In The Wrong Hands GB. Close... but no cigar!

[vppelt68]

So what are you waiting for, please add me to the list

[TonyOD]

32 minutes ago, vppelt68 said:

So what are you waiting for, please add me to the list

I've put you in the number one slot and put myself in number 13. Wouldn't want to jinx anyone's builds. 😁

[vppelt68]

That was funny . I wouldn't mind being in the #13 spot either. Ok a true story from maybe 15 years ago. The Finnish lottery had 1,4 million euros as the main prize on the week we had 6 of the 7 numbers correct. We won something like 1350 euros . But (there's always a but) had we had all the 7 correct numbers, we would have won 474000 euros as there were two others who had "7 correct" too. We had ticked #7 (considered by many as the lucky seven) where as the correct seventh number would've been... you guessed it, the unlucky thirteen!

I still consider myself being a lucky - and a very happy - man although we had the "7 wrong" back then. What a mess would such an easy money made of our lives, really?

V-P

[TonyOD]

58 minutes ago, vppelt68 said:

That was funny . I wouldn't mind being in the #13 spot either. Ok a true story from maybe 15 years ago. The Finnish lottery had 1,4 million euros as the main prize on the week we had 6 of the 7 numbers correct. We won something like 1350 euros . But (there's always a but) had we had all the 7 correct numbers, we would have won 474000 euros as there were two others who had "7 correct" too. We had ticked #7 (considered by many as the lucky seven) where as the correct seventh number would've been... you guessed it, the unlucky thirteen!

I still consider myself being a lucky - and a very happy - man although we had the "7 wrong" back then. What a mess would such an easy money made of our lives, really?

V-P

 

Weirdly I have a 7/13 lottery story too. About 20 years ago my wife was a member of a lottery syndicate at work. She thought they had no chance of winning because there were 13 members. But believe it or not they got all the numbers and won the jackpot. However one of the numbers was 7 which is commonly picked because it's lucky... so there were quite a few winning tickets that week. So we won a 13th share of whatever it was after being divided between the winners. It was still a nice amount of money, £33,000 I seem to remember, and I'm certainly not complaining... but you're right, who wants the easy millions? 😁

[CliffB]

Sign me up too please Tony, probably with a Bolivian Vickers light tank, captured and operated by the Paraguayans.

 

Cheers

[Wez]

Count me in Tony and if you want a co-host, I'll throw my hat into the ring!

[TonyOD]

38 minutes ago, CliffB said:

Sign me up too please Tony, probably with a Bolivian Vickers light tank, captured and operated by the Paraguayans.

 

Wow. There's a lot more to this than Spitfires with crosses on them, innit.

 

30 minutes ago, Wez said:

if you want a co-host, I'll throw my hat into the ring!

That would be awesome, thanks Wez.

[Johnson]

I think this a great idea Tony.

 

I was going to build the Messerschmitt Bf 109 G2 'Black 6' after it was captured by 3 Sqn RAAF in next year's Bf 109 STGB, but it would fit in much better here. Please book me in.

 

Cheers

[TonyOD]

4 hours ago, Johnson said:

I was going to build the Messerschmitt Bf 109 G2 'Black 6' after it was captured by 3 Sqn RAAF in next year's Bf 109 STGB, but it would fit in much better here.

 

I feel it's an indication that I might be onto something if I'm nicking builds from other GB's!  🤣

 

Many thanks for joining us Charlie.

[TonyOD]

Here's another interesting example of an aircraft very much "in the wrong hands".

 

This MiG 21 "Fishbed" was flown by the Iraqi air force, and the Israelis fancied getting a closer look. Several attempts were made to get an Arab pilot to defect with a jet, before eventually a pilot named Munir Redfa was successfully courted. He was a Christian and as such found his promotion prospects within the Iraqi military limited, indeed he was only allowed to fly with limited fuel reserves because his superiors didn't trust him to scarper with one of their planes. He was also unhappy about having to fly missions against Iraqi Kurds. Clearly disaffected, in 1966 he was groomed by a female Mossad agent and was persuaded to come over with his plane in exchange for American citizenship, a million dollars in cash and an assurance that family members would be smuggled out of Iraq safely.

 

 

When they had done with it they lent it to the Americans in 1967:

 

 

In a rather tongue-in-cheek fashion the Israelis recoded the plane "007". It was once visited by a certain well known actor.

 

 

In 1988 a film called Steal the Sky was made, telling the story of Redfa and his defection. It doesn't look very good.

 

 

I quite fancy this as a subject if the GB flies!

 

Cheers

[Johnson]

11 minutes ago, TonyOD said:

I quite fancy this as a subject if the GB flies!

 

A great choice Tony.

 

48 minutes ago, TonyOD said:

I feel it's an indication that I might be onto something if I'm nicking builds from other GB's!  🤣

 

It would work well for me, I have too many Bf 109s lined up for the STGB, including the earlier version of Black 6 in Luftwaffe markings before capture. I've just added 2 Fine Molds Bf 109 G2s to the stash!

 

I hope the GB flies as well. Great idea your 'advert' at the bottom of your posts, made me take a look 👍.

 

Cheers,

[TonyOD]

11 minutes ago, Johnson said:

 

A great choice Tony.

