1/72 Arma Hobby Hurricane I x 3

[Troy Smith]

On 27/09/2020 at 09:15, Stew Dapple said:

I used the brighter pre-war blue roundels and stripes for Ian Gleed's 'Mighty A' although I have no evidence that the aircraft wore these except that it was a Gloster-built Hurricane and Gloster apparently were using the pre-war roundel colours perhaps as late as November 1940.

 

On 28/09/2020 at 05:56, Stew Dapple said:

A word about the markings used; several and perhaps the majority of the 32 Squadron Hurricanes photographed in July 1940 carried the GZ codes forward of the roundel on the starboard side, but a picture of GZ-Z coming in to land shows the individual aircraft code forward

the ONLY photo I have seen of a 32 Sq Hurricane starboard side in the battle, is GZ-Z.

There is a photo floating about of some fibreglass Hurricanes which show the opposite, at Hawkinge IIRC

@Heather Kay posted there whereabouts.

 

but closer inspection reveals detail like the tropical vents and knuckle type tailwheels, as well as the lead plane with a bullet Rotol and fishtail exhaust stacks, and the 8 high high N2532 serial , which are all wrong details.

 

There is a photo of a 32 Sq Hurricane captured, from June 1940, which while it has smaller codes, has the starboard side reading GZ-X

 

and later Mk.II's

 

show starboard to read like this.

The ONLY unit I have seen where Sq code running order varied was 616 Sq, and they even were using the same codes as 92 Sq , QJ.  The is a photo showing them QJ-* and *-QJ  !!!!! 

 

On 28/09/2020 at 05:56, Stew Dapple said:

I haven't added the red flashes on the nose of Ian Gleed's "Figaro" - a couple of photos clearly show that these were applied while the aircraft was still in the TLS prior to it being painted mostly black overall, but I am not convinced that the nose colours were there all along. I'm sure at some time I had a picture of Figaro on the ground with those markings absent but I can't find it in any of my books or on the internet so I have to accept a possibility that I made it up in a fever dream or something...

some photo are fairly lo-res and it's hard to make out.  

On 27/09/2020 at 09:15, Stew Dapple said:

I used the brighter pre-war blue roundels and stripes for Ian Gleed's 'Mighty A' although I have no evidence that the aircraft wore these except that it was a Gloster-built Hurricane and Gloster apparently were using the pre-war roundel colours perhaps as late as November 1940.

My take is this,  yes, Gloster did, and later in the Battle, they didn't get repainted.

But earlier, I think they did get repainted,  and I think LK-A did.... why....

because of this

 

note the wing in the foreground, with the badly flaking roundel, which is considerably lighter tone than LK-A in the background.

Note the barely visible noe flash.

But @Stew Dapple, since you have not not put in underwing roundels,  this could be before the flash as well,  

Note the non standard size and position of the underwing roundels

 

The 87 sq photos were all taken by 'Watty' Watson,  the whose plane was LK-G, I have a short monograph, Hurricane Squadron, No.87 Sq at war 1939-1941, by Perry Adams, which has these details

and now I have the serial which is either P2823 or maybe P2836, (I'm sure I have seen a better image than this)  the only ones that fit.  There are other photos of LK-G, not showing the serial...

 

the other pic from the in flight sequence is this, of note

 

note again the non standard underwing on LK-T, and how LK-Z has smaller code letters, which later arrivals at 87 sq have.

 

Note also the variations in fin stripes..

 

Hope of interest,  this info is floating around out there, but usually lacks captioning/narrative.   Perhaps more 87 Sq in the future? 

 

Very neat work on the kits, been very interesting doing mine,  kind of wish I had added upper wing only to the fuselage to work on the join by bending the wing....

 

I meant to get some done but spent some time doing kit box Jenga trying to find my slate ripper for a neighbour. 

 

cheers

T

[Stew Dapple]

12 hours ago, Johnson said:

Interesting to see you used the old Aeromaster decs. I used them many years ago to model the same plane (Revell Hurricane I think, still sitting on the shelf). I thought the decals were very good and sad that they're unavailable now.

 

Hi Charlie, yes I was pleasantly surprised that they functioned so well and it's a shame they are no longer trading as they did some interesting subjects. The quality of the transfers was always good, though the research sometimes a bit less so, which earned them the rather cruel nickname 'Errormaster' in some quarters. I was pleased with them and the results they gave, anyway.  

