Reboxing, who makes what?

[Doggy]

I was reading that some airfix spitfires are the same kit as Eduard. So who actually makes them?

 

I'm also told revell sometimes box Japanese aircraft, and the Japanese company rebox revell kits. Can you tell once opening the box where it originated from?

 

I've recently bought some zvedza kits and I've not been overly impressed and going forward I would like to avoid them if possible. I wouldn't like any nasty surprises if I buy one manufacturer only to find the contents to be inferior to what I expected. 

 

Many thanks

[Chimpion]

15 minutes ago, Doggy said:

I was reading that some airfix spitfires are the same kit as Eduard. So who actually makes them?

 

I'm also told revell sometimes box Japanese aircraft, and the Japanese company rebox revell kits. Can you tell once opening the box where it originated from?

 

I've recently bought some zvedza kits and I've not been overly impressed and going forward I would like to avoid them if possible. I wouldn't like any nasty surprises if I buy one manufacturer only to find the contents to be inferior to what I expected. 

 

Many thanks

You can find out before opening the box (better still, before buying) by searching for the kit on www.scalemates.com. Sometimes the plastic is marked with the original tool manufacturer, e.g. the 1:24 Revell Bentley Blower has a Heller copyright notice in the plastic.

Don't rule out a manufacturer because of one bad kit, especially if it's a very old tooling. Most manufacturers sell good and bad kits, and they don't warn you on the box which one you're getting!

You can always search for reviews or builds here or on Youtube or another forum to get an idea what the kit is kike to build before you buy.

[Work In Progress]

Yes, search on Scalemates

[Mattlow]

I find the easiest way to get to what I want on Scalemates is to go to Google and type in the kit you want to find out about - say 1/48 Airfix Spitfire V . You'll usually find that the first or second listed site is Scalemates and it'll take you straight to the page you want.

 

There's a very long history of one manufacturer's kits being re-boxed in another's packaging often through a licencing agreement, but sometimes due to companies going bust and another taking on the moulds.

 

This is a nice search. It covers the history of the Impact Fairy Flycatcher all the way from 1968 through 2017 (still a decent kit as well). https://www.scalemates.com/kits/pyro-p610-100-fairey-flycatcher--316936

 

The other useful thing is that Scalemates will, if you scroll down the page, link you to any reviews that have been found for the kit in that box. Click on the 'timeline' for another boxing and you'll find other reviews for that iteration of the kit.

 

HTH

 

Matt

[Doggy]

Thanks chaps.

[AltcarBoB]

I wouldn't damn Zvezda out of hand. I am just putting the finishing touches on a Zvezda 1/72 Pe-2 Peschka and I think it's a very fine kit. The only parts needing any real sanding to fit were the wing trailing edges. The interior is particularly good and took me quite a few hours to get all parts fitted.

[Gorby]

2 hours ago, Doggy said:

I've recently bought some zvedza kits and I've not been overly impressed

Zvezda's earlier kits can be more than a little challenging to build, but their latest stuff is really excellent - almost as good as Tamiya for a fraction of the price.

Again, Scalemates is the best place to see when the kit was tooled:

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/

[dnl42]

Reboxed kits can have a different price point than the original manufacturer's boxing. There may also be different markings to sway you to one or another. Scalemates will also indicate if new parts, new decals, or just a different box for the same manufacturer.

 

Sometimes, those more difficult kits can still be the best. Amodel's 1/144 Lancaster is an example that has appeared in a couple of recent builds here. I do like Amodel kits--they build character!

[Doggy]

The zvedza la5 was ok but the mig3 was mince.

I recently got a ju88 and it looks ok.

[John Thompson]

Don't blame Zvezda for those - the La-5 originated with Italeri away back when it was still called "Italiaeri" and the MiG-3 came from a long-defunct outfit called Cap Croix du Sud, also via Italeri. The MiG-3 as you discovered is probably in the running for Worst Kit of All Time. When Italeri reboxed that one I was fool enough to buy three of them sight unseen, thinking it was an Italeri original, and sight unseen is the way they'll stay. More recent, real Zvezda kits (even try any of the 1/72 quick-assembly ones - Yak-3, Bf-109F, FW-190, etc., but it also applies to their general run of products) are among the best.

 

John

[cossack52]

Zvezda have a mixed bag of lots in their catalogue,many of them from the old Russian companies. However, their new moulds are up there with anybody's ; e.g. The 1/48 Pe2, La5 , yak 3 and the 1/72 mil 24 , mil26. Revell re box a few of their newer kits ,and also special hobby , eduard , and hasegawa

[Doggy]

When I look at what companies offer very little catches my eye. 

 

I'm trying to do at least one of most of ww2 aircraft, although I've done multiple 109s, 190s etc in 1/72. I like weird German planes but a lot seem hard to get.

I was going to ask in another thread about production runs. I remember in the 80s I could get kits I'm struggling to find now. P38 is a good example of that, I've seen a few on eBay but I don't want to pay too much for a poor older kit.

[alt-92]

9 hours ago, Doggy said:

I was reading that some airfix spitfires are the same kit as Eduard.

^^ Still curious to know what you mean with that. 

 

It helps answering your questions if you could be a bit more specific. Otherwise, you'll get generic answers that might leave room for further confusion

 

[Doggy]

1 minute ago, alt-92 said:

^^ Still curious to know what you mean with that. 

