A BIG Rolls-Royce Version II 1-7-2020

[Pouln]

On 5/7/2020 at 7:32 PM, Codger said:

Well Jeroen, this is tough to respond to. Your comments are very generous of course. But I will tell you that there's a galaxy of stellar builders (pun intended !) here that cause me to feel that exact way - my 'level 10' to their 'level 1000'.

I refer to the superb scratch builders of long-running, complex projects. Along with those that super-detail and do advanced builds on large scale kits (sadly, fewer of those lately) and already complex MFH kits. A goodly number of guys are doing incredible, high-quality builds.

I suspect in this case, there is not a large fan base for elderly Rolls Royces, which is completely understandable. It's a somewhat 'acquired' taste. Although good work may be appreciated, there's just not enough motivation to corner the market in these and build a  fleet of them. So I am fortunate to be able to display the work of Cox here.

He has accumulated the parts, kits and research over decades. Rather than build the same model in different colors, through creativity, he devised the magical mutants seen here. A rare collection indeed.

If there were further interest in his work, I could probably coerce him into letting me display a few of his non-Rolls, classic Pocher builds - Bugattis, Mercedes, Fiats and several creative 'monster' one-offs that sprang from them. I had hoped to keep this a Rolls-centric thread with your Rolls builds within but again, I recognize that there is very limited Rolls interest.

My main hope in showing my own work is that value could be found for the casual builder. Techniques I employed while solving problems can apply to very basic builds. And I hoped to inspire those builders to be creative and fearless about altering their basic model.

All discussion welcomed. / C

Chas, I don’t think that the lack of response you mentioned, should be taken as lack of interest. Like Jeroen, I am in awe of the quality of the builds you show us here (your own and David Cox’). Happy to see that you show us more of the wonderful builds that David created and do let them come. Whether they are Rollers or others fine brands or even such amazing cross-overs. 

 

They are all wonderful and bring ideas to the table of options one have when starting such a build.

 

Do continu, if you please. 

Edited May 23, 2020 by Pouln

[Pouln]

On 5/22/2020 at 1:23 PM, Codger said:

First one starts with or makes the leather very thin. This allows pulling tight to stretch. CA is the adhesive of choice and sometimes double-sided or transfer tape. But not just any CA; the very thin will stain through the back of the leather to the front and ruin your work. Only one I know of will not and is called 'Bondini'. The preferred adhesive is CA Gel (I like Loctite) which for some reason does not. When making pleats a sharp straight edge is used to push leather into the pleat gap. Like the back of a knife or saw blade.

It's way up there in my actual build where I show the front and rear seats being fashioned.

A more save method to do the pleats is to use a polished bone device. I acquired one a long time ago. Will make a picture and post it. If you search for tools for upholsterers you may find them. Using this device it is 100% certain that you will not damage the leather. 
 

Ah, I found the picture of the tool in my own Coupe thread at: 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235013377-alfa-romeo-coupe-elegant-18/&do=findComment&comment=2575912

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by Pouln

[Codger]

30 minutes ago, Pouln said:

Ah, I found the picture of the tool in my own Coupe thread at: 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235013377-alfa-romeo-coupe-elegant-18/&do=findComment&comment=2575912

 

Poul, most appreciate you adding valuable info to my thread. Obviously many ways to skin a cat or in this case, upholster a Pocher!  We each have methods that work best for us - thanks for sharing and please continue to do so. / C

[Schwarz-Brot]

That would be the ancient "bone folder", commonly used in bookbinding. Look at bookbinding suppliers if you need one. Very useful tool for any kind of folding and creasing of weak materials. Cheap.

[Pouln]

Yes indeed. That is the one I mean. To be found on Ali-express, but, should you want one, be sure to buy one made of bone and 

not the plastic ones

[Codger]

2 hours ago, Pouln said:

Yes indeed. That is the one I mean. To be found on Ali-express, but, should you want one, be sure to buy one made of bone and 

not the plastic ones

A good tip indeed. I also found that a 42 tooth model saw blade embeds 'teethmarks' in the creases which look exactly like very subtle stitches.

[JeroenS]

On 23/05/2020 at 21:50, Pouln said:

Chas, I don’t think that the lack of response you mentioned, should be taken as lack of interest.

Absolutely not!

[JeroenS]

Speaking of Rolls Royce models... 

 

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a32651124/rolls-royce-cullinan-scale-model-revealed/

[Codger]

On 5/26/2020 at 3:46 AM, JeroenS said:

Speaking of Rolls Royce models... 

 

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a32651124/rolls-royce-cullinan-scale-model-revealed/

This one even makes Pochers look cheap...But let's see... if I chop that top and.........

[Codger]

Off the path again...

