modelling minion Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 Sorry, I can't help with the cockpit pics Pete. Your idea of copying the undercarriage from the other kits is a good one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 11, 2020 Author Share Posted June 11, 2020 I think I might be lazy and cheat a bit. The cockpit of the Italeri 217K is somewhat better, and whilst I was checking it I noticed I had a couple of bits missing, so I have ordered another one from e-Bay. Once that arrives, I can "borrow" some of the parts for the cockpit and undercarriage from the old kit which could save me a lot of work. I presume that is allowed? Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 11, 2020 Share Posted June 11, 2020 Works for me mate, its like you're building two kits at once . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 11, 2020 Author Share Posted June 11, 2020 1 minute ago, modelling minion said: Works for me mate, its like you're building two kits at once . Don't tempt me - the thought had crossed my mind, though the K could not be entered in this GB of course! Cheers Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 14, 2020 Author Share Posted June 14, 2020 Prigress is slow, but I am getting there. I have modified the Port undercarriage bay (on the right in the pic below). As I mentioned earlier, Airfix wanted the u/c to be retractable so they just provided the main vertical legs, which were "trapped" in the projecting "lug" you can see in the left of this pic. I have cut the "lug" out and inserted suitably modified parts form the Italeri kit, which are light grey compared with the blue of the kit. I will do the other one later. I have also made a start on the cockpit, and reamed out the hole for the turret as the Italeri one is bigger. I will show you the cockpit in a day or so when I have finished it - it is quite different to the Airfix one though whether or not it is accurate is another matter. The pics I have, including the ones kindly sent by @Jinxman do not show the seats very well except for the rear one, so I am assuming Italeri are close - at least their layout makes sense, but more of that later. Cheers Pete 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 Nice work on the wheel well Pete, can I see some additional work going on in the cockpit area? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 14, 2020 Author Share Posted June 14, 2020 You certainly can but it is not finished yet! The front of the Airfix fuselage is not quite as wide as the Italeri one so some surgery has been required, but more on that when it is finished in a day or two (I hope) - my other half wants to paint my study so things could get complicated. Cheers Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 8 hours ago, PeterB said: my other half wants to paint my study so things could get complicated. Make sure you move or cover all your models Pete, you don't want blobs of magnolia ruining your camouflage schemes! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) Too darned right - they will be shuttled to a safe place in small batches so this will be a fairly long job. Looks like it will be a pale blue close to the later version of RLM65 at the moment, though my wife chose it so that is coincidental. Still trying to work out where to put the nav's seat at the moment as not a single pic shows it. Probably further back than the place Italeri put it as the nose of the K had totally different glazing etc. Pete Edited June 15, 2020 by PeterB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) The Do 217-E2 had a crew of 4 – Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer who also operated any free mounted guns in the nose glazing, Radio Operator who manned the various upper guns at the rear of the cockpit, and a Gunner in the ventral bulge to operate the rear firing gun. They were as in most German bombers all grouped together at the front to the plane. Airfix provide all 4 figures, but Italeri only 2. This is the cockpit Airfix provide with the pilot and navigator seated side by side and the radio operator immediately behind them on a flat floor. As you can see I have found the drop tanks but I will not be using them. If I fit tanks at all I will use spares from one of my Fujimi Me 110 kits which are rather more accurate. Italeri provide a floor with several levels, with the navigator right in the nose, the pilot further back with a sheet of armour behind his seat, and the radio operator at the rear of the cockpit. Because of the access well for the ventral gunner, the seat for the radio operator is mounted on a frame over the gap, which presumably pivoted. From there he can get at the radio equipment on the side and rear walls and also reach up into the turret, though I think he would have to move to get at the guns sticking out of the rear of the canopy, which are a bit redundant as the E2 introduced the turret. I am not sure where exactly the navigator went in the E2 as his seat is not shown in any of the pics I have. I suspect it was not as far forward as in Italeri's K version so have mounted his seat nearer the pilot. Looks a bit better in real life! I have added side and rear extensions to the floor for the radio op to stand on, and made a rear bulkhead. I have also fitted some side instrument panels and radio bits and bobs to make the cockpit more cluttered – I make no claims for accuracy! In real life the frame supporting the radio ops seat was more “spider like”. Airfix provide a shallow instrument panel to go under the windscreen and a straight control column with a wheel. In real life the right end of the IP angled back but I have not bothered. I have however added the large compass (at least that is what I think it is) below the panel as it was a very noticeable item with a white face and a black plane painted on it. Italeri provide the correct “cranked” column with the wheel offset but I have left off the small quadrant IP attached to it as I think that was only in the later versions with the fully glazed nose - there would be nowhere for the normal IP to go. I cut the bottom off Airfix's turret base so the radio op could access the turret gun. I will be using a combination of Italeri guns and a resin aftermarket MGFF in the nose, but more on that later. I have fettled the other wheel well and the dust on the nacelle comes from filing off some ejection pin stubs on the exhausts. Just about ready to close up the fuselage now I think, though first I will add some card to help fill the stand slot. Should move a bit faster from now on. Cheers Pete Edited June 15, 2020 by PeterB 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 Wow Pete, that is some top rate work on the cockpit mate, really nice! It certainly looks a lot busier than the cockpit that Airfix provide. