De Turenne Nieuport 11 from the kit Eduard 1/48

[DMC]

Loving what you’re doing in this thread, Olivier.  Never stop learning.

 

Dennis

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Thanks a lot, Dennis. I was so happy to learn myself (and I still have a lot to learn!) as from my own experience, as from Juan Manuel (he learnt me also to make better photos), as from other great artists (especially in Britmodeller), it is my turn to share the few experience I have in modeling...

 

All the best, Olivier

[Totally Mad Olivier]

The engine hood over, I am going to focus now on the propeller. It was made of wood, and I am going to try to improve a bit the one I made on the first version. But before thinking about the wood paint, it is necessary to determine the best strategy of painting, as the center of this part is metal. It will be easier to mask this round metal portion, and so, it is by the latter that I will begin the painting job. Let's precise too that Eduard provides a quite good part for this propeller, well detailed on this center portion. Bughunter made an amazing job on this part, using wood for the propeller and scratchbuilding the center part. I won't go so far, but a special care must be brought to this center portion, in order to preserve all the details. Studying the close-up photo ever posted (post #50), I just added the small holes (0,2 mm Tamiya drill) between the rivets:

 

 

In order to preserve as well as possible the sculpture of this central portion, I needed a very thin metal paint. I chose the Alclad Steel, sprayed at 15 psi with my Badger 150 airbrush:

 

 

N.B: the close-up in the post #50 shows that the rod is rather Chrome. A good new, as it will increase the 3D effect and enhance this important element. This will be done after the wood paint job, and will be the last step for the propeller. Indeed, if I do it now, it will probably be a bit damaged by the mask.

 

The base color has been applied:

 

For the 2 nd wood species, I made a mix of the wood base color applied before and XF-10 Tamiya (Brown). With hindsight, I could have added a little bit of red (or used XF-9 Red Brown rather than XF-10), for a warmer shade...

 

The 2nd side has been applied, and now, it was time for minor touch-ups:

 

Thanks to the great Vallejo paints, the paintbrush touch-ups are invisible:

 

The best doc on which I may rely to represent these wood ribs is definitely the one of the post #37, on which the propeller is seen almost completely. 

 

 

The Clear Orange acts like a Clear varnish, but gives in the same time a warmer shade that I like a lot as it enhances imho the imitation of real varnished wood:

 

 

ATB, Olivier

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Both sides, there should be rivets on the fuselage:

 

 

They are missing on the Eduard kit. How to represent them? I placed them (2 mm between each rivet, there should be a bit more) with a 0,2 mm Uni Pin Mitsubishi pencil:

 

Problem: How to figure these rivets on my build?

- I don't think so tiny rivets are available in after-market

- an option is to patiently cut them from a 0,2 mm thickness stretched plastic, as I did above for the ones on the engine hood (post# 50)

- use the same option than on my first  build (on which only 5 rivets were represented). After the fuselage painting and weathering job, for each rivet, using the tip of a Kolinski paintbrush, make 2 successive dots with not thinned Vallejo paint: one Black first, and one White on the Black when the latter has dried. I learnt this technic from JMV and it gives a very nice result, with a 3D effect pleasing to the eye, as soon as you master it, with a bit training. You can see it on the posts# 1 and 27.

I think I will use the last option, because the 2nd one should give a disappointing result. It will indeed be very difficult to get rivets of the same height. But it will be easier to represent these rivets if I have marks for them. Yet, obviously, the black pen will have disappeared after the painting job. That's why I decide to create marks (small holes) right now, using again the Tamiya 0,2 mm drill:

 

Thanks for watching, Olivier

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

 

Important: before taking the impression of the internal and rear part of the seat with the small portion of Brown Stuff, apply a greasy substance (I used silicone spray) on the metal seat, so that you will be able to remove the cushion once the BS dry, what will make much easier the sculpture and finish of the cushion.

 

For this cushion, I will take inspiration in this ever posted doc (it is probably impossible to determine today what it looked like), even if on this doc, the seat (and the cushion, so)  is square:

 

 

Notice that the Master Caster resin set suggests too a very simple cushion for the 1/32 Nieuport 17:

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

 

Important: The plier must hold the PE part as close as possible from the area to sand

 

 

The importance of dry fit assembly:

[Brandy]

Coming along very nicely Olivier!

