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HMS Griffin - G-class Destroyer, Atlantic Models 1/350


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:blush: sorry folks - that was a genuine slip.  So much to think about :whistle:

 

So let's have a round of applause for that well known Model shop proprietor and purveyor of the finest paints - Mr Jamie Duff :clap2:

Who very kindly stepped in and shipped me some paint masks as an alternative to decals that had misbehaved and caused a lot of heartache by lifting all my paint when I scratched them off :wall:

Thanks for the heads up Beefy - My go to setting solution is Mr Hobby, so I'll experiment

 

2021 02 01_1262

 

2021 02 01_1263

 

Enthusiasm had begun to wane for this build but this single act of using these masks has caused it to be rejuvenated.

They are easy to use and whilst I have used masks before - I'm so brainwashed by decals that they are my first go to.

No Longer!!!

 

Tah Dah!!

 

2021 02 01_1266

 

2021 02 01_1265

 

No silvering and no worrying about spacing.  Jamie I thank you again and hope that these become a Sovereign Hobbies staple.  We'll worry about depth markings later :hmmm:

 

The original pics of the G class destroyers show unmistakeable wood around the rim of the  bridge and searchlight boxes.  Interestingly few  have protrayed it as such in past builds.

 

2021 02 01_1264

 

The other niggle I had was about the red squadron band around the aft funnel, so that was remasked and widened tonight

 

2021 02 01_1268

 

I cant actually complete the Bridge yet as I'm waiting for a DCT tower to come from Black Cat models to see if it improves on the white metal offering.

 

I've been sorting out the transom and has to work out what TSDS stood for ("Two speed destoyer sweep"), one of those rare times where the web did not offer up a quick answer.  There's very little on the web about the winches etc - so as I had an Amazon voucher this begged to come home with me..

 

2021 02 01_1267_edited-1

 

I learn so much froom these books - The sweep gear and winches finally made a bit more sense.  This volume is as good as the Vol 2 Escort & Minesweeper lessons - thoroughly recommended.

 

I pimped the winches up a tiny bit but forgot to photograph them before priming.  You can see some scratched paravanes into the bargain.  Hope somebody produces an accurate 3D printed offering soon!!

 

2021 02 01_1269

 

The sharp eyed amongst you will see 2 extra watertight doors.  Rather embarrassingly I found 2 apertures on the rear of the aft superstructure that till now I had studiously missed :doh: (Fat drunk and stupid!).

However the very good news is that Hannants have finally received the Trumpeter C-Class so expect HMS Clacutta soon :yahoo:

Stay safe y'all and keep dodging those little RNA Capsids!

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16 hours ago, robgizlu said:

 

expect  HMS Clacutta soon !

 

 

I'll wait for Clacutta! 😉

Thanks for interesting, 1st rate class report!

Edited by socjo1
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I'm glad those worked out Rob. I haven't had a disaster yet personally, but equally they always look as if they're inviting trouble. I think they rely upon a delicate hand with the airbrush to paint in quite a dry coat.

 

I almost wish there was such a thing as a standard font for Royal Navy pendant numbers but alas every ship appears to have been chalked in and painted by a different hand, meaning each ship needs bespoke tracing of each character which thwarts any ambitions for useful generic mask sets I think!

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Good to see you back at work

The pennant numbers are looking sweet as are the individual details.

 

Being a brain surgeon must really help with modelling. Your models always look so clean and crisp.  or you are a dab hand with photoshop 

 

Eagerly awaiting the next step

 

Kev

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8 hours ago, robgizlu said:

The original pics of the G class destroyers show unmistakeable wood around the rim of the  bridge and searchlight boxes.  Interestingly few  have protrayed it as such in past builds.

Gidday, I never realized it was wood. Thanks for the tip. And I'm looking forward to seeing HMS Clacutta. A sister-ship to HMS Calcutta perhaps? 😁 Regards, Jeff.

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On 2/2/2021 at 12:03 AM, robgizlu said:

I learn so much from these books - The sweep gear and winches finally made a bit more sense.  This volume is as good as the Vol 2 Escort & Minesweeper lessons - thoroughly recommended.

 

 

You can see some scratched paravanes into the bargain.  Hope somebody produces an accurate 3D printed offering soon!!

 

2021 02 01_1269

 I strongly support your endorsement of the superb Lambert books, Rob; they’re brilliant.

 

Love your paravanes and, having just risked my sanity by building some NorthStar equivalents for Ark (gorgeous, but SO tiny, fiddly & delicate), second your hope for Micromaster or similar to get some out!

