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Viasistina

Telford

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HI guys...I know that we really don't have any final information,. but what is the general view of the Telford show being held this year? I'm in the U.S. so its a long reach with some planning required. I'm just trying to get some rough idea of the chances its going to go on as scheduled.

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At the present time, Telford is still very much on the calendar. We don't need to make any strategic decisions about it until around August and are planning on that basis. We might have to run a different format of show, depending on what restrictions might still be in place, but we can accommodate that if it becomes necessary.

 

I appreciate that doesn't help visitors (particularly those from overseas) with their forward planning, but at this point in the year it is simply too early to be sure what the situation will be in  7 months time.

 

Regards,

John

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If you can get fully refundable tickets and hotel reservations I would go for it as the rates should be low right now.

i am still hoping the US Nats is going forward at the end of July but that still might be pushing it.

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Hi Philp,

it's not looking good for the US Nats.  When is/was IPMS Boise this year?

Mike

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My sector is currently planning on the assumption that even best case scenario retains the 2m rule and limits on numbers in gatherings for the duration of 2020 at least.

 

given the demographic and the proportion that must be on the 70+ / preexisting condition list, the additional impact on footfall even if it can legally proceed surely won’t be overlooked by traders.

 

on the plus side many modellers have decent face masks for airbrushing 😜

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If social distancing is to be the norm at that time, queues to get in at 10;00 will stretch back as far as Telford one way and Wolverhampton the other way, how about admission?  9-10am full members allowed in, then dependant on how many are inside, as the doors open at 10 to general public, do the stewards then only allow 1 in as 1 comes out?  Could be a bit daunting for those waiting to go in.   Going to have to be a lot of lee way and accepting that crowds will appear around stands and stalls, some people may accept it whilst others will insist on correct distances creating a bit of aggravation...……….going to be a hard nut to crack to satisfy everyone, I personally am happy to mix and mingle...…..have to wait and see, some of us wear glasses and CANNOT wear facemasks as they steam up the glasses

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An interesting tell tale will be what happens with Premier League Football. If they are allowed to go back to holding games in front of normal crowds then other gatherings should be allowed to go ahead too. Crowds funnelling through limited access, close proximity etc are all common issues so would all be covered in the Risk Assessments. Obviously there are additional risks with indoor events but you see where I'm coming from.

 

Duncan B

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Perhaps make it members only to reduce the numbers?  I'm sure the Committee are considering many possibilities.

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Graham, I think you were spot on in your first reply - answers at the moment will be as much about present day optimism or pessimism. I would add that the BBC are reporting results of a survey suggesting that individual behaviours post Covid 19 may be permanently altered from their recent habits. However alarmist this may sound, I'm perhaps one who will consider attending large events (such as The Nationals or music gigs) post-Covid  as perhaps more risk than pleasure. Until now I have been a regular attender at the UK Nationals and other shows (such as the Scottish Nats in Perth) and have thoroughly enjoyed them.  But I've worked in ITU (and my daughter is a doctor in A&E and ITU at the moment) so perhaps this also influences me.

 

In short, yes it's probably too early to have a clear idea or, as John says above, to make any decisions. But I'm not sure that we're going back to the pre-Covid world we knew. At least not for some considerable time. 

 

SD

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13 hours ago, rayprit said:

have to wait and see, some of us wear glasses and CANNOT wear facemasks as they steam up the glasses

I wear glasses and have no problem wearing the simple paper face masks. The airflow from the nose isn't directed towards the eyes - that would defeat the purpose of them.

 

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2 minutes ago, Chimpion said:

I wear glasses and have no problem wearing the simple paper face masks. The airflow from the nose isn't directed towards the eyes - that would defeat the purpose of them.

 

 

13 hours ago, rayprit said:

have to wait and see, some of us wear glasses and CANNOT wear facemasks as they steam up the glasses

 

I also wear glasses and there are some easy solutions:

 

1. Use anti-fog wipes.

2. Clean your glasses with a small dab of shaving foam.

3. Rub a small amount of pure white bar soap on your lenses, then buff off.

4. Apply anti-fog paste or spray.

5. Use rain repellent on glasses.

8. Clean them with your saliva.

7. Choose glasses that sit away from your face to circulate air.

9. And there are numerous commercial anti-fogging solutions. 

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I've a feeling that there will be very few shows anywhere this year.  Given the situation now in the UK, unless a reliable vaccine is developed and fast-tracked into mainstream distribution (which is another problem we're poorly set-up for), we'll see nothing in the UK this year.  November is a long time away though, so I reserve the right to be wrong :)

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There is also the problem of the transport infrastructure.

At the mo ferries from N.I. to GB are cut to just a few a week. Cargo only. They reckon they'll be shut down by June and then commercial only will be carried for months till they get it all sorted. afaik currently there is only one flight a day out of our three airports. They say, if, the airports can stay open, the airlines aren't there and it may be next year till the airlines are close to normal. Most of this applies to Eire - GB as well.

What I'm saying, its going to be difficult for people outside GB to actually get to Telford, not only visitors but traders as well.

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I sincerely hope that Telford at least goes ahead this year, and it would be some icing on the cake if some other shows can go ahead as well.

 

I did wonder what the Warley railway modelling show, a week after Telford is doing, and they have the same warning as IPMS, which is that it is going ahead as normal, they are guided by government advice, and if circumstances change they will respond.

 

It is a terrible time all round for everyone. 

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Sadly we are starting to see shows in September being cancelled so it's creeping ever closer. I honestly don't expect to be attending any Shows this year at all. 

 

Duncan B

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I think the Telford Planning Team will take their cue from how the Football League restarts and other large events. 

 

I can see the rest of 2020 becoming a model show free zone!