In presenting the models of Dave Cox, I have shown you some of his prolific Rolls builds and pointed -out that these are mainly 'Cox' models and very little remains 'Pocher'. I have also said that he has built all of the Pocher kit lines over three + decades. Seeing them is as educational as any of the Rolls-based models.

Now I show what looks like an Alfa in my Rolls thread. But it is in fact a 'Cox Monster' as he is wont to do from time to time to escape the tedium of building OOB Pochers that some customers wish.

Although the DNA is Alfa, what makes this lovely -dirt track style' missile unique? The sharp-eyed among you will quickly spot the ribbed blower sticking through the hood side.

How about a Pocher Bugatti engine - which is now a straight TWELVE CYLINDER Bugatti engine? That's one and one half of joined Bugatti engines. No doubt about the 'Monster' classification.

A home was made for that by extending the Alfa frame and fortifying it with an  MMC bronze front axle. The usual Cox extreme details abound including all needed linkages and hoses, a dirt track style screen over the radiator and a neat little hatch for the coolant fill cap.

The all-business cockpit shouts what the purpose of all this is - probably a frightening place to be:

The hood upper panels are brass as the whole thing is extended to cover the yards-long Bugatti. As always his eye for proportions and style produced what looks like a 'simple' model compared to say, the Star of India Rolls. But it abounds in detail and inspiration from every angle:

 

 

[harveyb258]

Rather a strange colour scheme, I must say. It's like a budgie on steroids.... I love it. 

That last pic looks incredible.

[Codger]

17 hours ago, harveyb258 said:

Rather a strange colour scheme, I must say. It's like a budgie on steroids.... I love it. 

That last pic looks incredible.

Perhaps Mr H, Cox chose his colors to blend into my neighborhood....

[Pouln]

Ahh, I like it. And yes, it does fit nicely in your area. 

[harveyb258]

Perfect.

[Codger]

Out of The Past...

Way out - 1993 in fact! Dodgy photos are proof of that! Again from the fertile and slightly off-kilter archive of Dave Cox Pochers. I present an early 'monster' of his, possibly where the concept first took shape. It seems David has been a repository of derelict Pochers over the decades, rescuing them from would-be builders who realized that Pocher classics were deep waters to swim in and gave up. He happened upon an Alfa Muletto that was largely assembled but suffered from epoxy poisoning - the body was joined to the chassis and glopped with it. Heartbreaking for most but a 'light-bulb' moment for David.

Here is the result - a dirt-track, jalopy- style single seater, possibly of the '40's or '50's, with big motor and little else:

What are we looking at? How about a shortened Rolls chassis, highly modified Rolls engine, topped with some of a bare-bones Alfa body. A custom aluminum hood covers the elongated engine bay:

Most obvious is the custom log aluminum intake manifold with three SU-style downdraft carburetors, a hop-up modification from the single updraft Rolls assembly. Much of the Rolls frou-frou is stripped away for outright function only for speed. Changes to the cooling and oiling system abound.

This in-process shot reveals one magneto per side and the start of the bare-bone linkage required to run this thing. Each set of double plugs is independent of the other with no cross-over linkage.

The shortened chassis makes for a cramped cockpit sharing an oil catch tank with a very brave pilot:

Now even under intense questioning from me, Cox would only say that the 'zoomie-style' exhaust pipes were, 'removable' to close the hood completely. He just plain wanted that look for the character of this thing. Who am I to argue with probable genius?

Jalopies of the day were not beyond fantastic claims for their performance:

Also of note are the gigantic-appearing wheels. They are in fact Rolls wheel-sized wearing stock Rolls tires. But they are simplified disc-style resin wheels made by a friend to Dave. The original victim Alfa had un-usable wheels.

A bit of real-world context may prove Cox not so zany after all. This could be anywhere in rural America in the stated time frame and be perfectly at home.

So if you have a somewhat derelict Pocher which causes you shame, contact David for ideas on how to give it a new and un-realized life. Or send it his way for life-saving surgery. It's hard to argue with his imagination.

 

And by the way...I have it on good authority (harsh lights and rubber-hose beatings) that David is currently working on a new significant 'monster'. One in fact that Rolls themselves might have built. Very conservative but practical as these things go. One in fact that the slightly ambitious among you might attempt without needing a surgeons license. You will eventually see it here;  it's been in process a few months and will be a few months more but the major architecture and brain-storming is all in place. I will cruelly leave you with that tantalizing thought for Pocher classic lovers......... /

 

[johnlambert]

That's very inventive and beautifully executed.

[Pouln]

21 hours ago, Codger said:

Out of The Past...