 

She’s looking ever more beautiful.

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On 2/2/2021 at 12:03 AM, robgizlu said:

 

 

The original pics of the G class destroyers show unmistakeable wood around the rim of the  bridge and searchlight boxes.  Interestingly few  have protrayed it as such in past builds.

 

 

 

Rob, Please can you link to such a photo. None that I have show this (quite the reverse).

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Lovely build so far Rob, I've got a couple of Trumpy Tribals on the go at moment (Eskimo and Huron), and I'm pinching ideas off you left right and centre at the moment.

 

 

8 hours ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

Love your paravanes and, having just risked my sanity by building some NorthStar equivalents for Ark (gorgeous, but SO tiny, fiddly & delicate), second your hope for Micromaster or similar to get some out!

 

 

Hi Crisp,

 

Black Cat do some 'Merican paravanes: https://blackcatmodels.eu/en/deck-accessories/122-usnavy-paravanes-x6.html

 

And if you look at the review on ModelWarships it helpfully says that "Originally developed by the British, the paravane was a sort of towed underwater glider with a warhead that was used in anti-submarine warfare.  It was later, and more commonly, used against naval mines."  

 

I'm curious if these are close enough in 1/350 to pass as British, maybe with some subtle mods.

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1 hour ago, AntPhillips said:

Hi Crisp,

 

Black Cat do some 'Merican paravanes: https://blackcatmodels.eu/en/deck-accessories/122-usnavy-paravanes-x6.html

 

And if you look at the review on ModelWarships it helpfully says that "Originally developed by the British, the paravane was a sort of towed underwater glider with a warhead that was used in anti-submarine warfare.  It was later, and more commonly, used against naval mines."  

 

I'm curious if these are close enough in 1/350 to pass as British, maybe with some subtle mods.

Dear Fellows, are you talking about such machinery? 😉

royal-navy-wwii-minesweeping-gear.jpg

Black Cat's Royal Navy WWII minesweeping gear (I hope Mr Postman will bring me this set soon - it will be installed in HMS Jed immediately.

 

Best regards,

Michał.

Edited by socjo1
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This is rather a tangent on this really excellent build. I have just started work on making a 1:250-scale model of one of Laird's 30-knotters from the 1895-1896 Programme. My subject, however, was named Griffon, whereas the next use of the name for a destroyer, the subject of this build, was as Griffin. This strikes me as very odd and I wonder if anyone has an explanation.

 

Maurice

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51 minutes ago, socjo1 said:

Dear Fellows, are you talking about such machinery? 😉

royal-navy-wwii-minesweeping-gear.jpg

Black Cat's Royal Navy WWII minesweeping gear (I hope Mr Postman will bring me this set soon - it will be installed in HMS Jed immediately.

 

No, those aren't paravanes; they are the components of an "Oropesa sweep" - basically, a minesweeping rig that uses the same idea as a trawl net, complete with "Otter boards" (the slatted square things) which 'fly' underwater suspended from the torpedo-shaped floats.  In a trawl these keep the mouth of the net open; in an Oropesa rig they keep the sweep wire as wide as possible so it clears a wide path.  Paravanes are not all that different in idea, but they were used by pretty much all ships for a measure of self-defence from moored mines, rather than by specialist minesweepers.  

 

I was Captain of an RN minesweeper in the early 1990s [NOT "early-1900s", as originally posted!], and we still used Oropesa sweeps even then (though we were employed in Fishery Protection throughout my time in command).

 

I hadn't seen the Black Cat paravanes, Ant.  The North Star ones are also US 'vanes designed for a cruiser, but the design is almost identical to the RN version - certainly good enough for my purposes where they are stowed on the inner bulkhead of one of Ark Royal's hull bays!

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Coming along great Rob now I do like that Paint scheme.  :book:

 

Stay Safe

beefy

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5 hours ago, dickrd said:

Rob, Please can you link to such a photo. None that I have show this (quite the reverse).

 

Hi Dick

Scan0021

 

HMS_Gipsy_(H63)_IWM_FL_13465

 

HMS_Hunter_FL10190

 

To my mind these pics all show a dark surround of the bridge, the 10" signal light box and the ?signal deck below.

Shout loud if I've misinterpreted - it's not too late to correct.

 

4 hours ago, AntPhillips said:

 

 

Lovely build so far Rob, I've got a couple of Trumpy Tribals on the go at moment (Eskimo and Huron), and I'm pinching ideas off you left right and centre at the moment.