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) Thanks, Suppose I will have to do something similar with the K as and when I build it as it has even more glazing! At least I should have a bit more width to play with - could not get a side console in the Airfix cockpit as I had to take 2mm off the Italeri floor. Just realised that the exhaust fairings I was filing down this afternoon are flame dampers so the kit is of a plane fitted for night work. Beginning to sound like KG2 Holzhammer rather than KG40. Oh well, they have quite a nice badge too, as indeed do KG 100. Speaking of glazing, the Airfix nose is wrong - it was not symmetrical. The Port side is about right but the glazing should extend further back both on the Starboard side and underneath. I have the accurate Falcon nose glazing, but unfortunately that is designed to convert the Italeri Do 217K-1 kit to a Do 217 E and is too big, so I have not bothered - it is after all a kit I built as a kid and the mould is 60 years old and I built it in around 1964! Cheers Pete Later - some KG 40 planes had the exhaust mufflers so that option remains open - I just did not particularly want one with black undersurfaces - we will see! May have to use artistic modeller's license. Edited June 15, 2020 by PeterB 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 17, 2020 Author Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) Glued together and now it is time to prime. In the background you can see my old Airfix Ju52/3M from around the same time (1964). As mentioned previously I am moving kits out of my study as my wife wants to paint it, so the 52/3 has come down off its shelf ready to move. Airfix wanted it painted in "olive green" over "pale blue" but I used Humbrol Authentic RLM 70/71 over 65. It has "weathered" a bit over the years and smoke from my pipe does not help. Even though it has a corrugated surface and the decals went straight on to matt paint with no varnish either before or after, they are still there, albeit only just - doubt that would happen with modern decals! Unfortunately, one of the props is missing so I have put a request on the "wanted" section. Cheers Pete Edited June 17, 2020 by PeterB 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dansk Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 Both look great Pete. The Dornier will be a phoenix from the ashes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewy Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 That looks a lot more scarier than my stork did , nice job peter 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 She really is taking shape now Pete, a superb resurrection. Tante-Ju looks very nice too, long been one of favourite aircraft and I've been lucky enough to fly in one! And no I didn't jump out of it part way through. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 18, 2020 Author Share Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) Thanks MM, I don't suppose it is too accurate but the old Airfix 52/3M was certainly value for money - wheels with or without spats, and skid or tailwheel, alternative floats, plus hatches. The only things missing are the Kondor Haube (I think that is what the blister mounter gun behind the cockpit was called) and a minesweeping ring, oh and of course different markings for the Civil and early/mid/late Luftwaffe versions - there was just the set as on my build and some Swiss ones! If they were not going for silly prices I might even consider building another one. Cheers Pete Edited June 18, 2020 by PeterB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 19, 2020 Author Share Posted June 19, 2020 As you can see I have given it a coat of Halford's grey plastic primer and applied Humbrol Acrylic 243/244 aka RLM 72/73 freehand. I have heard complaints about this brand of paint, and indeed have had some problems myself as it is sometimes too thick and the component colours sometimes separate very quickly – seems to vary between different colours – their PRU Blue is a real pain at times. However a few drops of Humbrol Acylic thinners and a really good stir often makes a lot of difference, and as wide a flat brush as possible helps a lot. The pattern is copied from a supposedly official paint plan in Hikoki's book on Luftwaffe paint schemes by Ullmann, and matches pretty well various profiles I have, though at least one has the colours reversed. Pre war, it seems that as with the RAF, there were at least 4 schemes – with the options of a mirror image pattern and reversed colours, although the Monogram book by Merrick & Hitchcock on Luftwaffe colours says that after the start of the war the alternative schemes were less common – as a point of interest they also mention 6 optional schemes using the earlier 3 colour upper surfaces and that manufacturers were not compelled to follow the “official” drawing exactly. I have used Humbrol paint as, rightly or wrongly, there seems to be a little more contrast between the shades than the equivalent Xtracolour paints I have and I think that looks better. As stated previously the “Maritime” 72/73 scheme was low contrast when new (unlike the 70/71 scheme as on Tony W's 217 earlier in this thread), though it did fade to produce a more noticeable difference according to pics. I can certainly see that a B&W photo taken in poor light, could, depending on the film emulsion and the age of the paint, suggest a single upper colour as per