Group Build policy discussion

[Enzo the Magnificent]

4 minutes ago, trickyrich said:

This idea is a winner, would make life sooo much easier.   

 

 

I could actually implement that pretty quickly. 

[helios16v]

Some of my thoughts:

 

On the topic of byes - Top 3, podium of "Almost Made It" on the assumption they didn't get in via a bye the year before (only 1 bye attempt then back to the support pool).

 

Standard GBs - reducing the number is fine...especially if it frees up some flexibility of Special Event GBs.

 

STGBs - Keep as a separate entity from GBs, but have the same requirements (4 mo. duration, same number of slots, gain slot via STGB bunfight).  Only difference would be to reserve 1 STGB for non-aircraft, if more make it then great.

 

Signups to get into bunfight(s) - I'd keep them the same.  STGB by nature aren't going to generate the numbers broader GBs will generate.  By increasing the number of signups for GBs you are effectively lining up specialized GBs to a firing squad.  They will never even have a chance to get out of the gate.

 

Annual classics - Keep 'em.

 

 

Thanks herding the cats around here.  Regardless of the outcome, this will likely be my main hangout in BMland.  This is where all my peeps are.  

[modelling minion]

I don't think that the GB's have a problem of building diversity as the majority that go through are based on themes that enable modellers of many types of subject to join in, the likes of the MTO, D-Day, Vietnam and the NATO/WARPAC GB's for example.

 

STGB's are a different matter entirely. I completely agree that it is by far and away the same old subjects that get the votes, Spitfire, Phantom etc. And this means that more unusual subjects just will not get a look in and that is bad for the forum as finding different STGB's than usual gets you to look at them and then join in. I think having an amount set aside for non-aircraft subjects is the right way to go and a minimum of 2 years between repeating the same subject.

[modelling minion]

9 minutes ago, helios16v said:

This is where all my peeps are.  

Big up for the GB massive!

[helios16v]

Thinking on the voting.....if we choose to go w/ voting for STGBs, we could have 2 weeks polling period for GBs, and 2 weeks for STGB.  Still have our typical November Bunfight for tradition, but still having reduced polling windows.

[vppelt68]

Lots of great ideas, some I Iike a lot and some I like a bit less.

 

Regarding the STGB:s, I think their major fault is the repetitiveness of some almost bi-annual types. If we´d just refrain from starting a new (say) P-51 STGB #12 chat thread while the P-51 STGB #11 is still going on, we´d be just fine. But it´s us the people that break it, it´s not in the system. Just airplanes, you say then? What´s wrong with popularity, no vote/signing in on a wingy thingy STGB is a vote away from something else STGB. If you want something, start a new thread and test the success of it (haha, it´s easy for me to say as I did exactly that with the FORD Mustang STGB - the first ever for a car, but we as a group of interested did it and it´ll happen next year ). The STGB Armored Corps has also made great advances recently.

 

I´d hate to have STGB:s subjected to the November vote, where members who never intend to participate in them can determine what we get to build, or not. The dates, on the other hand, could be shuffled in the end of the year. The slots already locked for the STGB:s could be moved within a year to help free space in the combined GB/STGB calendar by the combination of two á la the DeHavilland GB + Mosquito STGB that became a Mega GB. That worked fine! But that´d mean even more work for poor Enzo, and not an easy job at all .

 

I´d be happy to have only three to five votes for the said seven group build candidates. That will affect the results dramatically, but for better.

 

On the other hand, group builds come and they go. Some of them are interesting for you and me, some only for you or only for me. That´s the way it is and I like it like that. V-P

[trickyrich]

you know could solve a lot of problems for members, is to have a "Wildcard GB" as I suggested early, now thinking more about it I have an idea how it could work.

 

It would be an open GB that runs for 4 months as usual, but has only one category either for, flying things, AFV things, Floaty things, Civiy things, we could rotate the categories each year. But the main proviso is it must be the build you've been dying to build but never had the chance to or couldn't find a GB suitable, plus open to Whiffy's that seem to have been forgotten all about for years now!

