EwenS Posted April 25, 2020 Share Posted April 25, 2020 I went back to the library and "A Hell of a Bomb" about Barnes Wallis' bombs and the dropping thereof (also republished under another title. Chapter 12 describes the mods to the production line B1 Specials and has this to say about the paint job. "To render the BI Special a little less conspicuous, 5 Group requested a day camouflage scheme, which was applied to later aircraft. This meant replacing the Night undersurfaces with a very pale green tone known as Sky, while retaining the standard upper finish of Dark Green and Dark Earth. However, someone slipped up, so PB995, the A&AEE trials aircraft, and the first few BI Specials issued to 617 arrived wearing their customary black coats." There were 32 BI Specials delivered in Feb / Mar 1945. PB995-998 and PD112-139. 24 of these were used on operations by 617 before the war ended. There is a photo in the book to confirm PB995 with Night undersides. Only 2 aircraft wore the letter C. PD115 but the this looks like a misprint to me as it shows up as K in raids before and after the one when it is listed as C. The second aircraft is the second production airframe PB996. The next two off the production line were PB997 being E and PB998 being D. So Jockneys picture above looks to me like PB996/C. So three questions: 1. At which airframe did the colour scheme change? 2. What was the underside colour? Sky as in the book or medium sea grey as on the artwork or something else as noted in the other thread 3. Was there a further change post-war? I see that there is another thread running on this so I'll post this there as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted April 25, 2020 Share Posted April 25, 2020 4 hours ago, JOCKNEY said: I think I may have made a c*ck up, does the camouflage go on the inside or outside of the twin tails ? You could go for one of each! The port fin/rudder of YZ*J is in night bomber scheme and the stbd fin/rudder is in day bomber scheme. Official photograph. © IWM (MH 30796) IWM Non Commercial License Two Avro Lancaster B Mark 1 (Specials), PD118 'YZ-M', PD129 'YZ-O', and a B Mark 1, NG489 'KC-M', all of No. 617 Squadron, Royal Air Force, based at Woodhall Spa, flying in 'vic' formation, 8 May 1945. (Port threequarter rear views). 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted April 25, 2020 Author Share Posted April 25, 2020 Thanks very much Dave My aircraft YZ J appears at the top and it looks like Airfix were right black on the outside, camo on the inside ! The photo description is strange as it doesn't appear to match any of the 3 aircraft in the picture ? As you say its appears to be a lottery on which colours the aircraft came in. Thanks again cheers Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted April 25, 2020 Share Posted April 25, 2020 36 minutes ago, JOCKNEY said: My aircraft YZ J appears at the top and it looks like Airfix were right black on the outside, camo on the inside ! Hi Pat My interpretation is that the port fin/rudder is black inside and out and is most liekely a replacement from another aircraft in night bomber scheme, the stbd fin/rudder will be camouflaged inside and out and is in the day bomber scheme. 40 minutes ago, JOCKNEY said: The photo description is strange as it doesn't appear to match any of the 3 aircraft in the picture ? Yes, I hadn't noticed that, I just copied the caption from the IWM site verbatim, how could they get the codes wrong? Is this a caption for another similar photograph? From what I can make out the correct caption should be:- Two Avro Lancaster B Mark 1 (Specials), PD114 'YZ-B', PD119 'YZ-J', and a B Mark 1, NG494 'KC-B', all of No. 617 Squadron, Royal Air Force, based at Woodhall Spa 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Posted April 25, 2020 Share Posted April 25, 2020 Just my £0.02 worth, as part of the Grand Slam weight-saving measures, the pilot’s armour was removed, and the navigator’s seat was replaced by a wickerwork seat. Not sure of the benefit of that but that’s what I’ve read! I’ve a 1/72 wickerwork seat ready for my Grand Slam (if ever get to build it!). Those seem to be the most obvious and visible internal changes. Oh, wasn’t there just one 0.5 mg fitted in the rear turret? One other thing, the photos I’ve seen of the 617 Squadron Grand Slam aircraft seem to show that the exhaust shrouds were deleted. The Airfix kit has them moulded in place .... . One day, when everyone’s converted & built a 617 Squadron Grand Slam Lancaster, some manufacturer will release an accurate kit- sorry, Hasegawa, but your version doesn’t quite make it in my view. Jonny 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted April 26, 2020 Author Share Posted April 26, 2020 Decision time, as i have been fortunate enough to have been provided with a period photo of my actual aircraft ( thanks again @Dave Swindell) i will paint the port rudder black inside and out the other camo. Yes its going to look a little strange but its factual for this particular aircraft. More pictures later. Thanks again for all the comments and information. cheers Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted April 26, 2020 Share Posted April 26, 2020 13 minutes ago, JOCKNEY said: Decision time, as i have been fortunate enough to have been provided with a period photo of my actual aircraft A few more for you Pat, including the one the erroneous caption is from AIRCRAFT OF THE ROYAL AIR FORCE 1939-1945:AVRO 683 LANCASTER. © IWM (MH 30791) This one shows J with the codes across the tailplane, can't get the image to link direct. https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205042753 Official photograph. © IWM (MH 30795) IWM Non Commercial License Official photograph. © IWM (MH 30796) IWM Non Commercial License Official photograph. © IWM (MH 30793) IWM Non Commercial License 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 8, 2020 Author Share Posted May 8, 2020 Long overdue an update, so here is where the build has got to. Currently wrestling with masking and painting the clear parts, new evilbay masking tape leaks, serves me right for not buying the proper stuff ! Objective for today finish painting clear parts.... Where has all the time gone in this GB ? Cheers Pat 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 hour ago, JOCKNEY said: Objective for today finish painting clear parts.... Where has all the time gone in this GB ? Totally agree with you on the elapsed time!! Not long