Zvezda paint question

[Doggy]

Hi all. I just got my first 2 zvedza models, an la5 and a mig 3.

 

Zvedza suggest using humbrol paint but is there another acrylic paint that might be a more accurate colour?

 

Thanks

[Werdna]

Some Humbrol colours seem accurate, others maybe less so.  Depends on the level of accuracy you require, although I think 'accuracy' is always going to be a bit debatable with 70+ year old colour matches.  With pre-shading, post shading and weathering washes further altering the overall tone and appearance.  Having said that, I'm fairly happy with the appearance of Vallejo model air (for luftwaffe colours, at least) and they also offer a full box set for Russian colours, although I've not specifically used the Russian colours so can't comment with any level of detail.

[Doggy]

Thanks.

 

To muddy the waters further I've just realised I have a Revell Yak, an Arma Yak too, all giving different paint options.

[Chuck1945]

It really doesn’t matter who manufactured the kit, the actual colors used on the originals is the important part, then finding a model paint you are comfortable using that has the best matches for those colors. In 1943 the Soviet Air Force (VVS) changed the color scheme for fighters to a dark grey (AMT 12), lighter, but still not light,  grey (AMT 11) and blue undersides (AMT 7). Before that fighters had black (AMT-6), dark green (AMT-4) uppers and again AMT-7 undersides. Early MiG-3s could have had  A II light blue. Interiors were generally a neutral grey color.

[Tbolt]

I'm sure there are plenty of acrylic paints that would do the job, but if you go to the Soviet Warplanes site it lists all the VVS colours, with colour chips and FS matches and what was used on what aircraft. There's also plenty of info on different airframes so you can work out what you need - https://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/index.html

[Doggy]

5 hours ago, Chuck1945 said:

It really doesn’t matter who manufactured the kit, the actual colors used on the originals is the important part, then finding a model paint you are comfortable using that has the best matches for those colors. In 1943 the Soviet Air Force (VVS) changed the color scheme for fighters to a dark grey (AMT 12), lighter, but still not light,  grey (AMT 11) and blue undersides (AMT 7). Before that fighters had black (AMT-6), dark green (AMT-4) uppers and again AMT-7 undersides. Early MiG-3s could have had  A II light blue. Interiors were generally a neutral grey color.

What does the AMT mean ?

 

Thanks

[Doggy]

10 minutes ago, Doggy said:

What does the AMT mean ?

 

Thanks

It's ok I found it.

 

Cheers

4 hours ago, Tbolt said:

I'm sure there are plenty of acrylic paints that would do the job, but if you go to the Soviet Warplanes site it lists all the VVS colours, with colour chips and FS matches and what was used on what aircraft. There's also plenty of info on different airframes so you can work out what you need - https://massimotessitori.altervista.org/sovietwarplanes/pages/index.html

Cracking site, thanks for that.

[Antti_K]

Hello Doggy,

 

we have the remains of (at least two) MiG-3s in museums here in Finland. Last summer I had a chance to make colour comparisons on them. Here are my findings:

 

-Olive Green NCS S7020-G50Y and 6030-G50Y at some places)

- Light Blue NCS S3020-B50G

 

These codes are obtained using the Swedish "Natural Colour System" (NCS) which in my opinion is among the best choices for a modeller, because it contains almost 2000 shades. Note that the following is simply a photo of the colour fan samples (not very accurate that is).

 

 

The rear fuselage interior is plywood with a heavily applied clear lacquer which has turned into orange-brown. Unfortunately I haven't seen the cockpit and can't provide any information about it.

 

HPH

 

Cheers,

Antti

[Chuck1945]

Doggy, in Antti’s post the blue color is AMT-7. On my phone’s screen the other looks almost black, if so, AMT-6

[Werdna]

Just to add - I suppose it depends on what particular 'type' of accuracy you are after.  The way I see it, you have a choice of colour, based on the following:

 

a) the colour as it was when it was rolled out of the factory paint shop

b) the colour as it was when squadron/unit markings were applied

c) the colour as it was after six months of air combat and outdoor field repair/re-armament

or

d) the way it was after lying in a Russian forest for 50+ years before being rediscovered

 

I suspect all those colours are likely to be different. 

[Antti_K]

53 minutes ago, Chuck1945 said:

Doggy, in Antti’s post the blue color is AMT-7. On my phone’s screen the other looks almost black, if so, AMT-6

Hello guys,

 

the green is almost a perfect match for FS 34097. The blue is closest to FS 35352. I made this comparison using FS 595a colour chart. You can find digital colour samples in the Internet that will give you a better idea how the colours should look. I'm not familiar with the Russian colour codes but you seem to be familiar with them, so I'm learning here all the time.

 

These aircraft were transported to the Air Force depot shortly afterwards they were shot down and they have been stored indoors ever since (otherwise there wouldn't be much left). The paint is in good condition and I cleaned the surface before making the colour comparisons. It is true that the surface is 70+ years old but it is an authentic sample.

 

Cheers,

Antti

 

 

[Werdna]

Hi Antti - sorry, I wasn't meaning to undermine your work.  I just meant that a lot of things can change the colour of paint over time, even things like air quality, temperature and whatever pollutants that might be present in the local environment.  But I agree that your information is probably the most reliable in this situation.

[Antti_K]

It's all right Werdna🙂

 

I didn't explain anything about the "remains" or these aircraft parts in the first place. You are using the very same classification as I do, when you list things like "Specification Colour" or "Observed Colour". Those are very good points to keep in mind when one is studying authenticity.

 

Cheers,

Antti

[Seawinder]

Is everyone determined not to mention AKAN paints, which are IMHO the most accurate Soviet colors that I know of. They're available (or at least they were) in both aqueous acrylic and acrylic lacquer formulations, not to mention their enamel line which is, I imagine, not of interest to the OP.

[Luka]

I think Vallejo Air's greys AMT 11 and 12 are very dark. I lightened and re-mixed them in new dropper bottles. For the shades I looked at older pictures of the Le Bourget Yak 3, when its paint was stripped to its oldest layers.