Hawker Horsley, Vacform Tutorial

[LorenSharp]

Good point on the canopy. I end up doing it last for fear of destroying it and doing the fuselage first and of course making the hole for the canopy too big. Adding additional work that I didn't need to. Thanks!

[Martian]

19 hours ago, LorenSharp said:

Good point on the canopy. I end up doing it last for fear of destroying it and doing the fuselage first and of course making the hole for the canopy too big. Adding additional work that I didn't need to. Thanks!

I always feel that if I have got the canopy to fit the fuselage at the start, I have already got the kit on the run.

 

Martian 👽

[Martian]

In some kits, such as this there is a need to work up surface detail. More recent vacforms usually have excellent detail but as a particular kit may be the only kit of the subject we want to build so we need to be able to tackle this.

 

With kits that represent aircraft that are metal covered, surface detailing just involves a scribing or re-scribing job. We have all had to re-scribe at least part of a model haven't we? so no big deal there. With fabric covered surfaces things are a bit more involved. Involved and a little time consuming but not in itself difficult.

 

There are many ways of representing the rib tapes found on fabric covered wings and here is not really the place to have a debate as to which is the best. The best is of course the method that suits the individual modeller. What follows is just one of the methods that I use. I have chosen the method that is the easiest to photograph. Trying to photograph white plastic being overlaid on white plastic is a nightmare.

 

I began by masking off the leading edge of the wing with some thick masking tape, in this case Scotch Blue. The leading edge on this subject was made capped with wood and the ribs and riblets dove under this. I then scribed where the ribs are to go following which I masked off where the riblets end. I then marked off the riblets and scribed where they are to go.

 

I always have some Slaters .10 'thou plastic rod in stock and the plan here is to lay the rod in the scribed lines so that half of it's diameter is proud of the wing surface. The rod is then glued in place and when the glue is fully cured, I gently sand the rod back until it is flattened off at the top. Care needs to be taken here so as not to sand the rod completely away but once again it is just a matter of proceeding slowly and carefully. There never were any prizes for making a model quickly and even less so when making vacforms but then again, if we thought to the contrary, we would not be doing this thread, would we?

 

I shall have some pictures of the rod going down in the next installment when we will also be taking the first steps in building up the fuselage.

 

I should have mentioned at the start of this thread, that if anyone has any questions at all, please feel free to ask them no matter how silly they may feel. They are not silly at all. The only silly question is the one you don't ask.

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Martian 👽

 

 

 

[Jonners]

31 minutes ago, Martian said:

the plan here is to lay the rod in the scribed lines so that half of it's diameter is proud of the wing surface.

Now that's a good idea! Another school day...

[woody37]

Evergreen do half round rod too which would save on all that scribing though not sure they do 10 thou, so good for bigger scales perhaps

[Martian]

22 hours ago, Jonners said:

Now that's a good idea! Another school day...

I'm not quite as daft as I look!

 

 

22 hours ago, woody37 said:

Evergreen do half round rod too which would save on all that scribing though not sure they do 10 thou, so good for bigger scales perhaps

I seem to recall that they don't, which is why I ended up ordering the stuff from Slaters. Slaters do provide excellent service though.

 

Martian 👽

[StephenCJ]

12 hours ago, Martian said:

I'm not quire as daft as I look!

prove it. 

[Martian]

9 hours ago, StephenCJ said:

prove it. 

I thought my portrait proves that I couldn't be!

 

Martian 👽

[StephenCJ]

21 minutes ago, Martian said:

I thought my portrait proves that I couldn't be!

 

You look bloody great, a fantastic job on your disguise.

[John Aero]

I know the guy, that's not a disguise!  😜

 

John

[Chaotic Mike]

On 5/27/2020 at 9:04 PM, Martian said:

CC, I note that your location is described as "South of Belgium". Would it not now be more accurate if you gave your location as "The Naughty Corner", given the amount of time you spend there? It would make it easier for people to find you

 

Helpful of Mars 👽

I don't know what this says about me, but right up until now I had interpreted 'South of Belgium' as meaning CC was being shy about his location, but that it *wasn't* in Belgium, and somewhere South of it. *Not* the rather more obvious 'in Belgium, somewhere in its South'.  This is why we have invented formal languages in computer science that are allegedly not open to misinterpretation! 