to go and I’ve still got so much to do. As for the clear bits I’ve gone there, initially failed, however (thankfully) have now recovered. Still need to do the tail turret, but the nose and canopy are complete. Your Lanc is looking good Pat, I can see the crew marvelling at that huge Grand Slam and thinking “” Bloody Hell, how we gonna get off the ground with that thing strapped to the belly?” Cheers.. Dave 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vppelt68 Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 43 minutes ago, Rabbit Leader said: Totally agree with you on the elapsed time!! Not long to go and I’ve still got so much to do. As for the clear bits I’ve gone there, initially failed, however (thankfully) have now recovered. Still need to do the tail turret, but the nose and canopy are complete. Your Lanc is looking good Pat, I can see the crew marvelling at that huge Grand Slam and thinking “” Bloody Hell, we gonna get off the ground with that thing strapped to the belly?” Cheers.. Dave And the ordnance erks marvelling and thinking "Bloody hell, how are we gonna get that thing off the ground and strapped to the belly?" It´s looking very good, Pat 👍. Let´s not get further into the elapsed time- discussion, please! V-P 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 8, 2020 Author Share Posted May 8, 2020 I'm surprised that a Grand Slam Lancaster doesn't hold the altitude record, I imagine when the weight finally came off, it would have nearly gone into orbit ! 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 10, 2020 Author Share Posted May 10, 2020 Clear parts on, coated in Klear, still the bomb and decals, but getting there ! Theres a blooming lot of decals, even the bomb has 3 ! Cheers Pat 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted May 10, 2020 Share Posted May 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, JOCKNEY said: Theres a blooming lot of decals, even the bomb has 3 ! Don’t complain Pat... it’s not a Phantom! Nice framework on those clear bits., you doing t he kit scheme aren’t you? Cheers.. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 10, 2020 Author Share Posted May 10, 2020 Absolutely mate, life is complicated enough at the moment without setting any more challenges ! Besides, how many other Grandslam sported different coloured stabilisers ! Cheers Pat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruskin Air Services Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 On 4/13/2020 at 10:28 AM, Rabbit Leader said: I agree, that Lanc is looking great. I've always wanted to build an original 1980 Airfix Lanc boxing, so will try to hunt one down one of these days just to say I've built one. Mrs Jockney must be certainly under the pump and isolating her from the rest of the family must add to the overall stress. Once this whole sordid episode is over all those NHS workers deserve a huge prize, bonus, medal - whatever it takes they deserve it! . Let's hear three big cheers for Mrs Jockey.. hip hip.. hooray, hip hip.. hooray, hip hip.. hooray!! Cheers and take care.. Dave It's a great kit try and get an early one the better they are and moulded in black styrene. This one I built a month ago, I have 2 more of these plus the new Airfix one in an bbmf boxing and the revell one with the duff dihedral 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 17, 2020 Author Share Posted May 17, 2020 The decals are putting up a real fight, and I'm not convinced I'm winning to be honest, it's taking ages and the decals are silvering like a complete So and so ! I still have the red centres to do on the sides but those particular decals were almost inside out and back to front trying to get them off the backing paper ! I've no doubt this has been covered before, but any tips on what can be done to minimise silvering after the decals are one ? Its so nearly finished but the blooming decals have completely removed the enjoyment of finishing this one Cheers Pat 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCKNEY Posted May 22, 2020 Author Share Posted May 22, 2020 Well I'm calling this one done, thank you for all the support along the way, especially @vppelt68 for the replacement props and @Dave Swindell for the help with colours. Pictures below, I hope you enjoy them let me know what you think. Cheers Pat 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 32 minutes ago, JOCKNEY said: Well I'm calling this one done Nice one Pat, it looks "Grand"! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vppelt68 Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 Congratulations Pat, it looks very good indeed! A grand effort, you really slammed it this time 👍. V-P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhantomBigStu Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 That looks fantastic pat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted May 22, 2020 Share Posted May 22, 2020 Yes, a big congrats from your Aussie mate as well. She’s come up trumps Pat and it looks lovely now that it’s all finished. Cheers and well modelled.. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ventora3300 Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 Lovely job, Pat. Makes me want to do one of these just so I can do the bomb! Well done on walking the 'accuracy' tightrope - makes the final result all that more interesting. All the best. Mike. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveyGair Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 Lovely job Pat. I hope there's another Lanc' GB in the future, had too much on to do one justice in this GB. Davey. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliffB Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Congratulations Pat Cheers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jean Posted May 29, 2020 Share Posted May 29, 2020 Hi Pat, a really hands on build! A shame about the silvering, but it does not appear too badly at all on the photos. I feel sorry for anybody who had the great misfortune to be anywhere near such a bomb when it hit the ground... Scary stuff, really. I am impressed by your attention to detail. Congrats are definitely in order!!!! What's next? I am sure you can find a great Monogram B-36 for a song if you look hard enough. Just what you need. And think how proud Mrs Jockney will be when it is finished!!! Take care JR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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