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Basilisk

Major Walter Sigel's R-2 mount from I./St.G 3 as a 2 in 1 build

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I better come up with a build as well. As the title states, I am building the Ju 87R-2 flown by Major Walter Sigel Commanding Officer (Grupenkomandeur) from I./St.G 3 in the colours of the Stabsstaffel (green) during his time in Greece 1941. I haven't seen many (actually any) builds of his Berta which is odd as it has some attractive markings.

 

Sigel’s various Stukas are relatively well documented, but there is some confusing information about the looks of his Bertas.

 

Xtradecals has his B-1 covered on sheet X48164 (and also on the 1/72 sheet) when part of I./St.G 76, but these markings are unfortunately not correct for a I./St.G 3 aircraft, so I have to come up with my own marking one way or another.

 

I found this picture below on the Internet and have never seen it published anywhere. It shows most likely Sigel’s aircraft in Balkan theater markings photographed in May 41 at Argos in Greece.

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Of interest are the white outlined green individual letters A on top of the wings and the yellow elevators. Together with the yellow nose and yellow wheel pants tips it is indeed a very colourful example.

 

The picture below is published in many publications and does also show Sigel's aircraft. Captions place this image from France in early 41 to Bulgaria in April 41, to Zemun (near Belgrade) in Yugoslavia in Autumn 41 and to Greece in 41 depending where the picture is published :wacko:

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And most profiles show it like this.

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But white theater markings just don't add up for the places this picture was apparently taken, so I asked the question on Hyperscale if someone could shed some light on this. In addition, the green Winkel (chevron) is missing on many profiles and the squadron batch is white and not yellow.

 

The chevron is clearly visible on another picture taken at the same day.

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And Georg Morrison had an explanation which is rather interesting: "This is part of a series of lined-up I/St.G 3 machines (S1+AB, S1+CB, S1+NH, among others) taken after the  Balkans / Crete campaign in southern Greece (possibly Crete) in early November 41.

 

The yellow theater markings had been overpainted and white theater markings applied for the unit's move to Derna in North Africa in mid-November 1941.

 

Depending on the quality / vintage of the print, you can see a tonal difference (the paint is 'flatter' or 'more matte') on the cowlings.  The area beneath the radiator was still yellow -- there's some film footage in which the bright color beneath the radiator 'pops out' at the eye of the viewer as the formation passes above.  The fuselage bands were white, albeit not as bright as the factory-applied fuselage cross."

 

The flat paint is indeed visible on both pictures above and of interest is also that this aircraft also had yellow wheel pants tips, which wasn't common, making it more likely that both aircraft are potentially be the same aicraft.

 

My intention is to build Sigel's aircraft first in the full Balkan theater markings as seen on Argos in May 41

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And after taking a series of pictures, I intend to do what happened to the real aircraft and change it by overpainting the relevant parts as described above to the way it looked like before the transfer to North Africa in November 41.

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Not often do you see Luftwaffe aircraft with yellow AND white theater markings!

 

I will use the 1/48 new tool Airfix B-2/R-2 kit for this build.

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And I did find some additional goodies in my stash I may use.

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So I am all set, but with my track record I may not get past the cockpit stage :shrug:

Cheers, Peter

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A very interesting project Peter and some great research on your part.

It will be great to see the two sets of pics of the aircraft finished in the 2 different schemes.

Looks like you have just about every piece of aftermarket goodness that is out there, this should be a great build.

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Hi Peter,

 

impressive comes to mind!

Have fun!!!

 

JR

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Detailed research for a detailed project. I’m looking forward to this

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17 hours ago, modelling minion said:

A very interesting project Peter and some great research on your part.

It will be great to see the two sets of pics of the aircraft finished in the 2 different schemes.

Looks like you have just about every piece of aftermarket goodness that is out there, this should be a great build.

Thanks. I do enjoy researching markings - kind of a hobby of mine. Yes I do have a nice choice of aftermarket goodies, but never what I really need :(

 

13 hours ago, jean said:

Hi Peter,

 

impressive comes to mind!