 

Look out for a discussion at the end of July  

 

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16 minutes ago, Cyberduck said:

I think the Telford Planning Team will take their cue from how the Football League restarts and other large events. 

 

I can see the rest of 2020 becoming a model show free zone!

 

Look out for a discussion at the end of July  

 

Looking at the IPMS website they are saying that they will not be making decisions until August. Also, they are saying that the convention centre are not pushing them to cancel yet.

 

The hope has to be that by August, which is 12 or 13 weeks away, things will have settled down enough that they can make a decision supported by the convention centre. 

 

However IPMS and the convention centre look at, we can't argue against any decision they make because it will be in all our (including the staff at the convention centre) interests.

 

I do hope Duncan that you - and the rest of us here (who didn't get to one before March) do get to attend at least one show this year.

 

 

 

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Venue may as well be flexible as it’s not like they’ll get a replacement bookIng to fill the gap.

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One question could be, even if it gets the go ahead (which I doubt), would you still attend? Social distancing or not, would you still as soon as November feel that a model show is worth the risk when there's a very high likelihood that Covid-19 is still very much around? I saw a report on the BBC saying a survey had found that many people would not feel comfortable going out even if the government lift restrictions. I must admit that effective vaccination pending, I'll be very careful about where and when I head out, and I'm in good health (as far as I know) and 'only' 44. That's not easy to say as I dearly want things to go back to how they were and to support businesses, but I put the health of my family and myself first.

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Since the numbers get published by the IPMS, I can't see how the arithmetic stacks up for Telford unless it's the full deal with the usual turnout and spending habits.

 

You can't really do a social distancing / members only Telford because then the takings are way down. Some traders will be fearful of committing the vast amount of money Telford costs in case they either lose it entirely or due to the grips of global recession unemployment is high and people aren't buying enough. Once again, those who have never actually paid for, traded at, and counted takings from Telford probably have very different assumptions about gross profit levels compared to those who have. Telford just isn't a show which traders can afford to get wrong - at least not without causing significant damage. Particularly smaller traders...

 

It's all or nothing as far as I can see, unless the Telford International Centre provides the venue at half price.

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My feelings it will be up to the Telford International Centre whether they would allow any exhibitions from going ahead, as any outbreak happening there would not be good for them.

 

Regards

Robert

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12 hours ago, Filler said:

One question could be, even if it gets the go ahead (which I doubt), would you still attend? Social distancing or not, would you still as soon as November feel that a model show is worth the risk when there's a very high likelihood that Covid-19 is still very much around? I saw a report on the BBC saying a survey had found that many people would not feel comfortable going out even if the government lift restrictions. I must admit that effective vaccination pending, I'll be very careful about where and when I head out, and I'm in good health (as far as I know) and 'only' 44. That's not easy to say as I dearly want things to go back to how they were and to support businesses, but I put the health of my family and myself first.

This is the position I've been taking since before the cancellations started. Traders are always going to be in closer contact with the visitors and therefore at more risk than exhibitors who can sit 6 feet away behind tables. Add the extra risk of goods and cash being handled and it's a toxic environment for sure. One infected (but non symptomatic) customer in the Hall could potentially infect every Trader in the place if that person was getting their money's worth from the event by visiting every stall.

Limiting numbers in the Hall at any one time does nothing to reduce the risk as the Traders are still exposed to all the visitors over the course of the Show but it's an idiotic idea to suggest that restricting entry numbers reduces the risk at all anyway as there is no way of knowing who is infected. This suggestion was put forward as a proposal by at least one Show keen to see their event go ahead early in the outbreak and I hate to think what the outcome might have been.

 

Duncan B

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Posted (edited)

@Duncan Bis absolutely right.

 

I have a working (and teaching) background in acute health care and the facts are not in doubt. Airborne droplet infection is not easily prevented or mitigated. A sneeze can spread droplets 6-8 metres. Masks are of limited use - standard FFP3 or above are needed, but a respirator or extraction system is better still. Visors also are required to avoid droplets entering the body through mucous membranes. Gloves are helpful too. Might look a touch odd at a Model Show (but what am I saying looking at some of the attendees at shows I've been to? :giggle: ). Distancing will help mitigate spread, but I think the majority of contributors on this thread appreciate that distancing at Telford is impossible.   Does the virus survive on cash? Yes, up to 4 days on paper money. It may linger on cardboard for up to 24 hours. Reference: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/apr/04/how-long-does-coronavirus-live-on-different-surfaces

 

Duncan's correct when he says it will just take one asymptomatic carrier to attend to produce significant consequences. Google 'Typhoid Mary' if you want an example from the past.

 

I've already mentioned above that post-Covid behaviour is likely to be permanently altered, and that many of us will be much more reluctant to expose ourselves (not like that!) to infection risk by attending large gatherings, even if this may have official sanction. Health vs Modelling?

 

The only longer-term solutions are either Herd Immunity (90% or more of the population have actually had the disease and now have antibodies to it - this would involve unthinkable numbers of deaths (500,000 by some projections) and post-exposure immunity is still not certain at the moment) or a vaccine (perhaps at least 18 months away + the time it then takes to mass produce and dispense it).

 

We are in the Covid and post-Covid world for some time to come yet I'm afraid. And that means permanent behavioural change.

I take no joy in saying this as I enjoy shows as much as the next modeller :sad:

 

SD

 

 

 

Edited by SafetyDad
Missing word added

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SafetyDad said:

We are in the Covid and post-Covid world for some time to come yet I'm afraid. And that means permanent behavioural change.

I take no joy in saying this as I enjoy shows as much as the next modeller :sad:

Very well said.

 

Slightly off topic, the UK media does seem to be starting to create the impression that a post-Covid world will be quite different to the world we enjoyed in January 2020.

Edited by Richard E

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