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Why did the French design such ugly planes prior to and into WWII?


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2 hours ago, Aardvark said:

By the way, Anigrand (Resin kit) and Whirlybird - now Pegasus? (Vacuum kit) makes this model in  72nd scale. I have Whirlybird

Nope. Whirlybird are still Whirlybird. Pegasus are part of our good friends at Freightdog.

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38 minutes ago, WhirlybirdModels said:

Nope. Whirlybird are still Whirlybird. Pegasus are part of our good friends at Freightdog.

I am really sorry! Confused!

 

B.R.

Serge

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I am shocked that we've got to six pages in and on-one has yet mentioned this paragon of plainness, the PZL "Belphegor":

spacer.png

 

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25 minutes ago, Fifer54 said:

I am shocked that we've got to six pages in and on-one has yet mentioned this paragon of plainness, the PZL "Belphegor":

I'd forgotten about the Belphegor.  I think it's still the only jet-powered biplane/sesquiplane ever built.

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1 hour ago, Fifer54 said:

I am shocked that we've got to six pages in and on-one has yet mentioned this paragon of plainness, the PZL "Belphegor":

That ain't ugly. 

Its got interest and character

and I want a model of it!

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There is a subtle difference between ‘interesting’ (see Belphegor above) and ‘flying garden shed made from random windows from the tip’ (see Amiot 143).

 

I don’t think the French built ugly aircraft, just the case that some were really coming off the drawing board at least 10-20 years after everyone else.

 

Look at the Bristol Braemar (1918) or its civil version the Bristol Pullman. Chop of two sets of wings and...... the similarities are there. Flying train carriage..

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2 hours ago, Fifer54 said:

I am shocked that we've got to six pages in and on-one has yet mentioned this paragon of plainness, the PZL "Belphegor":

spacer.png

 

2 hours ago, JosephLalor said:

I'd forgotten about the Belphegor.  I think it's still the only jet-powered biplane/sesquiplane ever built.

Mention of this aircraft is banned by the World League of Insect Pests, due to the fact that this aircraft is a weapon of mass lethal psychological destruction for them, as they say: "Better toxic pesticides than seeing this!"

Therefore, immediately correct your messages, otherwise the BM will be imposed an insane fine and accusations of genocide Insect Pests!

😁

1 hour ago, Black Knight said:

That ain't ugly. 

Its got interest and character

and I want a model of it!

Do you understand what will be done to You when Insect Pests

are the majority in the government and the UN?

 😉😁

45 minutes ago, Muddyf said:

Look at the Bristol Braemar (1918) or its civil version the Bristol Pullman. Chop of two sets of wings and...... the similarities are there. Flying train carriage..

Common! 

"You don't understand, this is different!"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_don't_understand,_this_is_different!

...as and this too...

Bristol_Type_72_Racer_1.jpg

😁

By the way,

duran_1.jpg

competitor Mirage ...and first Mirage:

15-4.jpg

 

B.R.

Serge

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10 minutes ago, dalea said:

Anyway, ugly name. Look it up. How did the Commies think they could get away with it in Catholic Poland?

"From the Polish test pilot Andrzej Ablamovich at the Paris Air Show in Le Bourget in 1976 for his very strange appearance and the howl of a jet engine he received the unofficial nickname "Belphegor" after the demon Belphegor."

Thus, this is an unofficial name, in fact a nickname, as B-26 - "widowmaker", etc.

 

B.R.

Serge

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It is slowly drifting from FRENCH planes, to anything strange looking (at least for us).

The train carriage look in those planes is very obvious, but the flyers in there were all officers & gentleman.

With a tea & biscuit served in third and a half hour of the flight by the on board radio operator.

As for agriculture A/C, they all look rather strange for fighter/bomber building guys, but they are very purposeful!

Belphegor -that was just a test bed.

If you feel like dig around, there was an earlier version, with AN-2, as a starter base, that's for hardcores.

Life's 2 short.

Zig

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1 hour ago, zigster said:

Belphegor -that was just a test bed.

If you feel like dig around, there was an earlier version, with AN-2, as a starter base, that's for hardcores.

533998_original.jpg

LaLa Land -1😁

Joke, just LaLa-1, yes Poles could in a ugly!

😁

But An-2 was a wide field for experiments, sometimes turning this reliable and simple aircraft into something monstrous:

640px-An6.webp.png


44-4.jpg

 

scale_1200

 

moreover, the original, pre-war project was not very beautiful:

http://alternathistory.com/files/users/user1088/i_012.jpg

There is an assumption that he could be based on the Bendukovich aircraft, made in auto repair shops and even managed to take part in the Soviet-Finnish war:
8909784.jpg

However, do not worry with the development of the An-2, everything is fine thanks to new technologies and aerodynamics:

%D1%82%D0%B2%D1%81-2%D0%BC%D1%81-%D0%BA%

%D1%82%D0%B2%D1%812%D0%B4%D1%82-%D0%BA%D%D1%82%D0%B2%D1%812%D0%B4%D1%82-%D0%BE%D

 

B.R.