 

 

 

Hi Crisp,

 

Black Cat do some 'Merican paravanes: https://blackcatmodels.eu/en/deck-accessories/122-usnavy-paravanes-x6.html

 

And if you look at the review on ModelWarships it helpfully says that "Originally developed by the British, the paravane was a sort of towed underwater glider with a warhead that was used in anti-submarine warfare.  It was later, and more commonly, used against naval mines."  

 

I'm curious if these are close enough in 1/350 to pass as British, maybe with some subtle mods.

 

Diolch Ant, I in my turn have pinched and continue to pinch plenty, I'm flattered.  I wasn't aware of the Merican paravanes !!! - They'll do :clap2: Hadn't thought to look in the colonials section 

 

4 hours ago, socjo1 said:

Dear Fellows, are you talking about such machinery? 😉

royal-navy-wwii-minesweeping-gear.jpg

Black Cat's Royal Navy WWII minesweeping gear (I hope Mr Postman will bring me this set soon - it will be installed in HMS Jed immediately.

 

Best regards,

Michał.

 

Michal - That set was tempting for the cranes alone.  Must find something to use it on;)

 

3 hours ago, mdesaxe said:

This is rather a tangent on this really excellent build. I have just started work on making a 1:250-scale model of one of Laird's 30-knotters from the 1895-1896 Programme. My subject, however, was named Griffon, whereas the next use of the name for a destroyer, the subject of this build, was as Griffin. This strikes me as very odd and I wonder if anyone has an explanation.

 

Maurice

 

Maurice - I had wondered the same, though the spellings seem to be interchangeable along with Gryphon.

 

Thanks for all the comments and interest

Rob

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Rob,

 

I am certain that it is shadow from the curved lip top of the steelwork on the bridge and signal deck that is giving you the dark impression in those areas, and that the searchlight platform 'sides' had a round metal railing top. I have a number of close ups that show no wooden topping. Nor do the As Fitteds for Glowworm.

 

For some reason I seem to be unable link to my photos via Flickr in the way I used to be able to a few months back. Can anyone explain what might be the problem? Doubtless some setting I have inadvertently activated on my PC! 

 

 

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On 02/02/2021 at 06:40, Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies said:

I almost wish there was such a thing as a standard font for Royal Navy pendant numbers but alas every ship appears to have been chalked in and painted by a different hand, meaning each ship needs bespoke tracing of each character which thwarts any ambitions for useful generic mask sets I think!

So true Jamie and even in recent years.  When GLASGOW came out of refit in Devonport in 1998, DML kindly painted our D88 with rounded 8s rather than the squared numbers that she'd had from build.  They became known as the 2 fat ladies and try as I might I could not find a reference to prove they were not meeting the spec to force them to repaint them.  Fortunately for us, not for them, they did such a bad job on the rest of the paintwork on the hull that after 3 months we had to come back in for it all to be repainted so at that point we got our square 8s back again.

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On 2/4/2021 at 8:01 AM, dickrd said:

Rob,

 

I am certain that it is shadow from the curved lip top of the steelwork on the bridge and signal deck that is giving you the dark impression in those areas, and that the searchlight platform 'sides' had a round metal railing top. I have a number of close ups that show no wooden topping. Nor do the As Fitteds for Glowworm.

 

For some reason I seem to be unable link to my photos via Flickr in the way I used to be able to a few months back. Can anyone explain what might be the problem? Doubtless some setting I have inadvertently activated on my PC! 

 

 

 

Thanks Dick - 

For Flickr - I Log on, then..

1) Upload by clicking on "cloud" icon on upper toolbar with N facing upward arrow

2) Navigate to my Pictures file and choose appropriate pic

3) click the upload prompts so that it's included ini my Photostream

4) I then L click on the said photo which enlarges to it's own page

5) On the tool bar lower right as you look - the second icon from the L is an upward sweeping arrow pointing to R of page - click on that

6) A white square box comes up with "Share 1 photo to" with a number of icon destinations below AND a "https......." address

7) I highlight that address and RIGHT click to copy

8  I then "paste" into the text in my Britmodeller thread.

 

HTH.

I have spent some considerable time searching multiple pics and to my mind the G class appear to have a "coloured" rim on the bridge surrounds that is not explicable by shadow alone.  That said looking in detail at pics of HMS Hesperus, that is remarakbly well photographed including "the" colour pic, this is not evident and there is no real shadow or other colour demarcation evident.  I've been through as many "bridge" pics as I can find on IWM most of which relate to much later vessels, and as you say there is no evidence for wood surround.  Thanks for sharing any additional evidence.  

