meathod I have found so far when using EZ line is to cut the line about 2/3 the distance needed, super glue one end in, then place a TINY drop of glue at the other anchor point and dip the end of the thread into a pool of Zap Kicker then stretch across and touch it to the anchor point. It sets instantly.  Hope this helps, Regards, Pete in RI

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Personally, I am not a fan of white glue.Have never been able to make it work for me ( probably due to impatience with it's setting time). I feel there are better, more practical options out there.

Edited by europapete
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Actually, re -reading your post, you have a point regarding stretched sprue. If you have some(or can get) the old Contrail airfoil sectioned plastic strips or something similar, then when you stretch it as in the old school meathod it retains it's section as it stretches. Now this works great for 1/72 and 1/48 ' planes, but I have never tried it on 1/32. The span may be too great and the line may sag. All I can say is build a test rig and try it.

 

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Thanks for all your replies. Clearly rigging poses challenges , in some form, for all of us. Somehow I find this reassuring. All your input is gratefully acknowledge:clap2:

At a personal level I find,as a result of my eyesight diminishing as a result of  aging , the use of EZ line (and similar) rather difficult to use (despite the use of multiple magnifying devices.:drunk:. As I'm doing the Camel in 1/32 scale the use of turnbuckles may be in order as well..

Just goes to show that after 60 years of "hack" modelling it's never too late to learn. :giggle:

 

 

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5 hours ago, europapete said:

If you have some(or can get) the old Contrail airfoil sectioned plastic strips or something similar, then when you stretch it as in the old school meathod it retains it's section as it stretches.

Or you can sand any sprue to the required shape then stretch

 

5 hours ago, europapete said:

The span may be too great and the line may sag.

But you can use the hot blade/screwdriver to shrink it taught once attached. In fact I do this with all my stretched sprue (eg. antennas). Rather than trying to glue the sprue taught, I glue it slightly slack (which is a lot easier) then heat up an old screwdriver over a candle flame then hold it near (but not on!) the sprue. The plastic shrinks and tightens the line. Easy enough for an antenna line, but would need a steady hand when working with complex rigging.

 

Cheers

 

Colin

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2 hours ago, europapete said:

Also don't forget, the Camel did not have turnbuckles on the wings, it used RAF wires. Buckles only for control wires and tail.

Saved by the bell. I was about to post this but risk sounding even more like a cracked record than normal. I think Gaspatch do actually produce something that looks like a RAFwire anchor point, but I've never used them.

 

Paul.

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Gaspatch do have a product under their turnbuckle section for flat wires,  labelled as Late RAF style:

 

41ZQoAsnPxL._AC_SX425_.jpg

 

Now some may think the flat section is representing the wire portion of the rigging, but no.  Looking at photos, the flat portion actually inserts into the aircraft surface. 

 

175-16.jpg

 

175-8.jpg

 

 

This raises another problem of how to attach the wire to this piece as there is very little mating surface area.  I think a good method to ensure some strength, would be slide a hollow brass tube over the rounded stem.  Now you have a 'hollow' to insert your wire of choice.  You could sand the stem a bit to decrease the diameter slightly to allow for a smaller diameter tube to keep things closer to scale.

 

26181710197_2724b07335_b.jpg

 

regards,

Jack

Edited by JackG
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Hhmmmm........so, what if we use the above method with the Gaspatch ends, the tube, and then slot in the PE RAF wire with no glue at the lower end, and glue it at the other, top, end. Then we will have the needed movement allowed so the PE wires don't distort.  Right!, I am off to experiment. I have the Gaspatch ends and some RB RAF wires in stock, not sure about really small tubing though.  Regards, Pete in RI

Edited by europapete
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I can see the merit of attaching 'floating' end  pieces inside the tube.

 

Just a thought, but wonder if rubber cement would be of some use here to account for any shifting of seasonal room temperatures?  Curing time will be an issue, so not sure at which points it best be applied.

 

regards,

Jack

Edited by JackG
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Hello once again. Some great comments and insights have kept coming in. Thanks so much. As I originally said I was dreading the rigging but the convo has stimulated my mojo! I've just had a resin seat and appropriate cockpit harness safely delivered courtesy of Australia post. The excitement is building! :penguin:

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How many pics of useless p/e rigging would you like to see?

IMG-4527.jpg

IMG-4525.jpg

IMG-4526.jpg

As a custom fabricator of 45 years experience I am able to understand and execute procedures to the best end possible.

This is not possible; after 3 weeks of trying and ending up with the same result.

1/32 Biff.

Rigged in 3 days after clearing off the mess left by the previous effort.

IMG-4830.jpg

Prym is available , cheap , gives the closest profile to RAF flying wires and can be successfully completed without wasting time.

IMG-4612.jpg

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Be careful!

Do not spend tooo much money!

If you use aftermarket ptoducts, you need for a WNW biplane each approx. 120 eyelets.

I make them by myself! All the rigging process step by step I posted in this forum.

My procedure I found out together in discussion with the man who started WW1aircraftmodels.

My wife used Gaspatch, but she was not happy with them, a big hole in the wallet was the only memory.

 

  • We use AlbinAloy tubes in a certain lenght.
  • The thin copper wire is acheap online product for 3 or 5 Euros.
  • The monofil rope costs also a few Euros.

 

Happy modelling

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