Adrian Hills Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 Interesting comment about the rubbery nature of Xtracrylic- that is exactly how I found it. Will treat it more gently in the future. My crazing problem was probably down to the fact I added 30% Isopropyl to the colour cup! Duh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted May 21, 2020 Author Share Posted May 21, 2020 8 hours ago, Adrian Hills said: My crazing problem was probably down to the fact I added 30% Isopropyl to the colour cup! Duh That would do it, Isopropyl will eat into xtracrylix very neatly. After the initial coats I had some IPA on my finger ( I have a little puffer bottle of it) , and touched the cowling and it neatly removed a patch, leaving the Tamiya undercoat untouched. I was touching up the white fuselage band, and smeared some vallejo white on the serial, and was slightly careless trying to get it off with a brush dipped in IPA... it was on the verge of being a right mess.... You may need to use a different varnish over the Xtracrylix, they do their own, but any varnish that's not 'hot' should be OK. I'll have tp test my Xtracylix matt out later and compare with W&N... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaStix Posted May 21, 2020 Share Posted May 21, 2020 Hi Troy. Hope you are well. Sorry - I hadn't seen you were here with a build in progress! Excellent! It looks like you are progressing well despite the 'odd' issue! Looking forward to following more progress. Kind regards, Stix 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted May 23, 2020 Author Share Posted May 23, 2020 On 21/05/2020 at 16:27, PlaStix said: Hope you are well. I am indeed, quite enjoying a month of sundays.... Certainly improving my modelling. Right, ....well, Coat of Kleer, Did an oil wash using some Payne's Grey from a basic oil paint set. was surprised to find it's more of a dark purple-blue, which worked quite well. Iread a build where Roy Sutherland used on a Spitfire build, given the PRU Blue it was a good choice. The very smooth nature of the xtracrylix meant it didn't work that well, and was a bit stark, so a lot was rubbed off with tissue damped with lighter fuel, back forth, a few times.... Let dry, then coat of Xtracrylix matt, which is less flat than the W&N Galeria. more messing about, last thing I did before putting on the canopy was adding a tiny bit of clear streched sprue to the back of the headrest 50620032 by losethekibble, on Flickr http://spitfiresite.com/2011/06/guided-tour-of-the-spitfire-pr-mk-xix-the-lobelle-canopy.html/asc06739 Quote The visible perspex tube mounted behind the pilot held silica gel for removing moisture from the air in the cockpit, which could otherwise cause fogging. The clear perspex tube allowed for easy inspection of the silica crystals, which changed colour when they become saturated with moisture and had to be replaced. Added canopy with Wudcare PVA. Used it to fill gaps. the fiddly bits. I forgot to post this, but I had used my trusty needle in a pin vice to as a centre punch, and then drilled out the exhausts. EDIT I also opened up the carb intake, it's blanked off below, and does look better for being opened up as can be seen in the pics below. 50621311 by losethekibble, on Flickr they got a coat (all vallejo) oily steel, then a wash of prussian blue, rust wash, and as they were too bright, rust wash with some black. These can be seen fitted in the pic above this. the fiddly bits. I'd scraped around the legs integral with the doors, and painted the tailwheel and doors. The tailwheel is really well detailed....which is weird, as they skimped on things liker, erm basic wheel wells... Added talwheel doors, and tailwheel. The UC was a pain, despite looking like it was a postive location, they wobbled about, so spent sometime looking through Spitfire the history till I found page with a head on and side shot.togther, which was helpful. Added legs with Tamiya liquid cement, which is quite thick. left to set. I had fortunately checked the wheel fit on the legs first, which was rubbish, the stubs are a touch too long, so I trimmed the stubs, and the wheels wobble about. Then added then with the thicker cement, left to set. I touched up round the canopy as the PVA dried really matt, PRU Blue and then matt varnish. I had done some weathering, black and burnt umber ils mixed, applied very almost neat, streaked with lighter fuel. exhaust stains, ground black, brownd and grey paster chalk, the Xtracrylix varnish is pretty smooth, so the stuff didn't wantr to stick, used a brush damped with lighter fluid and dabbed on. It come off really easily though, but really gets the soft nature of the real deposit (many years ago I got to stand on a Hurricane that had just landed, and the pilot warned me the stuff came off really easily, sorty sticky dust really) Didn't like the prop blade marking, as for warbird, so painted out most of the top bit, and added Brown Rose circles at the base, later Rotols had dark pink circles. Add pitot. Forgot to touch up this up.... I think there is a whip aerial needed. Decided it was about done, and time for some pics. Out with the grotty card table, onto the storage box, low sun behind the trees to the left.... 50620033 by losethekibble, on Flickr 50620034 by losethekibble, on Flickr 50620035 by losethekibble, on Flickr the wind caught the prop on this... I'd added a brass rod and tube so it would do this.... 50620036 by losethekibble, on Flickr this I blew 50620037 by losethekibble, on Flickr belly oil streaks 50620038 by losethekibble, on Flickr repainted prop stencils and UC alignment 50620039 by losethekibble, on Flickr this shows the matt sooty exhaust deposits, which is why I didn't want to seal it. 50620040 by losethekibble, on Flickr Contact... 