Have fun!!!

 

JR

That is the plan - just lets hope Murphy is on holidays for the next 3 month.

 

11 hours ago, Valkyrie said:

Detailed research for a detailed project. I’m looking forward to this

Thanks, I hope I won't disappoint.

 

Cheers, Peter

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Hi Peter,

 

one thing I have learned over my long and wretched life: Murphy never goes on holidays!

Have fun nonetheless.

 

JR

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I'm in on this one. Your research has intrigued me. How are you going to do the decals for it?

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On 1/9/2020 at 11:51 PM, jean said:

Hi Peter,

 

one thing I have learned over my long and wretched life: Murphy never goes on holidays!

Have fun nonetheless.

 

JR

That what I am afraid off.

 

7 hours ago, Greg Law said:

I'm in on this one. Your research has intrigued me. How are you going to do the decals for it?

Most likely a mixture of decals and masks I create on my silhouette printer. The challenge will be the squadron marking.

 

I got started on the kit over the weekend and put the knife to plastic. Not a bad effort by Airfix, but not perfect either. Most new tool Airfix kit just have this short run kit feel to it and are a bit soft in some details.

 

The kit is touted to be the most accurate Berta kit in 1/48 which is most likely true (I haven't measured the part), but when it comes to details, it is a different story - more about this when my build progresses. But I would have preferred Airfix didn't do this halfhearted effort in adding some rivet representations here and there.

 

One thing is sure, the designers of this kit surely had a hidden agenda to place as many as possible of the ejector pins in places to be seen:whistle:

 

So the first task after cleaning the parts was to fill this indents from the ejector pins in the visible cockpit area.

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And there is no shortage of them.

 

I decided to add the cockpit side panels not to the floor as per the instructions, but glue them to the fuselage sides instead as this will make the detail painting much easier. And I noticed an odd thing. The port fuselage half has no integrated ribs on the fuselage side, making the insert sitting flush. But that is not the case with the starboard fuselage! There are several ribs interfering with the insert resulting that the insert isn't sitting flash :(

 

So I removed the interfering ribs from the starboard fuselage half with a gouge.

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As a bonus, I could glue some of the removed ribs into the port fuselage which has no ribs at all in parts where they are visible after the insert is in place.

 

And at the end the inserts fitted nicely and don't look too bad.

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I removed the MG bullet cartridges which had been part of the starboard insert as the representation had just a vague resemblance with the actual part.

 

I also closed of the rear of the FuG VIII radio equipment.

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I will utilize the Eduard PE set but have to work out first which parts I will use and which not.

 

Originally I intended to replace the kit seats with the Quickboost offering. Here is the comparison between the two.

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I came to the conclusion that the Airfix offering is more accurate for a Berta. One problem is that there are no pictures of the pilot seat I could find. The next best thing was a sketch from the pilot's manual.

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In my eyes, the Airfix seat is closer to the proportion of the actual seat.

 

Also the Quickboost gunner's seat isn't correct. It represents the seat used in the Dora with a lower back part. The Berta seat has a noticeable higher back part as can be seen in the sketch and the picture and the Airfix seat looks much better.

 

But Airfix has it located central in the fuselage whereby it should be closer to starboard as can be seen in the above picture! Airfix got it right in their 1/72 Stuka kit so I am puzzled why they placed it central in the 1/48 kit.

 

Other omissions I noticed are the missing gun sight and head protector bar for the pilot, again both this parts are contained in the 1/72 Stuka kit. And then there is the missing head armor. Yes the early B-2 had none, but they were added soon and it would have been nice to have them (there are three types) included.

 

That is where I am now with some fun ahead of bending and gluing some fiddly PE stuff - hopefully I won't loose half of them to the carpet monster.

 

Thanks for looking,

Cheers, Peter

Edited by Basilisk

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Good observations with the seat proportions of the resin aftermarket parts . I always blindly go thinking the resin will be better simply because iv paid extra for it .