On balance you are clearly right and I'll revert the colours.  I'm keen not to initiate an incoorect "dogma" because I'm only too aware that we often copy what went before which in large part explains the past confusion on correct RN colour schemes.  Having had some exposure to sensory psychology and perception teaching,  I can readily accept that appearances can often be illusory and the act of interprteting B&W photographs is fraught with pitfalls.  That said , to my mind there remains an argument that on the evidence  of the photographs above and others these rims were not the base colour (507C), suggesting that they were either painted or were not metal 

Rob

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Thanks Rob, A slightly different way to how I used to do it. Lets see if it works for me....success. OK Two of Garland's bridge side/top.

 

Garland 1942 5 27 H37-junkers-bombs-entry-hol

Garland 1939_hms_Garland

 

Edited by dickrd
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Thanks Dick - all is clear.  Completely unequivocal.  That metal lip overhang throws a consistent and significant shadow.

Je Tu'es en prie!

And great pics into the bargain.

Back to 507C and may several other misdemeanours be also taken into consideration :blush: ;)

Rob

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On 2/5/2021 at 2:24 PM, longshanks said:

Picture 1 The lip seems to be curved to form a type of wind deflector. Wide lip forming deep shadow :shrug:

 

Kev

 

Done deliberately to mislead keen young modellers -80 years ahead :doh:

And so the show goes on with the wood paint all scrubbed off :lol:  In truth I use Vallejo airbrush cleaner with a cotton bud that lifts most if the acrylic before respraying, though the truth is coverage is so good with the Colourcoats enamels that recovering is painless.

 

The weathering is going to be dleibertaely light on this build with just some subtle hull streaking to break up th eexpanse of grey.  it doesn't show up particylarly well in the pics, done as always with oils

 

2021 02 09_1298

 

 

2021 02 09_1296

 

The anchor chains are set usignthe thinest chain I have.

 

2021 02 09_1297

 

 

The funnel stays are set in place using Infini 40 Deernier monofilament.  In reality the true stays were slightly more complicated in that each arose from 2 oints at the top of the funnel in a "Y" shape leading to the deck in a single line.  Just too complicated to replicate successfully at this scale - Soz!

 

2021 02 09_1299

 

And the gun platform was constructed without drama - all of the etch matching the resin part perfectly without any need for fettling

 

2021 02 09_1290

 

The instructions from Peter Hall are a little vague as to the arrangement of laddering from deck to Galley roof and thence to signal deck and bridge.  I spent some considerable time searching for pics but none shows the precise arrangement in detail.  I've opted fro climb ladders to the Galley roof - they may well have bee stepped - it appears that Galley to signal deck was offset to port - the ladder peter supplies was far too short (or I hahe completley misunderstood it).  The ladder from signal deck to Bridge is clear cut.  FWIW - here's my take

 

2021 02 09_1289

 

The ladder from Galley to signal deck clearly not present but will sti to port of the mast that steps into the obvious hole visible

 

2021 02 09_1293

 

And finally here's a comparison of Black Cat Models Gun director (left) set against the white metal Atlantic models offering.  (I've added etched ladders)  

 

2021 02 09_1291

 

Not a lot in it

 

2021 02 09_1292

 

And truly finally for now - some boats painted up

 

2021 02 09_1294

 

I want to have their babies!!!

Thanks for looking

Rob

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4 hours ago, Courageous said:

Coming together very nicely but this 'ere 'bubblehead' hasn't a clue where your galley and its roof is...

 

Stuart

Hi Stuart - I only worked it out due to the written instructions.  I think it's the Boxy thing with the unpainted railings sitting on top in the above pic.

Managed a few hours today and cracked on.

 

2021 02 09_1300

 

2021 02 09_1301

 

Got the Bridge superstructure stuck down and then stepped the mast.  I mispositioned the focs'le step ladders so they needed resiting, the value of using PVA glue instead of CA in situations that you might want to "adjust" :whistle:

 

2021 02 09_1302

 

2021 02 09_1303

 

Ladders now all in place

 

2021 02 09_1304

 

2021 02 09_1305

 

 

2021 02 09_1306

 

2021 02 09_1308

 

Mast ladders need sorting - then mast rigging and it's onto deck railings and final details.

 

Thanks for looking

Rob

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