50620041 by losethekibble, on Flickr I rather happy with the above, I got one duff shot, the rest are 'as is' done on my toytown camera..... there is a filter on Flickr called '1920'.... 50620041 by losethekibble, on Flickr The only other Griffon Spitfire I ever did was the Frog one when i was 8 or 9.... I see more in my future. While I can't say I liked the kit, it has scrubbed up rather well, and the Indian roundels and white tips and band make for a most attractive scheme... thanks for all the comments and support, especially to @Sky dancer for the scans, which really helped with the markings. 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Posted May 23, 2020 Share Posted May 23, 2020 Looks very nice Troy. Despite its flaws, I think the kit captures the lines of the XIX very well. And great to see the spinning prop! Something I never manage to achieve. Cheers, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corsairfoxfouruncle Posted May 23, 2020 Share Posted May 23, 2020 She turned out very well Troy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray_W Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Hi Troy, I have enjoyed reading this immensely. Lots going on and I like every one chiming in. Stacks of interesting information. Great read and great to see your challenging little build complete and in the gallery. I like the subject and the result. One reason I like the Group Builds on BM is you do see a huge number of "One True Scale" builds which I enjoy following. Even though, like you, I only build 1/48 these days. I noted the comment from Adrian on Mr Levelling Thinner and also your reply On 5/21/2020 at 5:49 AM, Troy Smith said: Folks have talked about Vallejo turning to jelly with a 'hot' thinner like Mr Levelling thinner IIRC I have not used Vallejo but do use AK and Lifecolor acrylics with Mr Levelling Thinned GSI Creos clear GX products over the top with no issues but I do allow minimum 48 hours before I do so and mist coat. My preference still would be to use a less hot true acrylic clear coat like your W&N products. I just happen to have GX on the shelf and like the consistent and predictable coating. Love the build. Now if it was a Hurricane STGB how many would you of built? I suppose none, you would be too busy answering everyone's questions. Ray 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 4 hours ago, Ray_W said: My preference still would be to use a less hot true acrylic clear coat like your W&N products. May I ask Ray (apologies to Troy for the hijack), but what do you mean by 'hot'? Its a term I've seen before but not understood. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray_W Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 11 minutes ago, Johnson said: May I ask Ray (apologies to Troy for the hijack), but what do you mean by 'hot'? Its a term I've seen before but not understood. Thanks Start at water and go to something that will totally dissolve (very hot) your precious model. Aggressive solvents can be termed "hot". Not in temperature but their reactivity with paint coatings and what ever else intentionally (e.g. glues like Methy Ethyl Ketone MEK) or otherwise gets in the way (e.g darn my canopy fogged, I left a bloody fingerprint from Tamiya Extra Thin) . Certainly Mr Levelling Thinners is more hot "aggressive" than naptha (lighter fluid). Some say though it is not as "hot" as cellulose thinners from the hardware shop. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray_W Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Hi Troy, Also sorry to hijack your thread but following on from Adrian @Adrian Hills and Charlie's @Johnson comments. I have a copy of a couple of responses from the FSM forum on "lacquers vs enamels vs acrylics" that I found to be really good. Most succinct layman description, with a little of the chemistry as to the difference, that I have read. A great explanation by PeterJ. The full forum discussion is here: https://forum.ipmsusa3.org/topic/16853-layering-lacquer-enamel-and-acrylic-paints/. PeterJ's response as follows: Simple explanation is this. All paints are made of 3 basic components. Solids or pigments, binders and solvents or thinners. The key difference is the binders and solvents. These are the basic "glues" that make paint stick. The binder is the solid glue and the solvent dissolves it to make it liquid. Lacquer's solvents are based primarily on acetone and MEK with some other solvents thrown in. These solvents are the "hottest" and will generally dissolve almost anything. The "other" solvents and proportions are what differentiate various Lacquer thinners. The best automotive lacquer thinners have more of the expensive solvents and less acetone in them. They do a better job of dissolving the binders and pigments, but the more of these solvents the more expensive they become. This is why there is a significant difference in the price and action of auto paint shop and Home Depot lacquer thinner. Home Depot is mostly acetone. High