 

Will be following your build closely

 

Cheers

Alistair

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Excellent run down.  I'm surprised about the ejection Marks on this kit. Who ever  designed it must be living in the past.

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On 1/12/2020 at 11:46 PM, Mottlemaster said:

Good observations with the seat proportions of the resin aftermarket parts . I always blindly go thinking the resin will be better simply because iv paid extra for it .

You are spot on, unfortunately some replacement parts are as bad as what they should replace.

 

On 1/13/2020 at 5:40 AM, Greg Law said:

Excellent run down.  I'm surprised about the ejection Marks on this kit. Who ever  designed it must be living in the past.

Thanks, I am trying to make it helpful for others too.

 

I spent two evenings fighting the Eduard PE parts and all the bits are now in place which I like to add before painting without loosing anyting to the carpet monster :thumbsup:

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came out all right and I will add some of the pre-painted stuff after the cockpit is painted.

 

Eduard also provides some rudder pedal replacements.

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They are certainly better than the kit part, but the real pedals look different, mainly with a much higher heel part and two rows of holes in it. I know this is extreme rivet counting, but the Ju 87 is one of the few planes you actually can see the rudder pedals reasonably well.

 

As I purchased a new toy before Christmas in the shape of an Elegoo Mars, I thought I will have a go making my own rudder pedals.

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Some of you may already know what this monstrosity is. For you who don't, it is a resin 3D printer

 

It uses liquid resin which is exposed to UV light layer by layer which hardens and forms the 3d object.

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These items are photographed immediately after the printing has finished and before cleaning.

 

And here after the resin is cleaned and fully cured.

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I downloaded the above models from the web to test the capability of the printer and I was very impressed what can be done.

 

So I designed the parts I like to print in Solidworks yesterday.

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This is a rendered image of the rudder pedals, radio fuse boxes and oxygen regulators I hope to print.

 

Now it is one thing to print an object 40 by 80mm in size like my test prints, but above part is 8 by 20mm and the individual fuse boxes as an example are 1 by 2mm with a height of 1.2mm. I hope to print the parts on the weekend and will see if it is possible or not.

 

Wish me luck.

Cheers, Peter

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Peter can i ask you how long the desighn process takes for the above project and what special skills you need

 

Cheers

Alistair

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Hi Pete,

I am following your build with interest as I trail behind with my Airfix Berta. I don't think in my case there will be any 3D printing but I'm sure we'll will be able to write the book on filling ejector pin holes. 

Ray

Edited by Ray_W
Missing word

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28 minutes ago, Mottlemaster said:

Peter can i ask you how long the desighn process takes for the above project and what special skills you need

 

Cheers

Alistair

The printing itself is straight forward but learning the 3D software is a huge commitment. Fortunately I know Solidworks so it took me one evening to create the above model. Some aspects of the 3D model are overscale (like the wall thickness of the ruder pedals) to hopefully compensate for printing resolution limitations.

 

24 minutes ago, Ray_W said:

Hi Pete,

I am following your build with interest as I trail behind with my Airfix Berta. I don't think in my case there will be any 3D printing but I'm sure we'll will be able to write the book on filling ejector pin holes. 

Ray

Yes there is certainly no shortage on ejector pin holes and also external plastic shrinkage at lots of locations.

Cheers, Peter

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I've been tempted to get a resin printer for gaming miniatures and modelling. Do you have to process the CAD output through another software?

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5 hours ago, Ted said:

I've been tempted to get a resin printer for gaming miniatures and modelling. Do you have to process the CAD output through another software?

Certainly would be ideal for printing gaming miniatures.

 

The CAD data has to be an STL file (and there are many STL models to download for free) and then have to be processed by a slicer, which is a software utility preparing the model for printing. The slicer contains all the printer configuration and as the name suggest, slices the model along the Z-axis (hight) so that each "slice" can be printed. Depending on the printers Z-axis resolution, a 10mm tall model can contain 200 slices if the resolution (slice thickness) is set to 0.05mm.

