Airfix/Amodel Comet 4B cross kit

[The Tomohawk Kid]

I'm curious to know if anyone has attempted this cross kit as a way of getting around the Amodel short fuselage? I have pulled both kits out of thto build pile but got no further than tossing around the idea in my head.

 

By the way I want to build an Olympic Comet to that end the Airfix decals look a bit 'strange to me', any more knowledgeable wish to comment?

 

Tommo.

[Skodadriver]

Strangely enough I was having thoughts along similar lines. I haven't seen the A-Model kit in the flesh (so to speak) but provided you can figure out some way of joining the Airfix fuselage to the A-Model wings it should be do-able. A few years ago I built a hybrid Roden/Minicraft DC-6B which involved joining the Minicraft fuselage to the Roden wing and it's amazing what plastic sheet, Milliput and determination can achieve! The critical dimension for the Comets will be the width of the fuselage. Any significant difference between the two kits will lead to problems with the wing roots which might make the project unworkable. Most other things can be bodged.

 

I haven't seen the decals in the current Airfix kit but if you are concerned about their accuracy alternatives are available from Ray at 26.

 

Dave G 

[The Tomohawk Kid]

2 hours ago, Skodadriver said:

Strangely enough I was having thoughts along similar lines. I haven't seen the A-Model kit in the flesh (so to speak) but provided you can figure out some way of joining the Airfix fuselage to the A-Model wings it should be do-able. A few years ago I built a hybrid Roden/Minicraft DC-6B which involved joining the Minicraft fuselage to the Roden wing and it's amazing what plastic sheet, Milliput and determination can achieve! The critical dimension for the Comets will be the width of the fuselage. Any significant difference between the two kits will lead to problems with the wing roots which might make the project unworkable. Most other things can be bodged.

 

I haven't seen the decals in the current Airfix kit but if you are concerned about their accuracy alternatives are available from Ray at 26.

 

Dave G 

 

Great mind think alike, I have already ordered a set of Comet 4B Olympic decals from Ray @26Decals The Airfix decals are just odd and the Amodel ones are an exercise in frugality, but may come in useful.

 

I have lots of projects on the go at the mo - if I get the chance tomorrow I'll break them out and see if its a viable cross kit. But, I have a sneaking suspicion its not. In the meantime if anyone has had a go at this I'm intrigued to how it went and what the pitfalls are.

 

Tommo.

[Turbofan]

4 hours ago, Skodadriver said:

Most other things can be bodged.

Bodged David? Bodged!!? Surely you mean 'made to work'....?

Cheers,

Ian

[Paul J]

Not possible... the fuselages for example of the two kits are different in size. The A Model one is about the plastic thickness smaller(undersized all over in fact) than the Airfix one!!!   And the wing of the A Model one is still a 4B as per Airfix but with the wing tanks!!!

[The Tomohawk Kid]

10 hours ago, Paul J said:

Not possible... the fuselages for example of the two kits are different in size. The A Model one is about the plastic thickness smaller(undersized all over in fact) than the Airfix one!!!   And the wing of the A Model one is still a 4B as per Airfix but with the wing tanks!!!

My Amodel kit is sans wing pinion tanks, which is correct for 4B. If memory serves it was the 4 and 4C that had pinion tanks. I know the fuselage of the Amodel kit is too short for 4B (hence my reason for considering the cross kit) and is closer to the length of the 4. I wasn't aware it was deficient in any other aspect, but I say that having not checked.

 

Tommo.

Edited May 30, 2020 by The Tomohawk Kid

[Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies]

I think the "answer" is a little closer to home:

 

http://www.welshmodels.co.uk/skyliner.html

 

or in 1/72

http://www.welshmodels.co.uk/CLS72.html

[skippiebg]

Amodel's Comets are indeed rather underscale throughout (maybe 1/150-ish). Another defect is that the 4C has the same span as the 4B, instead of being larger. Amodel's detailing is nice and the nose and tail fin shapes are spot-on as opposed to those of Airfix. Perhaps best built as-is unless one is a scale fanatic.

 

The Olympic Comets wore two liveries. Airfix's decals aren't at all odd or wrong -- they simply represent the earlier (and much dowdier, as it happens) of the two liveries. Most Olympic Comet photos show the latter livery, hence people's doubts about Airfix' veracity. The latter livery is, if I remember right, also available from Nick Webb at Classic Airlines.

Edited May 30, 2020 by skippiebg

[The Tomohawk Kid]

I did break out both kits today and did a quick tack together courtesy of Mr. Tamyia, it does look like it may be possible certainly width wise, There is however a big fillet on the underside fuselage > wing join to deal with, which possibly could be addressed by using a cut and shut from the Airfix kit.  Is it worth it? I'm still toying with the idea particularly as I have a number of active projects on the go currently and I certainly would like at least one and ideally two to complete before I start another one. Therefore I'll mull it over.