 

@Troy Smith some very interesting points raised there, thank you. With regards to 32 Squadron, from the pictures taken by Fox News on the 'Press Day' in July it is clear from the four or five aircraft pictured showing the starboard side that the squadron codes are forward of the roundel on the right-hand side, but equally GZ-Z shows that not all of them were - so the possibility exists that more than one aircraft carries the codes the other way round. As I mentioned, I don't know what Kagero's reference for this was; because I have never seen a starboard-side picture of GZ-B doesn't mean one doesn't exist, and I'm prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt... and I think it's fair to note that the aircraft pictured from the starboard side in the Fox News shots amount to less than half of the squadron so the possibility is not entirely remote.

 

Regarding 'Widge' Gleed's 'A', the red nose 'flashes' are clear in the second picture you posted and I believe they are present in the first and probably the third too (judging from the shadows from the tailplanes possibly the first and third were even taken on the same flight?) Aviaeology suggest that the flashes may have been added when Gleed got command of the squadron and had his Squadron Leader's pennant painted on. That would have been in December 1940 and the chap in just his shirtsleeves in the second picture would seem to contradict that - however the sun is very low and he may be Scottish (it seems to be a thing up here for young men to go around in a tee-shirt in anything less than blizzard conditions ) In any case the picture of 'A' without the flashes that I was thinking of was a ground-shot from the forward starboard quarter, but as I said I have not since found it in any of my books or on the internet so that will have to remain unproven at best and as evidence of a fevered mind at worst. As you note, I was attempting a representation of 'A' in July 1940 before the underwing roundels were re-applied in the second half of August.

 

As for the kits, yes I know what you mean about the wing-to-fuselage join; a certain amount of what my father would refer to as "Brute force and ignorance" was required on my part - next time I will follow @lasermonkey's advice and remove some of the sides of the rear bulkhead where they join the side tubing  

 

Oh yes, forgot to mention - Widge's Hurricane is finished, pics to come when it gets light  

 

 

Cheers,

 

Stew

[Troy Smith]

8 hours ago, Stew Dapple said:

With regards to 32 Squadron, from the pictures taken by Fox News on the 'Press Day' in July it is clear from the four or five aircraft pictured showing the starboard side that the squadron codes are forward of the roundel on the right-hand side, but equally GZ-Z shows that not all of them were

The only starboard image I have seen from that famous Fox film series is the photo of GZ-Z coming into land,  I'd be fascinated to see any more.

Always interested to know more.  Can you say where these have been published?

The photos were taken by the still photographer, the Fox Film unit were making a training film,  it wasn't a press day AFAIK.   

The only real press images I know of are the ones of 17 and 85 Sq at Debden in July 1940, and the ones of 501 Sq taking off, which was apparently filmed, though I have not seen the film.

 

Having code running order vary in a squadron is very unusual,  the only one I know of the 616 I mentioned.

sorry about rambling on,  I'm fascinated with piecing together these fragments of information, and by sharing and asking, to learn more.

 

Nearly forgot, the models look great! 

[Stew Dapple]

@Troy Smith Sorry to whet your appetite maybe in vain, I searched again and these might be the pictures I was thinking of, but if so then I have transposed left and right; these do look very like the pictures I had in mind, only facing the other way:

 

https://www.asisbiz.com/il2/Hurricane/RAF-32Sqn-GZ/pages/Hurricane-I-RAF-32Sqn-GZ-taxing-at-RAF-Hawkinge-29-Jul-1940-IWM-HU69116.html

 

https://www.asisbiz.com/il2/Hurricane/RAF-32Sqn-GZ/pages/Hurricane-I-RAF-32Sqn-GZB-P314x-CZK-GZT-Biggin-Hill-England-July-1940-01a.html

 

... and I'm sure you have seen those before. Not quite sure what happened there, I can remember the picture quite vividly, is this how dementia begins? 

 

If so I'd better get a move on; 'Widge' Gleed's "Mighty A" is ready for her close-up:

 

 

More pics in the Gallery here.

 

Just the finishing touches to add to Michael Crossley's aircraft and I'm done  

 

Cheers, 

 

Stew

[wimbledon99]

Looks lovely Stew! What did you think of the masks??

[Troy Smith]

1 hour ago, Stew Dapple said:

I can remember the picture quite vividly

There are plenty of profiles showing *-GZ on the starboard side,  there is the image above, and a warbird, neatly matching the fibreglass replicas

 

So easy enough for this to be an image in memory, especially as the images you linked are just so iconic,  but apart from the one image of GZ-Z,  all from the port side.   