I've seen rivets like those done with paint Drill small holes in masking tape, stick in position and spray when the mask is removed the paint is left only where the holes were I haven't tried it myself but it may be worth a try. Here's the post, it's on page 2. I hope it's useful!

 

Ian

[Totally Mad Olivier]

A triple thanks, Ian, for the kind comment, for learning me that rivets decals did exist (I ignored that) and for the link to the great Louis job. I will study his technic, for sure!

 

ATB, Olivier

 

Edit: I must admit I have not understood in what this rivet creation technic consists. If someone may explain me clearly, it will be great! 

Furthermore, I have seen the rivets decals (especially the Archer ones), they seem to be a good option too. Have some of you ever used it?

Thanks in advance for your help 

[Brandy]

What he did was drill holes in thin plastic sheet in the rivet pattern, then taped the sheet in place. 6 or 7 passes with the airbrush left enough paint in the holes that when the stencil was removed the paint looked like rivet heads.

 

Ian

Edited March 29, 2020 by limeypilot

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Sorry, limeypilot, despite your explanation, it is not totally clear for me (maybe because of my quite poor english). 

Furthermore, I am thinking about the colors I should apply on the panels and floor. I tried to search docs to rely on. Here is what I found:

 

The doc below, not reliable on many aspects, shows wood side frames. Do you know if, on the WWI aircrafts, they were made of wood too? (or metal?). 

 

This other period pic seems to confirm my assumptions:

 

I suppose, when I see the 2nd of these docs, that the "panels" were just made of tense linen. The period pics (2 and 3) suggest imho that there was not really a floor (except forward where it seems to be a metal plate), the pilot put his feet on the feet rests, the latter being maybe made of wood (but the mirror effect we may see on the doc 2 could suggest that it was rather metal?) and supported by struts.

The period pics suggest anyway that the Eduard construction simplifies quite a lot quite the complex construction of this cockpit (especially the floor A21)...

 

 

In the lack of certainty, and as anyway, these areas will be just slightly visible, I will do my best, aware that my cockpit will be certainly not faithful to the reality...

 

ATB, Olivier 

 

P.S: another nice doc useful:

[Totally Mad Olivier]

19 hours ago, Olivier de St Raph said:

Sorry, limeypilot, despite your explanation, it is not totally clear for me (maybe because of my quite poor english). 

First, the night brought me the light, and I have understood your explanation, Ian, thanks again, I will do trials with this new technic (new for me, anyway)!

Then, as I was wondering of what material (wood or metal) the side frames were made, I made researches and I learnt (thanks to our hobby, we learn many things) that the aircrafts structure was very mainly made of wood. 

And I also fell on a great report published on France 2 last december, showing specialists of WWI aircrafts restoration. I suppose I can't publish this report, but here are a few screen captures, very interesting for the ignorant on the subject that I am:

 

So, on the 2nd doc of the post# 60 above, all horizontal frames were wooden made imho, while the vertical could be wood (in this case, they have a square section) or metal (tube section).

 

The photo below suggests that different kinds of blue could be used, and it is very possible that, on the Nieuport 11, it was light blue. I tried to send an e-mail to get more infos from a member of this group whose name was mentioned in the report, hoping I will get some certitudes...

 

 

On this aircraft (I don't know which one it is), there is a floor:

 

 

 

 

I also found this very nice and looking quite faithful cutaway:

 

Searching for docs takes time, but imho necessary to limit errors and get a quite faithful model (with many compromises, definitely). I look forward though to go on with my build.

 

ATB, Olivier

 

P.S: here is the link to watch the report that lasts less than 3 mn:

https://www.francetvinfo.fr/societe/guerre-de-14-18/video-13h15-dans-un-atelier-de-restauration-des-avions-de-chasse-pilotes-par-les-as-du-ciel-de-la-guerre-14-18_2496931.html
 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

[Biggu]

INCREDIBLE attention to detail, Oliver, I am enjoying this build immensely !