Serge

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On 9/17/2020 at 7:49 AM, Roger Holden said:

Hardly.  In the civil field, Airbus UK designs and builds the wings for all Airbuses, far from 'merely subcontractors'........ 

 

 

Which is owned by Airbus. And what was the last British designed aircraft - The Hawk perhaps? And are there any British designed airliners still in service?

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7 hours ago, leyreynolds said:

Which is owned by Airbus. And what was the last British designed aircraft - The Hawk perhaps? And are there any British designed airliners still in service?

Depends what you mean by "British designed" very, very, very few aircraft are solely designed and manufactured in a single state, sub-contracting means aircraft are designed all over the place. That said, the Lynx was primarily a UK design (with a lot of input from Aerospatiale) and the AW159 was designed in the UK (with the sub-contracting caveats), the AW101 is designed in the UK.

 

The Hawk was primarily designed in the UK. To answer your second question, the Avro/BAe 146 was the last airliner primarily designed in the UK and it's still in service (it performs a niche role very well - what most British designs do). I'm not sure who has the Design Authority for the BAe 146 now. Possibly Airbus, following BAE SYSTEMS sale of it's civil aerospace division.

 

 

On another note, brown velvet carpet in the Turbo An2 cockpit....

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15 hours ago, alt-92 said:

Oooooooh... Beige/brown. How very 1970s.

:lipssealed:

 

1 hour ago, wellsprop said:

On another note, brown velvet carpet in the Turbo An2 cockpit....

You don't understand anything in Bamboleo:

and Emir Kusturica Gypsy style!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emir_Kusturica

😁😁

It's last the most fashionable trend in design cockpit!

😊😁

There should also be coins around the edges and metal curtains!

8_5.jpg

7_6.jpg

😁😁

B.R.

Serge 

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13 hours ago, wellsprop said:

 

 I'm not sure who has the Design Authority for the BAe 146 now. Possibly Airbus, following BAE SYSTEMS sale of it's civil aerospace division.

 

BAES still has responsibility for the 146/RJ and ATP. The Regional Aircraft division was wound up, not sold. It's stake in Airbus was sold to EADS and renamed Airbus UK.

 

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19 hours ago, leyreynolds said:

Which is owned by Airbus. And what was the last British designed aircraft - The Hawk perhaps? And are there any British designed airliners still in service?

Last wholly-British designed military aircraft were EAP (1985) and Taranis (2013). Both technology demonstrators for future collaborative programmes. No country outside US/China/Russia can now afford to develop military aircraft on its own. To its credit in 2018, the UK government commited itself to supporting an indigenous military aircraft design capability.

 

 

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For all the discussion here, I'm surprised there's been no mention of the NC.2501:

 

zgRZg4S.jpg

 

 

And it's British counterpart, the, um, beautiful Gallipoli...

 

MOj8y7h.jpg

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The Grumman XF5F Skyrocket! :blink:  In its defense, it was very fast, had a phenomenal climb rate, and excellent visibility.

xf5f-1-5a.jpg

 

 

It brought this cartoon to life. Clearly though, Northrup and Granville Brothers were far more literal in their realizations.

what-if-airplanes.jpg

 

Minicraft's 1/48 kit is actually quite nice!

xf5f-done2.jpg

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On 9/29/2020 at 4:36 AM, leyreynolds said:

Which is owned by Airbus. And what was the last British designed aircraft - The Hawk perhaps? And are there any British designed airliners still in service?

HS/BAe 146 and some HP/SA/BAe Jetstream 31s, 41s and BAe/Avro/HS748s and (maybe) Jetstream 61s.

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"Belphegor" was nick name for PZL M-15 not due to her ugly look (or not only) but due to sinister purpose which was discovered (guess?) by western experts as machine for chemical war, since nobody believed that  agriculture needs a jet machine, even under communist power...

Six pages and nobody noticed ugly canopies on fronts of Ju-88A/D, Do 17 Z, Ju 86 P/R, FW-189 etc. ?

 

Cheers

J-W

 

 

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On 10/5/2020 at 2:36 AM, dnl42 said:

The Grumman XF5F Skyrocket!


Very much off topic - I built one of these in a whiff scheme, as an aircraft of the San Theodoros Air Force (Tintin fans will get it...)!

 

 I really enjoyed building it, it’s a bit of a gem!

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