perdu Posted January 5, 2021 Author Share Posted January 5, 2021 Carefully phrasing a response.. Thanks Chris, however I really feel bad about misleading you all. I didn't send this work out to the foundry to have it cast because I deemed it more sensible to do the work myself so I just went at it prototyping as usual. Whilst this means that they didn't get the last one wrong at all, it was all down to me it does mean that they won't get any blame for when it goes wrong again. So I try again, having got that off my weedy old chest... First cut in on the 80thou sheet. Better shape drawn onto the sheet, angles and radii better prepared I hope This will need refining after cutting out a bit. A bit? Ho ho ho Searching for the curves and angles... Nearly... and turn over. Still plenty to do but a lot better this time. On with turning this flat blank into round stuff. Lucky me. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Brilliant work Bill. Especially the mini wheelwrightery . Particularly like this shot as it shows it coming together. Looking lovely, can't wait to see it in the corporation colours. On 1/3/2021 at 5:03 PM, perdu said: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Seconded! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 7, 2021 Author Share Posted January 7, 2021 That will not be for a while yet Tom, I have finally begun to bite the bullet, grasp several nettles and try hard to get my head round converting the overscale drawings (God knows what scale the pictures work out at, not 1:32 for certain) into a close approximation to the model's bits. 5 done and a further four to get resized, I might be able to simply look, measure, cut out and glue then instead of "Take an inches number, divide it by 32 and then try to redraw it on paper" which is my present version of 'procedures to follow'. In the meantime I will attempt to spray Vermillion in a damp infested garage and make some progress with The S-61N. Think of me down there feeling down there... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 7, 2021 Author Share Posted January 7, 2021 Some times there're bullets to bite, today I could see what I always had niggling at the back of my mind. The downstairs windows were too shallow... by .2 of a metre too. Here we go, onwards and up! 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spadgent Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 Simply brilliant! 👌 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 11, 2021 Author Share Posted January 11, 2021 I had thought that having the drawings I've shown would simplify certain tasks, especially making the wheels by copying the angles between each spoke. Wrong Bill, after looking hard at these plans it struck me these wheels are wrong for the Brummie buses which have fourteen spokes on the wheels front and back. The bus drawn up for the plans by John Thompson has sixteen spoke wheels front and back but all the photographs of Birmingham buses show them with the lower number of spokes. i.e. one of my favourite pictures "A windy day near the Station" Fourteen spokes each wheel. I was searching through the Model Wheelwrighting sites when I came across this. It is simple, so simple it is brilliant Observe this image, circles divided by separate panels each with the relevant number of 'spokes' I will let Ron tell us how simple it is if you have a computer and since we are all here we do have the necessary computer to hand: Over to you Ron. http://www.scalemodelhorsedrawnvehicle.co.uk/(tips & ideas).htm How to get a circle any diameter with any number of divisions you require! You will need a computer for this. Go into Excel and put the number one (1) along the top row of columns, (or it can be down the left side of the rows) in each box for as many spokes you require, go to chart wizard, choose pie and follow it through. You now have a pie chart/wheel, with the correct distance between spokes that you want. You can then change this to any colour that you require. Next, copy this and past into Microsoft ® Paint , or equivalent so that you can crop to capture just the circle. Next, copy and paste this into Microsoft ® Word, where you can right click on the picture to format to the diameter required, and print. If you save your selection of various pie segmented circles in a folder in your computer you can then always quickly print any size circle with any number of segments whenever you need it. ~Ron Curzon.~ I didnt go across, just went down the rows instead Excel has an annoying habit of upgrading every five minutes, this version (in Win 10 I think) insisted on drawing each cell in a different colour and I am not brave enough, nor clever enough either to fight and try to get the version used by Ralph Kitching, the librarian to the 'Guild of Model Wheelwrights' Anyroad up, with the information I drew one set for sixteen spokes and one for fourteen I am using fourteen I Gator's Gripped it to a piece of 60 thou plasticard and drilled a hole at the centre of the pie chart and stuck a 'spindle' into the hole Add the wheel hub And start adding square spokes to the hub, the pair of wheel rims are there to set the angle of the spokes which need to be offset to produce a conical shape to the spoke pattern And I need to keep the spoke at the correct angle to the hub centre, this looks OK Now I need to begin mini-spokeshaving the spokes That little piece of scrap with a hole in it is for that, the spokes are made from square or rectangular wood in the real thing and after making them to fit the hub they are given a taper so that where they fit into the wheel rim they are round or tapered The hole in the plastic is to let me taper each spoke the same amount Well no doubt we will find out how that goes later when Slater's sends me a half a mile of 60thou strips, work on wheels is now suspended where I hoped it could be. Now to get going on the underframes... 