 

Other task the slicer performs is scaling the model so that you can print a copy smaller or larger to what the original model is.

 

Best to have a look at Google and Youtube as there is tons of information available.

Cheers, Peter

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Thanks for the info Peter.

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I was tempted for a short while until I read about the toxic smells etc. Looks like you need a special room for it.

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Very interesting research and hopefully you will get it done in the time.

Certainly a good start.

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1 hour ago, Greg Law said:

I was tempted for a short while until I read about the toxic smells etc. Looks like you need a special room for it.

The smells depend on the resin you use and the stuff I use has hardly any smell. More smelly is the cleaning process using Isopropyl Alcohol, but I do this outdoors. So the process isnt any worth than airbrushing enamel or lacquer paint.

 

And recently there is resin available which can be cleaned with tap water after printing eliminating the IPA smells.

 

1 hour ago, Ed Russell said:

Very interesting research and hopefully you will get it done in the time.

Certainly a good start.

Thanks Ed. I too hope to finish it in time. Unfortunately my track record is not very good but I try my best.

 

Cheers, Peter

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Made good progress over the weekend and the printing worked out surprisingly well.

 

As each print run takes two hours I got a few other things done in between. One was to make the Airfix pilot seat look more as it is shown in the pilot manual.

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I replaced the metal frame (I think the seat is made of canvas) with some stretched sprue and added the seat height adjustment leaver.

 

I also replaced the MP ammunition magazine racks with Quikboost parts replacement parts intended for the Hasegawa kit.

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They do have a bit more detail and it should show nicely after painting.

 

And this was the first print with three 1/48 parts and two 1/32 parts

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The stepped resin part is to measure the Z-axis accuracy.

 

The 1/32 sized parts were perfect the first time round, but the 1/48 part needed some mods to make them printable as I really pushing the limits of the printer doing prints with such small detail.

 

And here are the results after cleaning an curing.

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I also printed one in 1/72 scale. but things got just a bit too small.

 

And I did mention how small the parts are.

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And adding the rudder pedals was a bit fiddly too.

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And compared to the PE part.

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Definitely more accurate, but certainly not a "mast do". Still have to add the second one and also adding some straps.

 

I did fit the other printed part into the starboard half of the fuselage.

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Again definitely not a must, but fitting these fuse boxes is certainly easier than folding the six parts on the Eduard PE set.

 

One thing this exercise showed me is that the sky is the limit what can be done with a resin printer - or maybe more accurate, the time available to create 3D models is the limit :whistle:

 

There are still a few parts I like to add, but It all comes together now.

Cheers, Peter

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13 minutes ago, Basilisk said:

I replaced the metal frame (I think the seat is made of canvas) with some stretched sprue and added the seat height adjustment leaver.

Peter, check for clearance in the cockpit, I did the same to my Hasegawa seat and now it does not fit with the all the extra bits added to the seat sides and sidewalls, just needs some fine adjustment. :whistle:

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On 1/19/2020 at 10:40 PM, Retired Bob said:

Peter, check for clearance in the cockpit, I did the same to my Hasegawa seat and now it does not fit with the all the extra bits added to the seat sides and sidewalls, just needs some fine adjustment. :whistle:

Thanks for the warning, but there is no interference.

 

But I think I made a boo boo in my previous post when I said I think the seat is made of canvas. It kind of looks like that in the drawing, but after doing some more searching on the web I came across two interesting pictures.

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Both pictures are apparently a seat from a Ju 87G. The right side picture does look like the seat as used in the RAF Museum example, but the left seat does certainly not and I have a feeling it s actually a seat from a Berta (or maybe two types of seat had been used in late model Stukas). And one thing is sure, it is not made from canvas!

 

Cheers, Peter

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Thanks for the pictures Peter, the left one certainly looks more like a seat from a B model, perhaps I should put back the paint chipping on my kit seat? :hmmm:

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That is an interesting find. The one on the left gives a good idea for chipping 

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