 

So you'd need to state the build and why you just have to build it. It could even be run at the sametime as the KUTA GB, sort of and EOY Chrissie present.

 

A good no holds barred fun GB where it's all about fun and not having to stress about if the subject matter is valid or whether you build is exactly how it should be on that particular day, or the bits or decalaren't 100% correct. A chance to build a stress free model (is there such a thing...I've yet to find it!) and blow off some modelling steam at the end of a busy year.

[CliffB]

Hi guys and gals.

 

I've pulled together some numbers for your delictation . 

Here's a list of all the GBs that were completed in 2019, plus those finished so far this year.  For each one, I've noted (in brackets), the number of completed builds that appeared in its Gallery. I've assumed this number to be a reasonable indicator of popularity and my list ranks the GBs based on this.  Entries are colour-coded:  blue for full (bunfight) GBs, red for STGBs and green for 'specials'. 

I've done this to help inform the discussion about whether STGBs should continue to have slots reserved for them, or whether in future they should have to compete on equal terms with full GBs. 

Bear in mind that the more slots that are reserved for STGBs, the less slots are available for those GBs that have to go through the bunfight.

 

FROG Squad (118)

In the Navy (111)

Spitfire (110)

Nordic (108)

Battle of Britain (102)

Kit Built as Kid (93) 

Film & Fiction (65)

Helicopter (62)

Mustang (57)

50s NATO v Warpac (50)

Grumman (49)

Trainers (48)

Panzer IV (45)

The Specialists (42)

D-Day (38)

Blitz Build 2020 Pt.1 (36)

Flying Boats (33)

The Year I was Born (32)

Stuka (31)

Corsair (29)

Lockheed (28)

Maritime Patrol (28)

Lancaster (25)

Blitz Build 2020 Pt.2 (25)

Shark Mouths (24)

KUTA XII (22)

Xmas Blitz Build 2019 (21)

B.17 (20)

90s Asia (19)

Journey's End (18)

Blitz Build 2019 Pt.2 (17)

Curtiss Hawk (15)

F-4 Phantom (15)

Panzer VI Tiger (15)

Buccaneer (15)

DC-3 (14)

Blitz Build 2019 Pt.1 (12)

T-34 (12)

He.111 (12)

KUTA XI (11)

Patton (10)

T-55 (8)

CH-46 Vertol (8)

 

 

P.S. In case you should think that I've got a thing against STGBs, here's a picture of my entry from the CH-46 STGB.  Yes, I was one of the eight! 

 

 

Cheers

 

 

 

[Enzo the Magnificent]

9 hours ago, trickyrich said:

you know could solve a lot of problems for members, is to have a "Wildcard GB" as I suggested early, now thinking more about it I have an idea how it could work.

 

It would be an open GB that runs for 4 months as usual, but has only one category either for, flying things, AFV things, Floaty things, Civiy things, we could rotate the categories each year. But the main proviso is it must be the build you've been dying to build but never had the chance to or couldn't find a GB suitable, plus open to Whiffy's that seem to have been forgotten all about for years now!

 

 

Ooooh!  I like that idea! 

[srkirad]

So far I like the ideas of improving GB section - Enzo did a really good job today in tidying up some of subsections, and it definitely looks much better and easier to find what you need!

 

I do think that maybe there are too many GBs per year, but as I'm only in my first full year of GB participant I won't complain too much.

GBs really did improve my modelling mojo through the year, so great support from me for all the ideas and hard work regarding to this regrouping of posts and topics!

 

Maybe I'll have some better ideas when Enzo finishes rearrangement of subsections.

 

Anyway, thumbs up and keep up the great work!

 

Cheers,

S.

[Col.]

23 hours ago, helios16v said:

...Regardless of the outcome, this will likely be my main hangout in BMland.  This is where all my peeps are.  

Amen! Must admit that I seldom wander off elsewhere in the forum nowadays. There's enough going on in here to keep me entertained and the atmosphere is great.

 

1 hour ago, srkirad said:

So far I like the ideas of improving GB section - Enzo did a really good job today in tidying up some of subsections, and it definitely looks much better and easier to find what you need!