 

It was only in the last few  years I became aware of the remarkably anarchic nature of RAF squadron codes,   which is even odder given the general regulation, and usually careful adherence to regulations of RAF markings in general.

I was quite surprised at this when I found out...

 

Some of these things take on a life of their own,  like the Kuttlewasher JX-E from the profile book.

 

Still, the important bit, your model reads  GZ-B on the starboard side

 

At least here it's on some interest.... "in Real Life" .. well, i'm sure you know what i mean....

[dogsbody]

1 hour ago, Troy Smith said:

There are plenty of profiles showing *-GZ on the starboard side,  there is the image above, and a warbird, neatly matching the fibreglass replicas

 

So easy enough for this to be an image in memory, especially as the images you linked are just so iconic,  but apart from the one image of GZ-Z,  all from the port side.   

 

It was only in the last few  years I became aware of the remarkably anarchic nature of RAF squadron codes,   which is even odder given the general regulation, and usually careful adherence to regulations of RAF markings in general.

I was quite surprised at this when I found out...

 

Some of these things take on a life of their own,  like the Kuttlewasher JX-E from the profile book.

 

Still, the important bit, your model reads  GZ-B on the starboard side

 

At least here it's on some interest.... "in Real Life" .. well, i'm sure you know what i mean....

 

Your photo is unviewable. Just that old flickering grey bar.

 

 

Chris

[Stew Dapple]

10 hours ago, wimbledon99 said:

Looks lovely Stew! What did you think of the masks??

 

Thanks mate  The masks were definitely worth the money, and they worked really well... I wasn't terribly happy to have to apply the Dark Earth over the Dark Green, but it turned out a good match to the tin lid anyway so not really a problem except for the small amount of anxiety it caused beforehand  Still not sure why they did it that way, it would have been no more difficult to make a mask set that covers the Dark Earth segments rather than the Dark Green, but I guess they had their reasons...

 

8 hours ago, Troy Smith said:

So easy enough for this to be an image in memory, especially as the images you linked are just so iconic,  but apart from the one image of GZ-Z,  all from the port side. 

 

It's frustrating though, I can still see the picture I remembered in my head as clear as day.... the thought that it might not exist outside my head is disconcerting, to say the least  

 

8 hours ago, Troy Smith said:

Still, the important bit, your model reads  GZ-B on the starboard side

 

Yes, that is some consolation  

 

6 hours ago, dogsbody said:

Your photo is unviewable. Just that old flickering grey bar.

 

It may have been this picture, or at least this aircraft:

 

https://warbirdaviation.co.uk/Profiles/hawker-hurricane-p2921-peter-monk-biggin-hill-heritage-hangar/

 

So, to business: Michael 'Red Knight' Crossley's Hurricane is done:

 

 

I'll upload some 'glamour shots' to the Gallery after work.

 

Cheers,

 

Stew

[wimbledon99]

Hat-trick!! And another beauty. Well done Stew

[Rabbit Leader]

They’ve all turned out wonderfully well Stu. Great testament to your patience building the same kit three times over with excellent final results. 

Cheers and well modelled.. Dave. 

[Stew Dapple]

Thanks very much gents  

 

 

Gallery pics are here.

 

And here they are all together:

 

 

That's me done with my Hurricanes then, as I said earlier in the thread I will certainly be building more (I have quite a backlog of decals that have been waiting for a really nice Hurricane kit and I think this is the one )... but I won't be building them for the Group Build, three is enough I think  I've got one final build on the go now, which should take me to - and hopefully no further than - the end of the GB on 31st October.

 

Thanks to everyone who joined in, thanks to everyone whose build I got some useful insights from whether I credited them for it or forgot to

 

It has, I'm please to say, been a hoot  

 

Cheers,

 

Stew

 

 

[dogsbody]

I don't know if it's on my end or yours, Stew, but I can't see any of your photos past this one:  Michael 'Red Knight' Crossley's Hurricane.

 

Everything else is just the grey bars. When I right-click and open in a new tab, there's just a black square. Postimage isn't working for me.

 

 

Wait! It's been about 6 minutes since I made the above statement and now the photos are visible. They all look great! Nice work, Stew!

 

 

 

 

Chris

[Valkyrie]

They are absolutely beautiful, great colours, great builds!

[Cookenbacher]

Brilliant trio Stew!

[CedB]

Seconded! Lovely work Stew, they turned out a treat!  

[franky boy]

Great work Stew. 
 

Ive just been catching up with your build. These Arma Hurricanes look like little gems. I’ve ordered myself the mk1 tropical kit so will soon find out for myself. 
 

James