end thinners are also more prone to attacking plastic. Enamel thinner is mostly naphtha AKA mineral spirits or paint thinner. This is a slightly less aggressive than the solvents in lacquer thinner. Depending on the mix and the lacquer, enamals it can be used over lacquer. Acrylic paints are commonly referred to as "water"based but the reality is that the primary solvent is alcohol. That is what gives acrylics that slightly "sweet" smell. Because dilute alcohol will not generally dissolve lacquers or enamels it can be used over them. Also some acrylics can be thinned with lacquer thinner. Tamiya recommends this when you want a "harder" finish. Doing this however, precludes using it this way over enamels. Now a bit about acrylic as used in paint. Acrylic correctly describes the pigments used, not the thinners. Acrylic is a synthetic pigment, not a natural mineral pigment such as titanium(white) or ocher(red) which occur naturally. Before the advent of acrylics, natural pigment came mostly from the ground and were dug up and crushed for use in paint. This word is very much misused to describe a type of paint but it has become a part of the general lexicon and as such we are kind of stuck with it. Now, what can be used over what? Alcohol based over all. Naphtha over lacquer but not alcohol and lacquer on the bottom. Having said that here comes the caveat. Because 91% alcohol used straight undiluted, will dissolve some lacquer paint, if given enough time, all of these have compatibility issues. Laid down in light coats so the solvents will evaporate quickly, they can all be used with each other. If the solvent doesn't have time to attack the layer beneath, then no issue. Lay on a thick coat and you have problems. I mentioned compatibility. This is when you get the wrinkling and the paint bubbles up. This occurs as a result of paint shrinkage as it cures. All paints shrink some as they cure. That is the nature of the beast. When you get two paints that shrink at different rates then you get the wrinkling. It is made worse because if they shrink at different rates, they also expand at different rates. When you have a cured layer and you spray a new layer down, if the old layer absorbs the new thinner it will start to expand and as the two shrink back at different rates, then you get wrinkles. There is no formula to tell you when this will or will not happen so you can only do a test shot to see. A Bobbyenko responded: As a retired Chemical Engineer, I felt compelled to add some clarification to PeteJ's good explanation. The "sweet" smell of the acrylics is more likely to be from "glycols" that are added to the paint to get the paint to flow smoothly. Other glycols that you know are automotive antifreeze (ethylene glycol). The acrylics that PeteJ mentioned are not pigments but the binders in acrylic paint. They are long spaghetti-like molecules that glue the paint pigments to the surface that you are painting. Acrylic clear coat is just acrylic binder and solvent; no pigments. The pigments that PeteJ mention come in two categorizes: Inorganic and Organic. The inorganic pigments are, as PeteJ says, natural minerals. Ground up dirt if you will. Examples are Titanium White, Yellow Ochre Ultra Marine Blue. The organic pigments are usually man made chemicals or molecules that were originally extracted from crude oil or coal tar. Some of these were first discovered by German Chemists in the late 1800's. Examples are: Phthalo Blue, Phthalo Green, Napthol Red. Again sorry to put it in your thread but it does follow on a little from the previous discussion. Ray 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Many thanks Ray, understand now. I misinterpreted your term hot applied to W&N acrylic - it was obviously too early in the morning for me! Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray_W Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Johnson said: Many thanks Ray, understand now. I misinterpreted your term hot applied to W&N acrylic - it was obviously too early in the morning for me! Cheers, That's good! You touched on one of my pet subjects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookenbacher Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 That turned out great Troy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomthounaojam Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Thank you Troy, very insightful I think am not there for those surgeries on kit as I lack skills, Really outstanding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linescriber Posted May 30, 2020 Share Posted May 30, 2020 Really Good Troy, Lots of work there!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEMPESTMK5 Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Good afternoon Troy You have done a very good job with this Spit 👍 Best Regards Patrice 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ModelingEdmontonian Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 Great model, @Troy Smith, love the subject, and the photography really shows it off nicely! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyOD Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 5/17/2020 at 3:33 PM, Troy Smith said: for reasons best left to confines of therapy, I now have 8 1/48th PR XIX kits.... !!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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