77 Sqn Whitley, Chivenor, July 1942 - TSS colours?

[Simon]

Hello everyone

 

I'm just contemplating a future build, and want to do a Whitley of 77 Squadron in the period in which the Squadron was seconded to Coastal Command in 1942. From the 77 Sqn ORB it moved to Chivenor from Leeming in early May. No Ops were flown in May and the first Coastal Command sortie was on June 1st.

 

I just wanted to double-check if the Whitleys would have been repainted in the Temperate Sea Scheme EDSG/DSG/White colours? I'm looking to do Whitley V Z9462 KN-Y, which had an encounter with an Arado 196 on July 25th 1942.

 

Many thanks

 

Simon

[Graham Boak]

I would expect not.  There's never been any suggestion  (I've seen) that the Lancaster unit similarly seconded changed colours.  Units permanently transferred would change colours appropriately.  so unless Whitley enthusiasts  know any different..?.

[Simon]

Interesting Graham, thank you.

 

I see Xtradecal have 77 Sqn Whitley GR.VII Z6968 KN-A on their X72231 sheet, in TSS scheme, dated 'late 1941' but the Air Britain Whitley File has Z6968 as just serving with 612 Sqn. Hmmm...

 

Z6968 is one of the options in the Fly kit as WL-J, and there's a photo of it here:

 

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205207859

 

Simon

[brewerjerry]

Hi

    checking the Sq orb held at the NA  kew may bring some info

 

   if it was a local loan aircraft fron 612 to 77 it might not be in air brit serials 

 

    I would have thought it would need an ASV trained operator in the crew, so again maybe a mention in the Sq orb pages 

 

  cheers

    jerry

 

 

   

[Simon]

Hi Jerry

 

There's not much mentioned about the redeployment in the May 1942 ORB Form 540:

 

May 1942

No operations were carried out during May.

On 6th and 7th May the Squadron moved by air, road and rail from R.A.G. [sic] Station, LEEMING, to R.A.F. Station, CHIVENOR, Barnstaple, the rear party following on 8th.

From 13th May to the end of the month an intensive programme of training for the new type of work on which the Squadron was to be employed was carried out (copy of programme attached*). The Squadron completed its first operational sortie with Coastal Command on 1st June.

 

*not included in the Form 541, nor in the ORB Appendices unfortunately.

 

Regards

 

Simon

 

 

[rossm]

When 10 OTU were seconded to CC they don't seem to have changed colour - IIRC there's a photo of an all black one being recovered by the Germans in the Whitley File.

 

But 51 Squadron were seconded to Chivenor at the same time as 77 and there is a photo of one of their aircraft in "RAF Chivenor in Old Photos" - annoyingly my copy is 400 miles away but vague memory suggests that was in the white scheme. If so then a repaint seems likely - I think the photo might even be of an aircraft being repainted at Chivenor.

 

Here is that photo from the Chivenor book https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205210190 interestingly captioned as being at Gosport! If 51 sqdn aircraft were repainted there's a good chance 77 were I would think.

 

What I know about CC Whitleys can be found here http://hrmtech.com/SIG/coastal_whitley.asp

[Simon]

Thanks for the reply Ross, and the link to your site.

 

I'd come aross the photo of the 51 Sqn Whitley being repainted. Is the IWM caption is wrong and it is at Chivenor?

 

Regards

Simon

 

 

[rossm]

16 minutes ago, Simon said:

Thanks for the reply Ross, and the link to your site.

 

I'd come aross the photo of the 51 Sqn Whitley being repainted. Is the IWM caption is wrong and it is at Chivenor?

 

Regards

Simon

 

 

I don't know which is correct but it is in a book dedicated to photos of Chivenor. A major repaint might be done by an MU but Chivenor was a main CC base so would be likely to have all the necessary paint.

 

You would probably have a long wait but you could ask the RAFM for a copy of the movement card (Form 78) for Z9462 which might show a period at an MU.

[Simon]

Thanks again Ross. I've asked the RAF Museum about the possibility of getting hold of the Form 78 (as you say, could be a LONG wait...).

 

Meanwhile I've another Whitley candidate to consider, Whitley VII Z6966 WL-F of 612 Sqn at Reykjavik in February 1942.

 

Regards

 

Simon

[Simon]

Well, after four months, I got a copy of the Form 78 movement card courtesy of the RAF Museum, to whom I'm very grateful indeed.

 

I think it reads as follows (not 100% clear, but I reckon it's right):

 

6 M.U.  - 15.12.41

77 Sqn - 5.5.42

Cat. E - 26.7.42 [the day after the Arado encounter, and clearly not Cat. E]

R.O.S. Cat. AC - 26.7.42 [Repaired on Site]

77 Sqn - 12.9.42

44 Sqn - 30.3.43

44 M.U. - 4.4.43

A. Whit. R.O.S. 8.5.43

44 [?] M.U. - 27.6.43

 

So no visits to an M.U. while at 77 Squadron.

 

Simon

[HOUSTON]

77 Squadron history 1937 – 1945 | 77 Squadron Association https://77squadron.org.uk/history/77-squadron-history-1937-1945/

 

 

[HOUSTON]

77 Squadron history 1937 – 1945 | 77 Squadron Association https://77squadron.org.uk/history/77-squadron-history-1937-1945/

 

http://www.pilotfriend.com/photo_albums/timeline/ww2/A.W.38 Whitley.htm