Jeff

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Thanks a lot, Jeff! You can't imagine how such comments are good to get for me, because I always wonder if so much attention to detail doesn't turn my thread boring a lot!

Glad to see some modelers like you are interested in my build, and it is a pleasure to share with them my passion.

ATB, Olivier

 

 

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

My master and friend Juan Manuel does it better but I used his double dot technic here:

 

 

 

 

Having built a first time this kit provides a very useful experience, I really don't regret to have taken such a decision. You know on which areas you have to focus (fe, by the narrow opening of the Nieuport 11 cockpit, you mainly see the seat, the cushion, the belts and the dashboard) and which one will be totally invisible, on which you don't need to spend time. And if I have a doubt, I can still check on my finished model, that I have at hand.

But there are other advantages of such a project. Without saying I am a pro of rigging, fe, I will necessary have more experience as I did that delicate step for the first time on my first version (I had just ever represented antennas on my Yak 3 or my P-47 Thunderbolt, but the rigging on a WWI aircraft is much more complex).

It is my first experience of rebuilding a kit like that, if I except the 1/12 Fiat 806 G.P, but in the latter case, the logic was completely different: I had, on the 2nd version, built the kit OOB, to enhance the incredible work of research and improvements brought to the quite poor Protar/ Italeri. The first version had required 13 months, the OOB needing only 3 weeks...

 

ATB, Olivier

 

P.S: for those interested by the huge research and build of the Fiat 806 (I was not alone in that research, far from that, and this avoided me many errors), here is the link:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwj6wf3vlsToAhWRzoUKHZ12AWEQFjABegQIAhAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.britmodeller.com%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3F%2Ftopic%2F235011875-fiat-806-research-and-scratchbuilds%2F&usg=AOvVaw2ERceJNLrWAGevwJ9EWB40

[RichieW]

Wow! Amazing attention to detail. Nothing boring about this thread, I love it. What a brilliant display of modelling skill!

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Thanks a lot, Richie, very glad to see you « love » this thread! It is very encouraging for me in the surrealist situation we actually live...
Atb, Olivier 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

 

 I am gonna focus now on the seat belts, a very important detail, as it is one of the most visible element in this cockpit...

 

Atb, Olivier

 

P.S: I did a trial with the rivets creation technic mentioned by Ian. I have to wait until the paint is dry now...

[Totally Mad Olivier]

If we refer to the photos below (a 1952 replica, as it seems), the dashboard was somewhat different than the Eduard PE part:

 

 

On the other hand, notice that the small dial on the right is present on the PE part 1:

 

Watching the docs just above gave me the idea to represent the glass of the dials, like I did on my P-51D Missouri Armada (a thread is dedicated to this build if you are interested):

 

 

 

 

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

For my first trial with Louis rivets technic, I used 0,26 mm thickness plastic card. It could be interesting to try (as he suggests in his thread) with a transparent plastic card, that would help to position the stencil.

 

 

 

[Brandy]

Sorry to see your first attempt didn't succeed, but it looks promising. I'm sure with a little practice it will be ok. I have not used the method as I don't think it's practical in 1:72.

 

Ian

[Totally Mad Olivier]

4 hours ago, limeypilot said:

Sorry to see your first attempt didn't succeed, but it looks promising. I'm sure with a little practice it will be ok. I have not used the method as I don't think it's practical in 1:72.

Thanks Ian for your encouragements. I made 0,3 mm holes for the rivets, I think going under this diameter would give uncertain results, and so it is maybe difficult to adapt to 1/72...

 

Olivier

 

Well, I didn't wait for a new trial, but directly on my model now (let's have confidence...). I used the small holes drilled before (my post# 54) to position as well as possible the stencil:

 

 

[Totally Mad Olivier]

 

[Terry1954]

This marvellous build continues to inspire and enthrall me!

 

Terry

[Totally Mad Olivier]

Thanks a lot Terry!

I hope this thread will make you want to build your Sopwith Camel (or rather Swallow...)

I have a lot of fun building this Nieuport 11 again, avoiding most of the hassles that a first one necessary causes (up to now, at least)

Atb, Olivier