15 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 I don't know. You go through life taking something like wooden wheels for granted, and then someone comes along and explains how complicated* they are. Makes me wonder why they didn't just go straight to inventing the hover bus. BTW, it was Brum. Someone nicked the extra spokes. * I didn't do that well in maths. Not enough fingers, and, fifty years later, I'm still not sure what logarithms are for. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 You re-invented the wheel, Bill! Jokes aside, magnificent scratch building job Ciao 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 11, 2021 Author Share Posted January 11, 2021 I like to leave inventing to clever people G, so I do. Pete? Logarithms? What the ungodly hell were they for huh? You faff about with a book full of tiny numbers and rows of decimal numbers! I think, why? Now at this very elderly age having been a tool maker I can swear I never had to logarise anything after leaving school. Not, I repeat not going to use them now. 😠😠😠 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 We were wasting our time then? I could have been at home building two bob Airfix kits for goodness sake! 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 11, 2021 Author Share Posted January 11, 2021 It's a sod isn't it? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Great charting Bill, what a clever idea! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 Around 48 hours ago, early on Sunday afternoon I placed an order with Slater's for some 0.060" Microstrip. Enter the postman this morning, eleven-ish. Remember that name, Slater's of Matlock, Derbyshire. Absolutely impeccable service, now I can get on with doing this. Fettling spokes. As you can see I pruned this test spoke a little extra-carelessly. Proper jobs coming up, fifty six on 'em. The sizing test jig gets a run out with an early attempt. Laters guys, I have a bit to do.. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendie Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 50 minutes ago, perdu said: Fettling spokes. Language please Bill! (Family friendly site, remember) 52 minutes ago, perdu said: Proper jobs coming up, fifty six on 'em. I do NOT envy you in the slightest. Good luck! 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 He he Eight cut out of the new Slater's. Some more to cut. Sixty two is it? 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Still counting. I'll get back to you..... 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 Some done, about eleventy four to go. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 If anyone is deluded enough to believe I intend rounding off a hundred and eleventeen spokes by hand, well baby you don't know me very well, OK. Well I am a fan of the industrial revolution so please don't be shocked that revolutions have had a hand in this. This Expo drill has had a brass collet inserted instead of its usual plastic ones, then set to a small diameter... It was set spinning and I used the hole in the end of the collet to 'machine' the rounded spokes by pushing the stem into the spinning hole elev.. no fifty six times which resulted in. Square ends at the hub, just like real wheels and rounded spindles for the rest of the spokes. And many weeks later (It felt like it) we had them done. Sorry but the flash was needed but uncontrollable, did I say sorry? Mostly sorry I did it this way because I had 'vibration hand' for half a hour afterwards from the spinning Expo drill tool. 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Brilliant Bill. Great tip too. No logarithms, Pi, cosines, hyperbola or loci, plus less spokes to make too ...👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendie Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Give that man seeegaaaar! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 44 minutes ago, perdu said: I had 'vibration hand' for half a hour afterwards from the spinning Expo drill tool. Snort! 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, perdu said: It was set spinning and I used the hole in the end of the collet to 'machine' the rounded spokes Coo, just like a bead lathe eh Bill, pity you don’t have... no, wait! was it faster doing it like that or, like me, did you forget you had the tool? Great stuff though Bill - spokin’ (like The Mask 😷) 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 12, 2021 Author Share Posted January 12, 2021 Cedric P Bufton dude, Buffers of this parish, do you think the ordinary chuck in my bead lathe (Its mine all mine all mine!) would have been able to spin down that small? I didn't think it would and fully expected the minidrill collets to do wot they dun under control, resulT! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 Can we please have a video of the whole operation? I'm not quite sure I understood how you did it, Bill..... Brilliant job! Ciao 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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