 

By odd, its as much as the proportions of the Airfix decals as much as anything else that look wrong to me, the flight deck glazing looks to be oversized by quite a margin and possibly the cabin glazing too, but that's less obvious. The silver trim, whilst in reality it might be present on the prototype I'm less sure it would be as obvious as Airfix make out in 1/144, all this adds to being odd in my view.  As to the colour I bow to Mr. Skippiebg  but, in strong sunlight (see the photo below) the cheat line decal looks half a blue shade off matt black and in not so good light it does look distinctly matt black, is that correct? From the swatch I have of 'midnight blue' it would appear to dark to me. I have ordered a set of decals from Ray @26Decals and they should be with me early next week.

 

 

Amodel decals top Airfix below.

 

 

Top view of the match up.

 

 

Underside view.

 

 

Tommo.

Edited May 30, 2020 by The Tomohawk Kid

[The Tomohawk Kid]

5 hours ago, Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies said:

I think the "answer" is a little closer to home:

 

http://www.welshmodels.co.uk/skyliner.html

 

or in 1/72

http://www.welshmodels.co.uk/CLS72.html

 

I have at least 4 1/72 Welsh Comets 2x 4B, Comet 1 and a 4C so I don't really want to add to that little pile, particularly as I think I may have another 4B lurking somewhere else in my unorganised store.

 

I was aware that Welsh make a 1/144 4B but I have the Amodel and Airfix kits to hand and it would make sense to use them even it means a bit of modelling. If I was to go with a new kit of 4B I would probably plump for Authentic Airlines kit, but they are currently out of production at the moment.

 

Tommo.

Edited May 30, 2020 by The Tomohawk Kid

[Eric Mc]

Here's my finished build of the Airfix kit using the Airfix decals. I'll let you judge if you think they are realistic or not.

 

 

[skippiebg]

1 hour ago, The Tomohawk Kid said:

There is however a big fillet on the underside fuselage > wing join to deal with, which possibly could be addressed by using a cut and shut from the Airfix kit.

Exactly in that place the Amodel is utterly right and the Airfix is utterly wrong. Best just fill the gap with Milliput if you want to go ahead with cross-kitting.

 

On the decals, the cheatline should be BEA black as the Olympic machines were in fact leased from BEA. I don't have my Comet to hand to confirm whether that is right or wrong. The Amodel decals are typographically wrong both as regards the Olympic title and the registration. Airfix wins on that front. The 26 decals sheet is right for the later Olympic scheme and I'd say you've done the right thing to get it.

[The Tomohawk Kid]

2 hours ago, Eric Mc said:

Here's my finished build of the Airfix kit using the Airfix decals. I'll let you judge if you think they are realistic or not.

 

 

 

Top banana build of the venerable war horse.

 

However, its does confirm my suspicions about the Airfix decals tho'.

 

Tommo.

[Eric Mc]

The outline around the flight deck windows is too pronounced. Also, Aiirfix only supplies the silver outlines. They expect you to fit the clear plastic and lay the decal on top. I prefer decals for airliner windows so what I did was fitted the clear plastic, filled any gaps and sanded and blended the clear plastic area into the nose. After priming the entire model,  I then painted the window area NATO black as a background for the window outlines. Also, the BEA logo is on a white background. I would have preferred it to be clear as then the white behind the red "BEA" letters  would have been the actual white paint of the roof.

[The Tomohawk Kid]

19 hours ago, Eric Mc said:

The outline around the flight deck windows is too pronounced. Also, Aiirfix only supplies the silver outlines. They expect you to fit the clear plastic and lay the decal on top. I prefer decals for airliner windows so what I did was fitted the clear plastic, filled any gaps and sanded and blended the clear plastic area into the nose. After priming the entire model,  I then painted the window area NATO black as a background for the window outlines. Also, the BEA logo is on a white background. I would have preferred it to be clear as then the white behind the red "BEA" letters  would have been the actual white paint of the roof.

 

I too prefer decals for glazing in 1/144, there are some really good representation out there now.  As I said well done on a great build, but those decals are not for me which is a bit of a kick in the stones, as that is only reason I bought the Airfix kit, doh!

 

Tommo.

Edited May 31, 2020 by The Tomohawk Kid

[fatalbert]

20 hours ago, Eric Mc said:

Here's my finished build of the Airfix kit using the Airfix decals. I'll let you judge if you think they are realistic or not.

 

 

That is truly beautiful 😍

[Eric Mc]

I wish I had some BEA logos for the steps.

[The Tomohawk Kid]

The @26Decals Olympic decals arrived today - great service from Ray as one can see from the pic below they are a quantum leap forward on the other two.

 

 

Tommo.