Way out - 1993 in fact! Dodgy photos are proof of that! Again from the fertile and slightly off-kilter archive of Dave Cox Pochers. I present an early 'monster' of his, possibly where the concept first took shape. It seems David has been a repository of derelict Pochers over the decades, rescuing them from would-be builders who realized that Pocher classics were deep waters to swim in and gave up. He happened upon an Alfa Muletto that was largely assembled but suffered from epoxy poisoning - the body was joined to the chassis and glopped with it. Heartbreaking for most but a 'light-bulb' moment for David.

Here is the result - a dirt-track, jalopy- style single seater, possibly of the '40's or '50's, with big motor and little else:

 

What are we looking at? How about a shortened Rolls chassis, highly modified Rolls engine, topped with some of a bare-bones Alfa body. A custom aluminum hood covers the elongated engine bay:

 

Most obvious is the custom log aluminum intake manifold with three SU-style downdraft carburetors, a hop-up modification from the single updraft Rolls assembly. Much of the Rolls frou-frou is stripped away for outright function only for speed. Changes to the cooling and oiling system abound.

This in-process shot reveals one magneto per side and the start of the bare-bone linkage required to run this thing. Each set of double plugs is independent of the other with no cross-over linkage.

The shortened chassis makes for a cramped cockpit sharing an oil catch tank with a very brave pilot:

 

Now even under intense questioning from me, Cox would only say that the 'zoomie-style' exhaust pipes were, 'removable' to close the hood completely. He just plain wanted that look for the character of this thing. Who am I to argue with probable genius?

 

Jalopies of the day were not beyond fantastic claims for their performance:

 

Also of note are the gigantic-appearing wheels. They are in fact Rolls wheel-sized wearing stock Rolls tires. But they are simplified disc-style resin wheels made by a friend to Dave. The original victim Alfa had un-usable wheels.

 

A bit of real-world context may prove Cox not so zany after all. This could be anywhere in rural America in the stated time frame and be perfectly at home.

 

So if you have a somewhat derelict Pocher which causes you shame, contact David for ideas on how to give it a new and un-realized life. Or send it his way for life-saving surgery. It's hard to argue with his imagination.

 

And by the way...I have it on good authority (harsh lights and rubber-hose beatings) that David is currently working on a new significant 'monster'. One in fact that Rolls themselves might have built. Very conservative but practical as these things go. One in fact that the slightly ambitious among you might attempt without needing a surgeons license. You will eventually see it here;  it's been in process a few months and will be a few months more but the major architecture and brain-storming is all in place. I will cruelly leave you with that tantalizing thought for Pocher classic lovers......... /

 

Whatever David gets in his hands, Bugatti, AR etc, it seems that he somehow imagines it’s a Rolls😃.

Wild imagination that is.  Very nice example this ARR.

 

Btw. These carbs actually look more like the default Alfa carbs Than like SU’s.

 

Interested to see the latest developments/inventions he is working on.

 

[Codger]

3 minutes ago, Pouln said:

Whatever David gets in his hands, Bugatti, AR etc, it seems that he somehow imagines it’s a Rolls😃.

Wild imagination that is.  Very nice example this ARR.

 

Btw. These carbs actually look more like the default Alfa carbs Than like SU’s.

 

Interested to see the latest developments/inventions he is working on.

 

Sharp eye of a Pocher Alfa builder - the carbs are from an Alfa kit (s). The origins were the Mikuni (est 1923) carbs which were SU's built under license by Mikuni.

The Rolls has proven to be a very versatile host and parts supplier for many creative builds. I can post others of the classics he has built, but they are largely very advanced models of stock cars. Umm, except the Alfa Bimotore (what it sounds like) and the 1750 cc 'Flaying Star' Alfa concept car. True 'monsters' and not Rolls-related.  If there's interest, I will round-up presentations of those and add them here.

You will definitely see the Rolls now in progress.

 

 

[Pouln]

Dear Chas, you do know the answer, do you?

Yes, Yes, Yes, there sure is interest👍

[Codger]

1 hour ago, Pouln said:

Dear Chas, you do know the answer, do you?

Yes, Yes, Yes, there sure is interest👍

I think you're an audience of one Poul but I have petitioned Mr Cox for relevant information. These ARE interesting, off-the-path Pocher conversions, very accurate to the real cars. No make-believe stuff on them. And they were displayed on some very high quality venues.

[silver911]

Make that two

[Roy vd M.]

There's a three people audience. 

[Codger]

Be careful - you lot are in danger of becoming Codger's Pocher Scoundrels !

[Pouln]

Add to these three the silent majority and you have a group. 
Besides, we know that you fancy these art exhibitions😜

[Codger]

21 minutes ago, Pouln said:

Add to these three the silent majority and you have a group. 
Besides, we know that you fancy these art exhibitions😜

Guilty as charged - and I'm hoping your on-going Alfa will become part ! It is extremely rare as these go....