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Wellington Mk.IV questions - P&W powered


Rabbit Leader

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All, 

I’ve been playing around with the Matchbox Wellington of late, however have now cast my eyes on ‘possibly’ converting the new tooled Airfix Mk.1c into an Aussie crewed Mk.IV. My research has uncovered that these 220 Wellington examples were powered by P&W 1830 Twin Wasps and Curtiss Electric C53D2-16 propellers. Now I’m sure I can source these popular engines from a DC-3 kit, however I know little about the props - although they kinda look like something you’d find strapped to a Wildcat? The exhaust layout is also a tad odd with what appear to be twin extractors from each engine. Any additional information and a possible suggestion as to what props I could use would be much appreciated. Here’s an image I’ve found online. 
 

Cheers and regards.. Dave 

 

50875288023_ee23062368_b.jpg

 

 

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Dave, I think the  Martin 167 Maryland used the same Curtiss Electric prop. The 187 Baltimore used Hamilton Standards, so those won't work. P-40's used CE props, but the diameter would more than likely be  smaller. I would think any props of the correct diameter and rotation would work- you would just to need to cobble up the distinctive pointed hub found on the Curtiss Electric prop. Maybe, just maybe, the R-1830 powered Beauforts that used CE props  might supply what you need for your Wimpy, but I'm thinking the blades wouldn't be as long for a Wimpy. The blades in the photo you posted sure look like DH blades to me, but those are clearly Curtiss Electric hubs. The R-1830 rotated in the opposite direction from the British radials. Not much help, I'm afraid!

Mike

Edited by 72modeler
added text, corrected spelling
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Hi 

    If you are buying a kit for the engines why not buy this 

 

 

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/mpm-production-72555-vickers-wellington-mkiv--102049

 

 

And get some decals as well 

    Cheers 

      Jerry

Edited by brewerjerry
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Thanks Mike and Jerry. Well I already have the Airfix kit, although do have plans on getting another to make a Mk.1c or even an VIII. Perhaps it’s wise to invest In this MPM kit after all, although something tells me it won’t be as easy a build or as detailed as the new tooled Airfix job. I’m still procrastinating things, so will keep looking into it. 
Cheers.. Dave 
 

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Looking at the spruemap for the Revell Merlin Wellington,

It's got 6 unused props (4 different engines?), and some unused engine parts and cowlings.  And spare stabiliser.

I'll have to open the kit, and consult the book,  to see just what's for which versions.

Vickers-Wellington.jpg

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That’s very interesting Tim @theplasticsurgeon, so many parts on offer which is always nice to see. Great price on that Haynes book as well. I keep reading about your local bargains and am always envious at the good deals you UK folk can usually find. 
Cheers.. Dave 

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2 hours ago, theplasticsurgeon said:

Looking at the spruemap for the Revell Merlin Wellington,

It's got 6 unused props (4 different engines?), and some unused engine parts and cowlings.  And spare stabiliser.

I'll have to open the kit, and consult the book,  to see just what's for which versions.

 

Looking at Scalemates the Revell kit is based on the MPM one - hence all the spare bits for different versions.

 

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/revell-04903-vickers-wellington-mkii--629429

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Well so far from the book:

Pegasus                   Left-hand tractor prop                       12'6"diameter

Hercules                  Left-hand tractor prop                       12'6"diameter

Merlin                      Right-hand tractor prop                    12'9"diameter

Twin Wasp               Right-hand tractor Curtiss electric     12'3"diameter

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Much bigger than any Wildcat prop. A C-47 prop, incidentally, is 11'6", some say 11'6 and a bit.  The C-47's engines are pretty narrowly spaced and the prop tips close to the fuselage which limits prop size (and thereby some aspects of performance) but does make it easier to wrangle in the single-engined case. B-17 props are about 11'7" so they're a bit undernourished for a Wellington too. A-20 / Boston props are also too small at 11'3"

 

A-26 props are 12"7' so the right size, though you would need to make the tips a little pointier as well as the hub (not hard though, glue on a little bit of sprue and file it down)

 

The other source, if you are up for some trimming and blade reshaping, is a 13"1' Hellcat prop. I've done this kind of work and it's really not that hard providing you are handy with your files and wet & dry. 

Edited by Work In Progress
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15 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said:

Thanks Mike and Jerry. Well I already have the Airfix kit, although do have plans on getting another to make a Mk.1c or even an VIII. Perhaps it’s wise to invest In this MPM kit after all, although something tells me it won’t be as easy a build or as detailed as the new tooled Airfix job. I’m still procrastinating things, so will keep looking into it. 
Cheers.. Dave 
 

Hi 

     If you are like me you will assemble all the necessary parts and start building 

   Then someone releases a kit 

     In this case an airfix Mk IV 

       Cheers 

         Jerry 

 

 

 

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Just had a look inside my MPM Wellington IV. Yes there are 8 props, only 3 sets of engines, though. R-1830s , as advertised, quite decent representations and some, I presume. Hercules for their Mk.10. Cowlings look alright. The 4 engine exhausts are not identical. Three of them look like the starboard outer in  the photo above, but their port outer is different. (Hangover from the MK.I ?). Also one of their decal options, Z1392/UV-G is supposed to have spinners, which makes the Curtiss Electric props question moot.

Edited by dalea
can't tell left from right
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Thanks to all of you for the additional information and keeping this thread ticking over. Now @dalea are you saying that the MPM kit is missing one proper exhaust? That’s a shame if that’s the case. I’m also wondering if the spinner equipped props were Hamilton Standard units? My references say that these were replaced by Curtiss Electric propellers in an effort to reduce cabin noise at high revs. Having said that, I cannot seem to find any photos of this mark Wellington with spinners installed. 
 

Now I’ve just been looking at other Wellington IV / 460 squadron images and some show the starboard rectangle nose window (blanked over) whist other photos show no evidence that this window existed? I was also surprised to see that UV:T (last photo) still has the early two gun FN5 rear turret, were I thought the Mk. IV was equipped with the latter four gun FN20? There’s definitely quite a few differences in what was a relatively small production batch of only 220 examples. 
Cheers.. Dave 

 

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50880502857_c8730b354c_b.jpg

 

 

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Instructions for the MPM Mk.IV can be found here https://www.super-hobby.com/products/Wellington-Mk.IV-R-1830-Engines.html#gallery_start if it helps to understand the fit of exhausts. It suggests that 3 of the pipes are completed using supplied resin "hedgehog" extensions.

 

Clive.

Edited by dad's lad
incorrect info
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