[skippiebg]

Tommo, I've just opened up an Airfix Comet 4B and compared it to an Amodel one. Amodel is almost exactly 1cm too short (making it 1/149-ish scale in length), but exactly right in span. Personally, I'd simply stretch it using plastic card and Milliput, with lengths of sprue to keep it aligned. Needs 5mm fore and 5mm aft of the wing. Easy-peasy! I defer to your own views on that, naturally

 

The 26 decal looks tasty, by the way,! but again the brightwork window surrounds look a tad over the top... Of course, they might be less pronounced in the flesh.

Edited June 3, 2020 by skippiebg

[The Tomohawk Kid]

15 hours ago, skippiebg said:

Tommo, I've just opened up an Airfix Comet 4B and compared it to an Amodel one. Amodel is almost exactly 1cm too short (making it 1/149-ish scale in length), but exactly right in span. Personally, I'd simply stretch it using plastic card and Milliput, with lengths of sprue to keep it aligned. Needs 5mm fore and 5mm aft of the wing. Easy-peasy! I defer to your own views on that, naturally

 

The 26 decal looks tasty, by the way,! but again the brightwork window surrounds look a tad over the top... Of course, they might be less pronounced in the flesh.

 

Thanks.

 

I'd sort of come to the view myself, that inserting a plug to the Amodel fuselage is probably the way forward. I was hoping it would be the case of one plug - two make it a little more troublesome, but obviously far from impossible. I have been tossing around the idea of 'chopping up' the Airfix fuselage to use as the plugs.

 

The 26 Olympic decals are indeed very nice indeed, as you mention the 'brightwork' is probably too pronounced for 144. But, once applied hopefully will appear toned down. However, they are a quantum leap better than the Airfix decals which really are far to pronounced and are in my opinion give an one dimensional appearance - I  also still have doubts the colour on the Airfix cheat lines arn't quite right.

 

Tommo.

[Eric Mc]

Are you referring to the BEA blue cheatline? Getting that blue correct is almost impossible with decals. It had a weird pearescence to it (you could see green and purple in it depending on how the light fell on it). I actually used the Xtracolor BEA blue on the tailfin. It is the correct shade of blue but it does lack that weird pearlescence of the real paint. At least the paint and the cheatline match reasonably well.

[The Tomohawk Kid]

6 hours ago, Eric Mc said:

Are you referring to the BEA blue cheatline?

 

No, I was refering to the Olympic livery.

 

The fact the Airfix include a common cheat line for both the Olympic and BEA scheme it smacks of a fudge and I venture it is not entirely right for either.

 

Weren't the early BEA Airtours cheat lines black, being re-logoed 'red square' aircraft pending a full repaint? On the properly rebranded machines as you say it is pearescence green/blue. Neither right for the Olympic option.

 

Tommo.

Edited June 4, 2020 by The Tomohawk Kid

[Skodadriver]

Pretty underwhelmed by the Amodel Comet 4B I got in the post this morning. On a superficial inspection the only obvious improvements on the Airfix kit are the jet pipes and the red squares for above and below the wings on the decal sheet. Maybe I just got a poor kit but the lower Amodel wing is a lunar landscape of sink marks. While the detailing on the upper surfaces is reasonable it includes engraved wheel well doors (!). By the time you have sorted the Amodel wings and either either stretched the Amodel fuselage or mated the wings with an Airfix fuselage you'd be almost as quick to do a bit of scribing, detailing and correction on the Airfix kit which is the route I'm going to follow.

[skippiebg]

11 hours ago, Skodadriver said:

On a superficial inspection the only obvious improvements on the Airfix kit are the jet pipes and the red squares for above and below the wings on the decal sheet.

Actually, the BEA decal is typographically wrong and it shows particularly in the red square logos. I have an old Liveries Unlimited sheet somewhere that captures everything right.

11 hours ago, Skodadriver said:

While the detailing on the upper surfaces is reasonable it includes engraved wheel well doors (!).

The original has those! I know it's odd, but there we are. I have photos of G-APMA at Duxford that I can post to prove it.

11 hours ago, Skodadriver said:

you'd be almost as quick to do a bit of scribing, detailing and correction on the Airfix kit

The Amodel wins in the sculpting of the engines and the underside. The Airfix sadly fails there, as in most other finer areas. It's bang up to scale, however, as well as being chunky, winsome and tough in that old Airfix way, sure enough

Edited June 7, 2020 by skippiebg

[Skodadriver]

53 minutes ago, skippiebg said:

Actually, the BEA decal is typographically wrong and it shows particularly in the red square logos. I have an old Liveries Unlimited sheet somewhere that captures everything right.

The original has those! I know it's odd, but there we are. I have photos of G-APMA at Duxford that I can post to prove it.

...

Thanks for that interesting info @skippiebg.

 

I have the Liveries Unlimited sheet somewhere. I might be wrong but as far as I remember it only has the red squares for the fin, not the wings. 

 

That's amazing about the upper wings. You learn something new every day on Britmodeller!