[Martian]

2 minutes ago, Chaotic Mike said:

I don't know what this says about me, but right up until now I had interpreted 'South of Belgium' as meaning CC was being shy about his location, but that it *wasn't* in Belgium, and somewhere South of it. *Not* the rather more obvious 'in Belgium, somewhere in its South'.  This is why we have invented formal languages in computer science that are allegedly not open to misinterpretation! 

CC, shy? That's the best one I have heard in a very long time! I always assumed "South of Belgium meant France. Its immaterial now anyway as he has corrected his location to the far more accurate Naughty Corner.

 

Martian 👽

[Martian]

Having got the ribs and riblets marked out and the leading edge cap and rearmost extremity of the riblets masked off, we then begin by fitting the riblets. These are cut from lengths of the .10 'thou rod that we looked at earlier. In the case of the Horsley these are 5mm long. In my case, the time to cut all these to an identical length was drastically reduced by use of my Albion Alloys Cutter. I just set the stop to 5mm and every section of rod that I cut came out to an identical size, with no waste at all.

 

Once the riblets had been glued into the previously scored grooves, the masking tape at the rear of them was carefully removed from the wing. We are then in a position to start gluing the rod representing the ribs themselves into position. We need to take care here to make sure that the rear most extremity of the ribs is well glued into position in order to prevent the rod flaking away when we come to sand the ribs down. One way I achieve this is to cut the tiniest nick in the trailing edge of the wing and force the rod into this.

 

Once we have got all the ribs on the wing in place, we can then go back and treat the ailerons in a similar manner. As to the lower wing surfaces, with their less prominent ribbing, in this scale I consider it sufficient to just scribe their locations.

 

All of the above takes time to do properly but, once again, it is not that difficult and can feel very therapeutic and rewarding as one sees the detail on the wing come to life.

 

Thanks for looking and as always, any questions, please ask.

 

Martian 👽

 

 

[Martian]

Why "sad" Marklo?

 

Confused of Mars 👽

[Marklo]

2 hours ago, Martian said:

 

Why "sad" Marklo?

 

Oops I think I meant to like. There we go fixed. But might be subconsciously sad that I can’t find any 1/48 the vac form subjects that I want to build  except for that Vildebeast which at £60 (not euro I might add) is way too expensive. But I can still live a full modelling life without them.

Edited June 6, 2020 by Marklo

[Martian]

2 hours ago, Marklo said:

Oops I think I meant to like. There we go fixed. But might be subconsciously sad that I can’t find any 1/48 the vac form subjects that I want to build  except for that Vildebeast which at £60 (not euro I might add) is way too expensive. But I can still live a full modelling life without them.

Thanks for clearing that up Mark. I kept reading and re-reading my post and couldn't for the life of me see what there was to upset anyone. Was I not already there, I would have thought I was going bonkers.

 

What sort of 1/48 subjects are you looking for? If it is British between the wars types, they are thin on the ground probably because most of them are such stinkers to get decent information on. I'm pretty sure @John Aero as a former manufacturer will be able to confirm this. With my Fleet Air Arm researcher's hat on, I have spent nearly forty years bashing my head against a brick wall trying to get enough information on some types that I would like to scratch build, with precious little success.

 

Martian 👽

[Brandy]

I would add that in 1:72 there is no need whatsoever to add any rib detail. It can be more than adequately represented with paint. There is really not much of a dip in the fabric even in full scale. If you try to show it in 1:72 you will have something that looks like a trench!

 

Ian

[corsaircorp]

On 6/3/2020 at 9:53 AM, Martian said:

CC, shy? That's the best one I have heard in a very long time! I always assumed "South of Belgium meant France. Its immaterial now anyway as he has corrected his location to the far more accurate Naughty Corner.

 

Martian 👽

Well done but no !

I live in the south of Belgium... In between Chimay and Rochefort... It's not very astonishing indeed ??

Fagnes brewery is not far from my backyard....

No more stunning is'nt it ??

Great build Dear Alien !!

It's now time to put some pressure on the General... THE big push to an 1/48 Airfix Scimitar !!

Cunning plan indeed !!

I no longer believe in a 1/48 Blackburn Bison from Airfix....

Sincerely

CC

[Martian]

1 hour ago, corsaircorp said:

I live in the south of Belgium... In between Chimay and Rochefort... It's not very astonishing indeed ??

No you don't. You live in the Naughty Corner; remember? I'm sure Mme Corsaircorp will confirm this, you did say you were always in trouble at home.

