Varnish coat for decals

[ftm2001]

Gloss/Satin coat question? I am about to gloss coat my arv for decals and weathering. I have used some of the vallejo gloss on a bf109 I did and it pooled, frosted and didn't go on evenly. It was also a nightmare to clean from the airbrush (.3 needle). I have bought some Pledge Floor care from Amazon (£13 in UK) and practised with it on some spare parts but dont seem to be able to get a consistent finnish. Again it pooled in some parts and had rough texture in others. I have just ordered vallejo premium gloss and satin varnish as their premium matt rescued the bf109 I mentioned and went through airbrush easily. Anyway I'm erring on the new vallejo premium varnishes I've ordered but I'm wondering can you satin coat instead of gloss for decals? Would you still get the capillary action for panel line washes etc?

[dromia]

There is no need to gloss or satin or anything for transfers, what you do need is a consistent surface finish be it matt, satin, gloss or whatever.

 

I use matt and semi matt paints in the main and the transfers have just gone down fine on the bare paints for the past four decades or so I've been at it on and off. No need for that extra clear coat in my experience.

[Stef N.]

Something I've learned from here is that panel line washes work much better on a glossy coat. It doesn't bleed and stays mostly in the line you want and any wayward paint is easier to clean off. So now I gloss and do both the decals and pin washes/panel lining at this stage. (Before panel lining I seal the decals in with another layer of gloss.)

 

 

Edited December 5, 2020 by Stef N.

[Dave Swindell]

3 hours ago, ftm2001 said:

Gloss/Satin coat question? I am about to gloss coat my arv for decals and weathering. I have used some of the vallejo gloss on a bf109 I did and it pooled, frosted and didn't go on evenly. It was also a nightmare to clean from the airbrush (.3 needle). I have bought some Pledge Floor care from Amazon (£13 in UK) and practised with it on some spare parts but dont seem to be able to get a consistent finnish. Again it pooled in some parts and had rough texture in others. I have just ordered vallejo premium gloss and satin varnish as their premium matt rescued the bf109 I mentioned and went through airbrush easily. Anyway I'm erring on the new vallejo premium varnishes I've ordered but I'm wondering can you satin coat instead of gloss for decals? Would you still get the capillary action for panel line washes etc?

The symptoms you're describing with your airbrushed varnish finish sound to me to be problems with your spraying and not the varnish, replacing one varnish with another isn't going to cure your problems. 

The quickest way to get a good smooth finish with what you've already got is to put the airbrush to one side and using a good quality flat paintbrush, brush paint the Pledge Floor Care on - it's self levelling so a thin even brushed coat should dry without any brush marks in it and will give you a good base coat for your decals. 

I'd stick with gloss varnish pre decals, as satin varnish has a flatting agent in it that can introduce surface roughness into the finish - as the aim is to achieve a smooth finish this potentially defeats the objective. The finish doesn't have to be high gloss, but it should be smooth.

For spraying the varnish, you need to practice getting a thin even wet coat on.

Capillary action with panel line washes is more dependent on the wash than the surface finish, the wash needs a low surface tension to flow, you may need to add a wetting agent, for water based washes this can be something as simple as a tiny drop of dishwashing soap.

 

3 hours ago, dromia said:

There is no need to gloss or satin or anything for transfers, what you do need is a consistent surface finish be it matt, satin, gloss or whatever.

 

I use matt and semi matt paints in the main and the transfers have just gone down fine on the bare paints for the past four decades or so I've been at it on and off. No need for that extra clear coat in my experience.

The requirement is for a smooth surface

There are a few modellers who have perfected a technique for applying decals to a matt surface without any visible silvering

There are a lot of modellers who are happy with the results they get applying decals to a matt surface (note - not the same as above, but if they're happy so am I!)

There are also a lot of modellers who were unhappy with the results of applying decals over a matt surface and have found the simple expedient of applying an overall coat of gloss varnish (or using gloss paint to start with) cures 90% of their problems  they had applying decals over a matt finish.

If you're happy with how your decals look, fine; but the first solution I'd offer to anyone not happy with the look is try a coat of gloss varnish before decalling and see how that looks.

[dromia]

In my experience there is no difference 'tween transfers on a matt surface and a transfer on a gloss surface.

 

I have often seen people misunderstanding the shine of the transfer against the matt of the paint as silvering which it is not and goes away with whatever you final clearcoat is.

 

My experience says that a smooth surface is not necessary but a consistent surface is be it rough or smooth.

 

People should do whatever makes them feel good, I just can't be bothered with the gratuitous "gloss for transfers" step especially when it gives no material benefit but if it helps you then go for it.

Edited December 5, 2020 by dromia

[Graham Boak]

This has certainly not been my experience, and logic alone tells you (or should) that a grainy surface cannot be a good match for a flat thin film.  This requires a smooth surface - a smooth matt or even satin will probably do as well as a full gloss.  But a grainy surface will leave (it cannot avoid it) small air spaces which will show as silvering where the film is only touching the "mountains" and not the "valleys".  Remember that the film is being asked to cover irregularities in three dimensions.  A flat film just can't do that.  You can of course get silvering on a gloss surface as well as a matt one...  

 

It may be possible to achieve a good fit to a matt surface if you use some of the decal softener products which allows the film to stretch and flow around protrusions.  I can't say that I've tried that.  Otherwise, however, a smooth surface is not "gratuitous" however it is achieved.

[Mark Harmsworth]

I'm all for simplicity - I found out a while ago that brushing pledge/future/kleer works perfectly well and have used that method since. Use a wide flat brush, don't overload it and make sure you have good lighting so you can see what you are doing. If there is any pooling then use the edge of some kitchen towel to soak up the excess. The brush can be cleaned with window cleaner - the clear blue stuff with ammonia.

 

Brushing it on also avoids the pain of trying to clean the airbrush.

 

That should give a smooth surface for the decals as @Dave Swindell and @Graham Boak have said.

 

Mark

[ModelMonkey]

+1 for brushing Klear - dip the brush, then multiple strokes on the lip of the jar/pot to remove most of it before going near the model itself.