Indeed he has. Great work Enzo

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

30 minutes ago, Col. said:

Amen! Must admit that I seldom wander off elsewhere in the forum nowadays. There's enough going on in here to keep me entertained and the atmosphere is great.

Ditto

[trickyrich]

1 hour ago, srkirad said:

So far I like the ideas of improving GB section - Enzo did a really good job today in tidying up some of subsections, and it definitely looks much better and easier to find what you need!

 

so that's why I can't find anything, someone moved it!!  

 

It's bad enough it happens at home!!!

[trickyrich]

....and OMG he didn't break anything either!!  

 

Ok, i'll admit it's much better now..... 

[srkirad]

34 minutes ago, trickyrich said:

 

so that's why I can't find anything, someone moved it!!  

 

It's bad enough it happens at home!!!

Grandpa asks grandson: "Who's that German guy who hides all of our stuff around the house?!"

Grandson replies: "It's Alzheimer grandpa, it's Alzheimer..."

[Jasper dog]

If I can chuck my pennies worth in.

I'm taking part in my first ever GB (Panther) with a few pals and I'm thoroughly enjoying it, despite being initially hesitant as I'm a ridiculous slow modeller. I've enjoyed it so much I'm already signed up for the Panzer III one starting early next year and contemplating the Gulf War GB even though I think it clashes with the Pzr III one.  But...

And I doubt this is anything new to any of you looking at the what's been said before.  Considering the current bun fight I used three votes as that's all that really held any interest for me, non of which look likely to trouble the top of the board as they don't have wings.

I guess my point is, whilst wingy things are obviously the most popular genre of kits if the majority rules then that's probably bulk of what we'll get. Nothing against wingy things models I used to enjoy them myself but apart from the likes of the Blitzkreig, 90s NATO v Warsaw and the British AFVs there isn't much of interest for me to vote for. Coupled with the fact I've only just found a list of all the GB categories with a description of each, as some of the titles, to me at least, aren't overly obvious. (EG: Mates and Bro's......?🤔 absolutely no idea, could be Action Man and Ken for all that tells me! )

So whilst it's fine aviation has the bulk but perhaps ensure AFVs, boats, figures, sci-fi etc at least get a look in.

 

Perhaps a rough break down of percentage of forum populated by aviation, AFVs, boats etc and divvy the slots up for the STGBs accordingly, providing those categories wish them.

 

All that aside, I must say thank you to all involved in organising these GBs, having never done one before I'd no idea what I was missing,  brilliant,  just brilliant!

 

Cheers

Darryl 

[Col.]

51 minutes ago, Jasper dog said:

If I can chuck my pennies worth in.

I'm taking part in my first ever GB (Panther) with a few pals and I'm thoroughly enjoying it, despite being initially hesitant as I'm a ridiculous slow modeller. I've enjoyed it so much I'm already signed up for the Panzer III one starting early next year and contemplating the Gulf War GB even though I think it clashes with the Pzr III one.  But...

And I doubt this is anything new to any of you looking at the what's been said before.  Considering the current bun fight I used three votes as that's all that really held any interest for me, non of which look likely to trouble the top of the board as they don't have wings.

I guess my point is, whilst wingy things are obviously the most popular genre of kits if the majority rules then that's probably bulk of what we'll get. Nothing against wingy things models I used to enjoy them myself but apart from the likes of the Blitzkreig, 90s NATO v Warsaw and the British AFVs there isn't much of interest for me to vote for. Coupled with the fact I've only just found a list of all the GB categories with a description of each, as some of the titles, to me at least, aren't overly obvious. (EG: Mates and Bro's......?🤔 absolutely no idea, could be Action Man and Ken for all that tells me! )

So whilst it's fine aviation has the bulk but perhaps ensure AFVs, boats, figures, sci-fi etc at least get a look in.

 

Perhaps a rough break down of percentage of forum populated by aviation, AFVs, boats etc and divvy the slots up for the STGBs accordingly, providing those categories wish them.