I was reading another forum today and someone asked what was the best spitfire kit. One guy said get the airfix xix or the Eduard, it's the same kit in both boxes.

[alt-92]

55 minutes ago, Doggy said:

One guy said get the airfix xix or the Eduard, it's the same kit in both boxes.

 

Right.

Eduard hasn't released a Griffon Spit, nor a Photo-recce specific model*. Which the PR.XIX is. 
Sounds like your answer-man is confusing Eduard's reboxing of Hasegawa or other manufacturers with their own mould Spits.

 

_{*I wish! Make it a PR.XI please, 1/48!}

Edited June 13, 2020 by alt-92

[Doggy]

I'm trying to find the thread in my history but I stumbled across it by accident.

[alt-92]

Back to your original question, and to show that even Airfix has repop'd other moulds:
The Vista origins of the Fairey Fulmar.

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/airfix-a02008-fairey-fulmar-mk-i-ii--147651

 

You can see that these moulds have traveled somewhat:

Revell, Airfix, Smer, MasterCruft, and AZmodel. 

some moulds (ie. the steel forms in which the plastic is injected) get sold on, some are hired/lent, and in the case of FROG for instance disappeared east to the Soviet Union. 

Why that happens? Sometimes because a brand decides it is cheaper to buy/hire that set for a run, sometimes they order a run from the brand that owns the mould to repackage it (like Eduard does). 

Sometimes, the original company/brand gets sold off, merged or just goes defunct.

Recently, Hobby2000 re-released several ex-Hasegawa kits (Beaufighter, Stuka, Avenger, Buffalo).

[Doggy]

1 minute ago, alt-92 said:

Back to your original question, and to show that even Airfix has repop'd other moulds:
The Vista origins of the Fairey Fulmar.

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/airfix-a02008-fairey-fulmar-mk-i-ii--147651

 

You can see that these moulds have traveled somewhat:

Revell, Airfix, Smer, MasterCruft, and AZmodel. 

some moulds (ie. the steel forms in which the plastic is injected) get sold on, some are hired/lent, and in the case of FROG for instance disappeared east to the Soviet Union. 

Why that happens? Sometimes because a brand decides it is cheaper to buy/hire that set for a run, sometimes they order a run from the brand that owns the mould to repackage it (like Eduard does). 
Recently, Hobby2000 re-released several ex-Hasegawa kits (Beaufighter, Stuka, Avenger, Buffalo).

That's a good explanation.

 

Is there anyway to see what company is making what?

A P38 lighting for example?

[alt-92]

As stated above, Scalemates can help. 
It's not complete, but a pretty good indicator. Use the filters on the right to get what you want.

[Doggy]

I'm struggling a little bit to follow scale mates. From my deductions revell made a P38 in 2009, but have they stopped? Why stop? And will they start again?

[Graham Boak]

Which company makes which kit varies every year.  The days when you could walk into a model shop and buy every product Airfix ever produced (or very nearly) have long gone.  Kits are produced in short runs (compared with the old days) with very little residual stock retained.  If you are interested in a particular model of a particular subject you must buy it when you see it.  For a good (though not exhaustive) list of current and most recent kits look at Hannants.  For older kits try the companies specialising in second-hand kits - Kingkit being perhaps the most notable.

 

The Revell P-38 dates back to a lot earlier than 2009, and it was absent from their production runs for many years in the meantime.  This is fairly typical of the way things are.  You could also consider Dragon and Hasegawa P-38s.   A number of P-38 variants are available from RS but these are cottage-industry kits (if generally pretty good) and the P-38 is generally regarded as challenging.  

[alt-92]

It's not like manufacturers make one kit, right? 
Think of it this way: there are 40 active items in your catalogue. Printing them day in, day out doesn't really make sense - you'd have to switch between moulds every time.

So what do you do?

You set up a run of a kit anywhere between 5.000 and 20.000 depending on your expectation of sales over X period.

On to the next one. You could also hire an injection moulding specialist company to do it for you.
Then you have to plan your release schedule and arrange for that external company to do the moulding at a certain time.
 

So, back to that P-38 of yours. That production run of 15.000 is now sold after 3 years, and you've seen the sales figures drop off in the last year. 

Do you restart a run again, or do you decide to use that capacity for a new kit?

 

[Doggy]

Thanks for explaining, it saves me starting another thread, they were my next questions lol.

[Muzz]

56 minutes ago, alt-92 said:

 

Right.

Eduard hasn't released a Griffon Spit, nor a Photo-recce specific model*. Which the PR.XIX is. 
Sounds like your answer-man is confusing Eduard's reboxing of Hasegawa or other manufacturers with their own mould Spits.

 

_{*I wish! Make it a PR.XI please, 1/48!}

According to Scalemates Eduard has done a boxing of the Airfix kit around 2008!

 

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/airfix-a05119-supermarine-spitfire-prxix--174732

[alt-92]

The 1996 Mk.22/24 low-back.

Which most recently was done as A06101A in 2018 (I have that boxing, so can compare)

Hardly the same as a PR.XIX  and not on the same level as their current releases. 

That original comparison is a bit like putting a Morris Marina next to a BMW 1 series and calling them equal.