Airfix's original paint instructions. Of course, as I found when I used the same paint on my Bv 138C last year, the gloss varnish coat for the decs followed by the slightly glossy matt varnish will deepen the colours quite a bit. Daylight makes quite a difference too! Only one coat so far so maybe a second coat and certainly quite a bit more touching up and straightening/sharpening up the splinter to do before the RLM 65 goes on. I was not too impressed with the Mr Hobby/Colour H315 (ended up mixing my own) on the 138 so I might just use Hu 65, at least as an undercoat - we will see. As I understand it the RLM 65 colour changed part way through the war, the early version being quite similar to Hu65, but the later version was darker and less "vibrant" if you know what I mean. Onwards and upwards! Pete 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliffB Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 On 6/15/2020 at 12:11 PM, PeterB said: Looks like it will be a pale blue close to the later version of RLM65 at the moment, though my wife chose it so that is coincidental. My wife has just chosen RLM02 for our living room. Cheers 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelling minion Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 Nice work on your Dornier, good brush skills on show. I like you flying clog too, a great job on a fascinating aircraft. Do we need to start getting worried that more members are using Luftwaffe colours in their homes? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinxman Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 1 hour ago, modelling minion said: Do we need to start getting worried that more members are using Luftwaffe colours in their homes? I think the use of the RLM colour chart is ok, however when identification codes, stencilling and squadron motifs start appearing, it is time to worry... 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 Great stuff Pete I was given the old Supermodels SM81 which someone had assembled completely adding all the decals without any paint at all ! Inspired by your refurbishment i wonder how i could partially dismantle it, to allow it to be painted inside and out then to find replacement decals... How did you dismantle it without damaging it ? cheers Pat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted June 20, 2020 Author Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) Hi Pat, Depends on how well it was built and what glue was used. With mine I first strip the paint and decs off with oven cleaner such as Mr Muscle and that sometimes seems to weaken the joints. After that it is a case of gentle pressure assisted by a craft knife. Sometimes it works, but as I found with my 217 and also my SM79, some of the joints can be reluctant. The wings on both are stuck "like sh*t to an Army blanket" as my father used to say - did not matter on the 217 as they are well aligned, but with the 79 it was the wings I wanted to get off as they droop. In that case I will probably have to use a razor saw to cut part way through and then insert a wedge to correct the dihedral - that or buy another kit when it is re-released later this year. Don't know what type of glue I used on the 217, but the joints have a "yellow" deposit on them. As I recall I normally used either Britfix or Aifix cement but I did also use Joy I think and later Humbrol? The fuselage joints are usually not that good on my old builds and I had no filler for many years. Having only a small contact area - unlike wings, they tend to come apart fairly easily in most cases. The first 2 kits I stripped and repainted many years ago were my DC 3 and B 24, and in those days I used a bottle of cheap nail varnish remover. I moistened a cloth or maybe kitchen towel with it and laboriously rubbed the paint until it came off, but had to be careful as I think it attacks plastic, so I worked on a small section and rinsed it off quickly with water. Oven cleaner works better but it is unpleasant stuff to use so take care. Best to wear rubber gloves and do it somewhere well ventilated or Mrs J will complain about the stink. Spray it on and stick the kit in a plastic bag, seal it and leave it overnight before rinsing it off - watch out that you do not flush any loose bits down the drain! It may take 2 or 3 goes. NB this only works with enamels - no idea how you get acrylics off. I did try Hannants "Purisol" on the Humbrol acrylic on the Do 217 which I used last year as a test mule for the Bv 138 but it did nothing so it probably only works with fresh unvarnished paint. Meths might work and I seem to remember reading in a post that bleach also does the trick. For your SM 81 I have a sheet of decs for SM 79 together with a Microscale one of generic Italian national markings, and so could probably let you have something appropriate as they were about the same size. At least it sounds like it wont need much stripping! On the subject of house paint. one of the other colours my wife is thinking about looks close to Light Gull Gray, and years back we got some paint matched to LNER Garter Blue (as on some A4 locos) for one wall in my son's bedroom - it was either that or LMS Crimson Lake, but I thought that might be a bit too much (he originally wanted it in the "Blood and Custard" scheme as on early BR coaches)! Good luck. Pete Edited June 20, 2020 by PeterB 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dansk Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, CliffB said: My wife has just chosen RLM02 for our living room. Cheers ‘Tranquil dawn’ is such a beautiful and romantic, almost poetic way of writing Luftwaffe Grey 😁 (edit: sorry for another thread hijack) Edited June 20, 2020 by Dansk 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandboof Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 Just caught up on this Awesome work I have a mode; graveyard which was saved from being binned so seeing what you have done with this motivation is kicking in .Looking forward to more Martin H 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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