 

All that aside, I must say thank you to all involved in organising these GBs, having never done one before I'd no idea what I was missing,  brilliant,  just brilliant!

 

Cheers

Darryl 

Glad to hear you're enjoying the GBs Darryl  

I'd say there's been a move in recent years to make GBs more inclusive of a broader subject range. Other options where an AFV subject or ship will be eligible include Less Than A Tenner, French II, Unarmed, Africa - otherwise known as Toto by our resident statistician (he's almost tame you know), Nordic II, Mate's and Bro's - also known as ANZAC by everyone apart from our statistician but just humour him as his medication (resin dust) will be kicking in again soon  , Kit You Didn't Build As A Kid, BeNeLux etc. 

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

2 hours ago, Jasper dog said:

EG: Mates and Bro's......?🤔 absolutely no idea,

Hello Darryl the Mates & Bro’s is Im told slang for Australians and New Zealander’s names for each other. As Im the host of the ANZAC build it covers anything from either country from their birth as Colonies to modern day. Including cars, Armor, Ships, and Aircraft both Civilian and Military. So If there is anything you're interested in from that area of the globe, you're more than welcome to join us. 
 

Dennis

 

Im also the host for British Armor and the Racers and show-offs build. If you have any questions about either of them please feel free to ask. 

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

1 hour ago, Col. said:

everyone apart from our statistician but just humour him as his medication (resin dust) will be kicking in again soon

That had me laughing Col.

[TonyOD]

On 11/15/2020 at 9:50 PM, Enzo Matrix said:

I remember John Fogerty's original!  

What?!?!?!? 

 

It's a cover version? I thought it was a Quo original! 

[vppelt68]

One thing I just don't get is the thing people complain about niche subjects not getting noticed or slots in the GB calendar - and then they would want to rob the STGB slots, that if any they serve some niche subjects, for the more mainstream subject GB:s. We just can't count subject numbers 1:1 for measuring popularity either. I've hosted the B-17 and Lancaster STGB:s. In both, one out-of-the box build equals the amount of time spent in several oob single engine prop or jet plane builds. Needless to say, many of those bombers were far from out-of-the-box! Of course we can't and shouldn't generalize things; each Britmodeller makes his own mind on how much effort, time and money one spends on ones' builds.

In short: STGB:s can in my opinion compete among STGB:s for slots and regular GB:s among regular GB:s. I recommend they'd never be put to compete with eachother. After that, you'd only see the Mustang, Tonka and Phantom STGB:s, no niches.

Also, what's a "type"? If, say, shipbuilders would propose a "Destroyer single type group build", I'm quite sure the current liberal and supportive spirit of the GB massive (and our moderator too!) would say "yes" to it. Tribals, Hunts, 45:s, whatever... Why don't people try these things, but whine. Just because it has never been done before and always done like this or that?

My  or maybe more, V-P

[vppelt68]

2 minutes ago, TonyOD said:

What?!?!?!? 

 

It's a cover version? I thought it was a Quo original! 

Has someone done a cover of the Creedence version? Is it worth listening?

[TonyOD]

1 minute ago, vppelt68 said:

Has someone done a cover of the Creedence version? Is it worth listening?

Story goes that they wanted to induct Fogerty into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but he couldn't be bothered with the fuss of the ceremony. Someone said to him. "You know what, if you don't go you'll die knowing that everyone thinks Proud Mary is a Tina Turner song."

 

He went.

[trickyrich]

It's a good thing I didn't go whole hog and change all the titles!!  

 

My idea for re-naming "Gliders & Tug's" probably would have had me banned for life!!  

 

Unfortunately I've run out of resin dust for the moment........I'm not sure when I'l get my next fix! 🥺

[Col.]

1 hour ago, trickyrich said:

It's a good thing I didn't go whole hog and change all the titles!!  

We still have, what, 12 days to go? There's time yet

 

1 hour ago, trickyrich said:

Unfortunately I've run out of resin dust for the moment........I'm not sure when I'l get my next fix! 🥺

This could explain a lot!  Next you'll be building stuff out-of-the-box with no aftermarket goodies and kit decals