Kfir 905 Equador Air Force

[Piet van Schalkwyk]

On 10 February 1995, Cap Wilfrido Moya, flying Kfir C2 90, shot down the Peruvian AT-37B, flown by Lt Col Valladeres, using a Shafrir Mk II missile.  I would appreciate any assistance by any of the forum members on the configuration of the Kfir at the time.  I understand that the aircraft carried the two Shafrir missiles and had the two 30mm Defa cannons armed.  I would appreciate any input on the carriage of any underwing droptanks or a belly tank and the associated pylons.  

 

Thanks in advance and Best Greetings of the Season to all members,

Regards,

Piet

[dov]

Take a look.

Just an Israeli Kfir. 

You have some sorts of tank: Supersonic and Subsonic. Centerline and wingtanks. Whatever your Kfir carried, no idsea.

Maximum all config as an Israeli Kfir.

Happy modelling

 

 

[Shorty84]

Hi @Piet van Schalkwyk,

 

although I cannot give you a bulletproof answer I've read the Article about the Cenepa War on the (now defunct) Acig.org site and it seems that apart from the two Shafrir Mk II missiles the Kfirs didn't carry anything else. Drop tanks seem unlikely as the Kfirs were stationed near the frontline: https://archive.is/lcsu0

 

Maybe @Tom Cooper can help on this specific question?

 

 

Cheers

Markus

[Blimpyboy]

13 hours ago, Shorty84 said:

the Article about the Cenepa War on the (now defunct) Acig.org site

 

The Acig site showed artwork of a Kfir fitted with what appear to be 'supersonic' tanks on the wings and centreline.

 

The same picture is also on this site: http://fdra.blogspot.com/2019/01/guerra-aerea-del-alto-cenepa-las_25.html

The caption from this site (which is, I think, a straight translation of that from the ACIG site) mentions the use of supersonic tanks in both positions. But, I note that this aircraft has a kill marking on it, so the configuration may not be representative of a Cenepa combat load (purely guesswork on my part).

 

P.S. A print can be found here (unsolicited plug...): https://www.aviationgraphic.com/aviation-lithographs/1030-mirage-f1ja-fae-tc-03.html?search_query=Kfir&results=8

 

 

And, for no other reason than why not, here are some more Ecuadorian Kfir shots:

 

 

 

 

Good luck!

 

[Shorty84]

Here is the exact caption for this picture on the ACIG-website (see my link above):

 

"FAE Kfir C.2 "FAE905", in camouflage and with markings as during the war in 1995. This aircraft was flown by Capt. Mata on 10 February 1995, when he shot down a Peruvian A-37B Dragonfly. Note the kill marking - in the form of a small silhouette of an AT-37B, together with the Peruvian fin-flash, applied underneath the forward part of the cockpit. Of interest is the carriage of three supersonic drop tanks - somewhat unusual appearance outside Ecuador. When carried on underwing hardpoints, these drop tanks could also be configured to carry two 100kg bombs each. During the air battle on 10 February 1995, this fighter, and the Kfir C.2 "FAE909" were armed with Shafrir Mk.II missiles, carried on outboard underwing pylons (not shown here). (Artwork by Tom Cooper)"

 

While it doesn't clearly exclude the possibility of drop tanks it seems quite unlikely though. The Kfirs were stationed near the front line and the reports of the engagements in the article never mentioned the Kfirs or Mirages jettison their tanks when attacking (while this was specifically mentioned for the Peruvian aircraft). So I guess they flew "clean" with just the missiles.

 

Helion will publish a paperback in Spring next year covering the conflict, maybe this will contain further information regarding this engagement: https://www.helion.co.uk/military-history-books/air-wars-between-ecuador-and-peru-volume-3-aerial-operations-over-the-condor-mountain-range-1995.php?sid=cb0b9e46225929a4c91af51b8a29b648

 

 

Cheers

Markus

[Blimpyboy]

 

Do you think that there's no mention of jettisoning tanks because there may have been no tactical need to do so?

Not all instances of combat will require jettisoning fuel tanks. Perhaps, the use of 'supersonic' tanks in the Cenepa engagements meant that the pilots were comfortable with keeping them (assuming that they were fitted).

 

My gut tells me that it would be a little odd for them not to have carried some additional fuel, despite being relatively close to the combat zone. Having said that, I am just guessing and really have no hard evidence either way.

[Shorty84]

I fully agree with you, it's for sure possible. I'm just guessing myself based on what the article mentions. The only given load out so far are the missiles. Maybe someone more familiar with the topic chimes in and can clarify this specific question.

[Piet van Schalkwyk]

Thanks to all for the discussion.  From a discussion with IPMS members in Equador who had contact with members involved on the day, it seems that the Kfir's in that period did fly with the centre tank and the 2 x missiles on air-defence patrols and CAP sorties.  This was also the configuration used by the Mirage F1JA's during the period, namely 2 x missiles and a belly tank.  In the preceding days leading up to the engagements by both types, they also flew combat air patrol missions with mixed formations of Mirage F1JA's and Kfir's, even at night time.  Raul Bandares, the F1 Squadron Officer Commanding at the time, in an interview discussed one mission such as this in the early morning hours.  This was flown in extremely bad weather and heavy rain showers, with a very tight finish at base.

 

Thanks and kind regards, take care of yourselves out there and have a Blessed Christmas.

Piet

[RAGATIGER]

On 12/23/2020 at 1:00 PM, Piet van Schalkwyk said:

Thanks to all for the discussion.  From a discussion with IPMS members in Equador who had contact with members involved on the day, it seems that the Kfir's in that period did fly with the centre tank and the 2 x missiles on air-defence patrols and CAP sorties.  This was also the configuration used by the Mirage F1JA's during the period, namely 2 x missiles and a belly tank.  In the preceding days leading up to the engagements by both types, they also flew combat air patrol missions with mixed formations of Mirage F1JA's and Kfir's, even at night time.  Raul Bandares, the F1 Squadron Officer Commanding at the time, in an interview discussed one mission such as this in the early morning hours.  This was flown in extremely bad weather and heavy rain showers, with a very tight finish at base.

 

Thanks and kind regards, take care of yourselves out there and have a Blessed Christmas.

Piet

The FAE AMD Mirage F-1JA used Matra  Magic 550 AAM

[drake122]

I am sorry to resurrect this old thread, hope it is not against the rules.

I am searching for more information/pictures of the FAE 907 jet during the Cenepa War era with the 4 tone touch-up scheme and Israeli style ID triangles visible or faded. I only have two pictures myself and literally no top or right side view available. The Aztec modelling decal sheet does include this scheme, but I don't really trust their research (color codes wrong, even Mig-21 type listed wrong on their Cuban sheet for example- mixed up Bis version with MF, etc.). 

Thanks in advance.