 

 

It would work well for me, I have too many Bf 109s lined up for the STGB, including the earlier version of Black 6 in Luftwaffe markings before capture. I've just added 2 Fine Molds Bf 109 G2s to the stash!

 

I hope the GB flies as well. Great idea your 'advert' at the bottom of your posts, made me take a look 👍.

 

Cheers,

My background is in sales and marketing. Hope it will come in handy for getting this GB off the ground. 😁

[Adam Poultney]

Just an idea but could this be expanded to include equipment sold to another nation then later used against the nation that made it (eg Argentinian Canberras or Finnish Hurricanes) . Certainly would fit the theme, but doesn't seem to quite fit what was set out in the original post

Edited December 22, 2020 by Adam Poultney

[TonyOD]

1 hour ago, Adam Poultney said:

Just an idea but could this be expanded to include equipment sold to another nation then later used against the nation that made it (eg Argentinian Canberras or Finnish Hurricanes) . Certainly would fit the theme, but doesn't seem to quite fit what was set out in the original post

 

I don't see why not. It certainly fits the ethos of what I have in mind.

[vppelt68]

1 hour ago, Adam Poultney said:

Just an idea but could this be expanded to include equipment sold to another nation then later used against the nation that made it (eg Argentinian Canberras or Finnish Hurricanes) . Certainly would fit the theme, but doesn't seem to quite fit what was set out in the original post

 

15 minutes ago, TonyOD said:

 

I don't see why not. It certainly fits the ethos of what I have in mind.

...except Finnish Hurricanes were never used against the nation that made them. I'd like to think that way .

But I got your point and second it! V-P

[TonyOD]

34 minutes ago, vppelt68 said:

...except Finnish Hurricanes were never used against the nation that made them. I'd like to think that way

 

As I said I'm no aviation historian, but if an aircraft (or tank or whatever) under whatever circumstances found it self being used against its originator that would tick the box for me. Maybe being used against an ally of the originator when supplied prior to a given conflict might be a bit too loose, e.g. French-built Mirages and US-built Skyhawks used by the Argentinians against the British during the Falklands War. I can't imagine the French or the Americans  gave it too much thought - that's the arms business for you.

[Wez]

There's some interesting pictures of a captured Crusader and Honey tanks being used by the German's in this gallery of SAAF pictures.

[Jabba]

As I have found Iranian markings for the Iraqi Mirage F1s please add my name to this list.

[TonyOD]

1 hour ago, Jabba said:

As I have found Iranian markings for the Iraqi Mirage F1s please add my name to this list.

Certainly will. Interesting pick.

[TonyOD]

Another interesting example of the type, in fact this one was in various hands!

 

 

A French-built Lioré et Olivier LéO 451 bomber that (along with 38 others) was captured by Italian troops when they took the SNCASE factory near Lyon in May 1943. The Germans passed a covetous eye over the LéO's sleek lines and effectively pulled rank, actually they claimed to have already bought the aircraft (but they did throw in a bunch of Dewoitine D.520s to sweeten the deal). The Luftwaffe converted their LéOs to fast transports and gave them the splinter camo treatment. This particular airframe was then recaptured by the Americans - the USAAF bunged some stars on it (though it retained the Luftwaffe camo) and flew it in North Africa.

 

This aircraft was actually the inspiration for the GB proposal and I'm actually trying to build it at the moment, though God knows it's given me a beating...

[TonyOD]

Here's a final nudge for this GB to end this annus truly horribilis, by kind permission of @Ratch, his very fine "Rafwaffe" Messerschmitt Bf 109F from the ongoing Heller Classic GB. Setting the standard, I'd say.

 

"Messerschmitt Bf 109F-4/B was piloted by Oswald Fischer of 10/JG 26 who was shot down near Beachy Head by anti-aircraft fire while attacking a Royal Navy vessel in May 1942. It seems that the aircraft was kept until a serviceable engine or cylinder block could be acquired from a downed aircraft in the Middle East. In August of 1943, the aircraft was delivered to No. 1426 Enemy Aircraft Flight, Collyweston, on 12 April 1943. A F/Lt R.F. Forbes flew the aircraft at RAF Collyweston on 24 October, while it was still in Luftwaffe markings. Shortly after that, it was painted in RAF colours and given the serial NN644, keeping the white 11 and bomb markings. RAF pilots had similar ground handling problems with the 109 as did Luftwaffe pilots. In July of 1944, the port wing and aileron where damaged when an RAF pilot ground looped it on landing at RAF Thurleigh, Bedfordshire. The Messerschmitt passed to the Enemy Aircraft Flight at Tangmere in January of 1945 and went into storage at No. 47 MU at RAF Sealand in November of that year. It was later scrapped."

 

 

 

Happy New Year all!

[alt-92]

I'm not someone who normally likes to plan that far ahead, but I'm definitely interested. 

[TonyOD]

1 hour ago, alt-92 said:

I'm not someone who normally likes to plan that far ahead, but I'm definitely interested. 

Me neither. Planning more that 30 minutes in advance I find a challenge. Can I sign you up then?  🤣

[alt-92]

23 minutes ago, TonyOD said:

Can I sign you up then?  🤣

 yup. Let's see where this ends up

 

[TonyOD]

Happy New Year everyone!

 

We’re closing in on 20 now. Hoozupforrit?