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F-104G Starfighter Luftwaffe 1987 - Kinetic 1/48


Andy350

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I'm getting frustrated, I am at a loss of what colour is going where, I don't know if the black grey should be black?  Or if Olive green is in fact FS 34079?  Or even why there are four colours specified when I can only see 3.  Why don't kinetic just point the colour code to the bloody section in the drawing, people like me have never heard of FS 34079. 🤬

 

 

49399285111_d968aacfe1_b.jpg

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10 minutes ago, Andy350 said:

I'm getting frustrated, I am at a loss of what colour is going where, I don't know if the black grey should be black?  Or if Olive green is in fact FS 34079?  Or even why there are four colours specified when I can only see 3.  Why don't kinetic just point the colour code to the bloody section in the drawing, people like me have never heard of FS 34079. 

FS34079 is the darkest green in the classic US Vietmam scheme. The black grey of the Norm 83 is indeed a charcoal "almost black". The third shade is RAL6014 Gelboliv, of the splinter scheme (Norm 62) that preceded the Norm 83.

 

Hope this helps..! What brands of paint do you have access to?

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

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1 minute ago, Hook said:

FS34079 is the darkest green in the classic US Vietmam scheme. The black grey of the Norm 83 is indeed a charcoal "almost black". The third shade is RAL6014 Gelboliv, of the splinter scheme (Norm 62) that preceded the Norm 83.

 

Hope this helps..! What brands of paint do you have access to?

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

Hi Andre,

Very helpful yes.

I have the MIG paints as described in the kit.  But they look nothing that the drawings would suggest.  Would Olive green look darker then FS34079?

 

So MIG-001 = RAL 6003 Olive green

MIG-008 = RAL 7021 black grey

MIG-206 - FS 34079.

 

I think I've put the wrong colours down in the wrong places.

 

 

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This is why I've got stuck today.  If I follow this chart and map the colours to where it suggests they go the finished model looks different this.  This is because, Olive green is darker than FS34079.  So what I have done is put FS34079 where olive green should go.

 

49399656122_56c83f96f3_o.jpg

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25 minutes ago, Hook said:

FS34079 is the darkest green in the classic US Vietmam scheme. The black grey of the Norm 83 is indeed a charcoal "almost black". The third shade is RAL6014 Gelboliv, of the splinter scheme (Norm 62) that preceded the Norm 83.

 

Hope this helps..! What brands of paint do you have access to?

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

 

RAL 6014 is not used in Norm 83 scheme. RAL 6003, FS 34079 and RAL 7021. :nod:

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I really just need to make sure that I am putting down the correct colours in the right  places.  I think I am using the diagram and thinking it's wrong because these are not the actual colours.  In reality Olive green looks more like what they call FS34079, and visa a versa.  Does that make sense?

 

 

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On the real scheme FS 34079 is darker then RAL 6003. This is a good picture to compare: KLICK  Startet from the right it is FS34079, around "26+44" it is RAL 6003. Maybe helpfull is the Revell instruction showing the 4 view scheme of "26+44" on page 31.

 

Edit: Startet from the right not left.

Edited by JayBee
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12 minutes ago, JayBee said:

On the real scheme FS 34079 is darker then RAL 6003. This is a good picture to compare: KLICK  Startet from the right it is FS34079, around "26+44" it is RAL 6003. Maybe helpfull is the Revell instruction showing the 4 view scheme of "26+44" on page 31.

 

Edit: Startet from the right not left.

Thanks for that. I'm going to paint to the pics, got the right colours. 

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You´re welcome Andy! Maybe interesting, before Norm 83 was introduced it was planned that some F-104 have to be painted in a rudimentary scheme called "Norm 62 Ü/83" using only the Norm 62 colors RAL 6014 and RAL 7012 in a wraparound scheme. But due to costs it was cancelled and 23+30 was the only aircraft the scheme was partial and not complete applied. KLICK and KLICK. Silver parts on the bottom are still visible and not repainted.

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I think the primary paint job is now complete, I have the wheel struts to prime and paint, that should be tomorrow, and then fit under carriage doors etc.

 

49400147123_99fca34db5_b.jpg

 

 

Port side underside wing needs some airbrushing to fix those brush marks, not sure why I thought using the brush was a good move.

 

49400623566_5e3b18d7d9_b.jpg

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Excuse me for being a bit late to the party, but the colors on the model do look "strange".

 

The RAL 7021 should be almost black (on the model it looks closer to RAL 7012),

RAL 6003 should be rather "vivid" and "green",

FS34079 should be dull and darker in comparison to RAL 6003

 

This pic http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/f104Liz1.htm

comes close to my perception / memory of the colors (yes, including being patchy and "spot repair" using old 7012 on the tank).

 

"Still OK":

http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/2164.htm

and

http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/Album/a2652.htm

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11 minutes ago, Jochen Barett said:

Excuse me for being a bit late to the party, but the colors on the model do look "strange".

 

The RAL 7021 should be almost black (on the model it looks closer to RAL 7012),

RAL 6003 should be rather "vivid" and "green",

FS34079 should be dull and darker in comparison to RAL 6003

 

This pic http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/f104Liz1.htm

comes close to my perception / memory of the colors (yes, including being patchy and "spot repair" using old 7012 on the tank).

 

"Still OK":

http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/2164.htm

and

http://www.916-starfighter.de/Large/Album/a2652.htm

I suppose I have a choice, remove all paint and start again, go over freehand on top of what's there, leave as is. 

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3 hours ago, Witness said:

Why can't you just paint over what's already there? 

If I use the same colour will it not look the same?  I agree this black/grey is not black enough.  I could add some black to 7021, but it will be hit and miss.

Edited by Andy350
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13 minutes ago, Andy350 said:

Don't think this is salvageable

Sadly, I would have to agree.

3 hours ago, Andy350 said:

Any thoughts on this?  

The black looks good, the darker green appears too light and the olive green a bit not vivid enough.

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

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12 minutes ago, Hook said:

 

Sadly, I would have to agree.

The black looks good, the darker green appears too light and the olive green a bit not vivid enough.

 

Cheers,

 

Andre

Thanks Andre, I'm not sure what happened with the colours, I made up the black in the end.  I'm happy to leave these colours now, I'm not very good at spending too much time fixing my mistakes.  Thanks for the pointers though.

Edited by Andy350
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1 minute ago, Jochen Barett said:

What paints did you use for RAL 7021, RAL 6003 and FS34079?

 

The "black" sure improved the result.

All those colours, I've just remembered, I painted the whole model with FS34079 first and then used the others on top, so that might have caused the final issues?  I did this because I was making masking mistakes and painting the wrongs areas.  In the end I free handed the black/grey which is why the the lines are blurred.

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Who made those paints and put the labels on?

 

Or did you reach them via a "color match table" like RAL 6003 is olive green and with paint brand X olive green is No 47 and brand X's No 47 is brand Z's M263 ...

 

The FS34079 "base coat" may have darkened the RAL 6003 (compared to a light grey base coat) but it should have darkened the RAL 7021 as well.

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