1 hour ago, limeypilot said:

I would add that in 1:72 there is no need whatsoever to add any rib detail. It can be more than adequately represented with paint. There is really not much of a dip in the fabric even in full scale. If you try to show it in 1:72 you will have something that looks like a trench!

 

Ian

I go with this way as I get on better with plastic than I do with paint and when I find a method that suits me, I am as likely to move on as a Corsaircorp who is living next to a Carmelite brewery. I do accept however that there are any number of ways of doing rib detail and its each to his or her own.

 

Martian 👽

[Marklo]

3 hours ago, Martian said:

What sort of 1/48 subjects are you looking for? If it is British between the wars types,

Well tbh I build anything from 190whatever up to early post war with the occasional foray into anything else that I like the look of, eg my Mig 21 and my soon to be unleashed hind, ( somehow that doesn’t sound quite right, but whatever) not to worry it’s an itch I don’t mind leaving unscratched.. looks wistfully at my enormous contrail zeppelin Stakken, I winder if the float version would be cool.

[Wince]

@Martian I’ve folded and bought a cheap ts-11 Iskra off evilbay. Never built a vac form kit and I have moderate to fair modelling skills. I’m blaming you for this with your temptations of tutorials and egging me on in another post about shorts Stirling’s! 

[The Spadgent]

On 5/21/2020 at 12:39 AM, Martian said:

I think he is just trying out for the role of second witch in Macbeth. (Hopes that @The Spadgent isn't reading this, he is very superstitious and has to do some sort of ritual to exorcise the evil spirits )

 

Martian 👽

It seems my ear burning detection device is faulty. 👂🔥 🌎

I sought this out in traditional fashion. 🤩 aaaahhhhhgh. “Hot potato orchestra stalls Puck must make amends” Tweak!!! 👃😯ouch. 🤣  Great idea oh tentacled one. I did build a vacuform kit about 18 or 19 years ago. I think you may know the subject.

He’s very dusty and survived two house moves but he keeps us all safe at night. 😇. I’d like to tag along after quite a catch up if you’ll allow me. I have a few more Sevans kits in the loft. It would be nice to know how to attack them properly.

 

All the best.

 

Johnny. 🌳

[Marklo]

Wow, a proper Dalek, I built one of those too, painted gold if I remember, big model and fairly difficult. Of course I left him at home when I moved out and my elder brother threw him ( and all my other models) away while I was in America  

 

I have since replaced him, at least in spirit.

[Martian]

9 hours ago, Wince said:

I’m blaming you for this with your temptations of tutorials and egging me on in another post about shorts Stirling’s! 

I didn't do it and I wasn't there!

11 minutes ago, The Spadgent said:

It seems my ear burning detection device is faulty. 👂🔥 🌎

I sought this out in traditional fashion. 🤩 aaaahhhhhgh. “Hot potato orchestra stalls Puck must make amends” Tweak!!! 👃😯ouch. 🤣  Great idea oh tentacled one. I did build a vacuform kit about 18 or 19 years ago. I think you may know the subject.

He’s very dusty and survived two house moves but he keeps us all safe at night. 😇. I’d like to tag along after quite a catch up if you’ll allow me. I have a few more Sevans kits in the loft. It would be nice to know how to attack them properly.

 

All the best.

 

Johnny. 🌳

Yes I know that bloke. Be careful though if he is living with you. In certain parts of the universe, he has a slight reputation as a trouble maker! Happy to have you tagging along, the basic techniques apply to any vacform subject.

 

Martian 👽

[Martian]

Just a short installment today as I have been struggling quite a bit with the old mental health issues over the last few days. Today I decided to lock myself in the Martian cave and get on with something that did not require too much thinking about. I got the rest of the ribs done on the top wing and got as far as marking out the lower wing and getting the riblets glued in place. About another hour's work should see the ribs in place.

 

Once the rest of the ribs were dry on the upper wing, I took a large flat headed brush and brushed liquid cement over the wing. This is helpful in two ways. Firstly it ensures that any parts of ribs that have escaped glue thus far are taken care of and secondly, it tidies everything up which is definite morale boost if, like me, you like your work to look neat and tidy as you progress with your model. Leave this for a good twenty four hours and you can then begin to gently sand back the detail but that's for another day.

 

I shall finish the remaining ribs off line and return with them when they are ready to sand. I'm sure you have all got bored with flying surfaces and we will look at how to get the fuselage ready for joining next.

 

Thanks for looking

 

Martian 👽