ALL Bf-109 EXPERTS. 1/48 Bf-109F/G kits. Zvezda UM, ICM

[Otakar]

42 minutes ago, Fernando said:

Oh, yes, the separated or moulded in wingtips are a giveaway. Your wings have the detached wingtips?

 

EDIT: the production timeline in Scalemates you posted is most helpful. I have never seen the OT boxings from the "old" mould, nor the F Profi or G-2/-4 (only OT... strange...). I have never seen them retailed, not even at Eduard's or Hannant's, only the basic Profi G-6 and the Royal Class. All kits stemming out of #8268 are the "old and incorrect" one. I would write Eduard to see if I could turn them back or receive a discount... that was what they did some years ago. Regards.

 

Fernando

It is very easy to fix them if you look at the links I provided. It only takes about ten minutes to fix the wings and about 15 minutes to fix the fuselage. You will wind up wit exactly that which comes in the new kits. I did a side by side comparison before and after fix. The links will show you this. I originally bought this on eBay in the 82111x box and discovered that someone swapped the parts for the old ones. After I wanted to return this, the guy told me to keep the kits and gave me a full refund. I had no issues to do some quick experiments and discovered how easy it was to do the repairs. Just look at the links I provided in the previous posts.

[Duncan B]

I bought several of the original 8268 releases and the overtures of the same kit the day they were released (more fool me!). I have never seen the Royal Edition nor the 8265 109F or Overtrees so I am not sure how many were produced/sold before Eduard pulled the plug on them. I suspect most in Europe were recalled before they hit the shops but may have already been on the container ships to N. America before they could be recalled. 

Apart from being dimensionally wrong the most obvious telltale signs on the fuselage parts of the original G6, 8268 kit, are the strange bumps on the wing root fillet immediately below the front canopy (apparently copied from a museum example that had received some replacement panels at some point during it's museum life. From 82111 onwards the dimensions are much better (although no kit is ever perfect).

I built one of the original kits (gave away another and still have one in the box) and have to say that I did enjoy it and it still sits in the display cabinet along with the more accurate later versions. Most people probably don't notice the difference at a casual glance. You seem to be going to an awful lot of effort to make conversions that will be flawed from the start due to the base kits but if you are having fun that's all that matters really.

 

Duncan B

[Otakar]

Since I am fixing the flaws of the base kit first than I am OK.  Yes the bumps are there on the wing root. I did not notice them before. On the new moldings they are not bumps but turned into "bulges". much larger but more subtle. There must be something there below them and must have had a variety of bulges. Since I am building a "one of" post war aircraft than this is not an issue unless I can see something in the available photos. You can see my fixes in the links provided previously. https://www.modelforum.cz/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=131002&start=15  This started out as a UM Models kit which has a fuselage which is astronomically more inaccurate than this fuselage ever was, even before the repair.

Edited January 20, 2020 by Otakar

[Retired Bob]

4 minutes ago, Duncan B said:

I bought several of the original 8268 releases and the overtures of the same kit the day they were released (more fool me!). I have never seen the Royal Edition nor the 8265 109F or Overtrees so I am not sure how many were produced/sold before Eduard pulled the plug on them.

I bough two of the original 8268 kits and the Royal Edition before I found out of their problems.  Eduard did help to recompense buyers of these kits by offering a discount on their new Bf 109G from their store on proof of purchase of the older kits.  Lets face it how many kits have been found to be wrong but their manufacturers have done nothing, and carry on pushing them out for years.

[Otakar]

Since I have no issues doing the fixes on these, I would be happy to take these parts off your hands if they are not wonted. I will be building some CS/S-199 aircraft I could use them for.

[Retired Bob]

1 hour ago, Otakar said:

 Yes the bumps are there on the wing root. I did not notice them before. On the new moldings they are not bumps but turned into "bulges". much larger but more subtle. There must be something there below them and must have had a variety of bulges. Since I am building a "one of" post war aircraft than this is not an issue unless I can see something in the available photos.

Depending on the version of Bf 109 there are bumps or bulges that cover a bolt head that secures the wings to the fuselage.  I too reduced the wing span before fitting the wing tips, smoothed the wing root bumps and if it is a G-6 variant with the 13mm MGs the supercharger intake base needs altering to clear the port MG bulge.

[Otakar]

All of mine will be some form of G-12 (CS-99) or the Avia S/CS-199 Jumo powered one with the He-111H engine, spinner and cut down paddle blade prop. Every one of these will be a conversion of one sort or another. There will not be any wartime 109s

Edited January 20, 2020 by Otakar

[Otakar]

My final decision is that the only 109G kits worth building that are dimensionally reasonably accurate and worth the money paid are Tamiya (obvious choice) and Zvezda. Zvezda has only three issues, 1) lack of detail on lower surfaces of ailerons, 2) wingspan is 2mm too small (easily fixed as can be seen by my solution in pictures), 3) missing one panel line which is the one approximately mid way back of the slats (added in picture). This wing is modified top-n-bottom for my Avia S-199 conversion. I am using the Zvezda G-6 kit for this mod. Wheel blister is old HobbyCraft part. I could have used a Hasegawa part also but found it to be grossly undersized. The HobbyCraft part is a tiny oversize but can easily be cut sown a bit. The Edward kit is just as bad as the ICM/OM but just in reverse. The ICM UM looks like it spent a few years in a Nazzi concentration camp and the Eduard looks like it is pregnant, (or at best, retaining water)😁. as of now I have three more Zvezda G-6 kits on order from MdelsUA ($12.36 each)(9.5L) Zvezda has just the perfect amount and the right detail which I like besides being reasonably dimensionally accurate. It lacks all the rivet detail which Eduard is so generous on. It has all the necessary detail which Eduard is missing in the wheel wells and as can be seen in the pictures, it can be built down-n-dirty. All control surfaces are loose vice the rudder for the tall tail. If Zvezda comes out with a G-10 or K version it will be complete and Eduard can put away their tooling. I wish Zvezda would come out with some more Lavochkin subjects. Ie. La-7, LaGG-3 and La-5. Their La-5FN is excellent. Also Yak-11

Edited February 26, 2020 by Otakar

[Otakar]

Here are a couple of pictures of the underneath of the Zvezda G-6 wing, including my revisions for the Avia S-199. You can see the detail of the leg opening. Just a note, the wheel opening varied. Some were round and some had the standard G stile opening, but the vast majority were round.

 

[Otakar]

I really wish to thank you guys for all the help here. With your help, my new discovery of the Zvezda kits is absolutely fantastic. It has most of the correct detail of Tamiya but none of the cost. I bought one on eBay because it was a quick delivery and now have 3 more on order from ModelsUA. The one on eBay was a bit more expensive costing me $23 including shipping from Russia and the ones from ModelsUA $12.36 (9.5L). Unless a modeler wishes to spend the extra $(L) for the Tamiya, you cant go wrong with the Zvezda. The G-6 variant having all the parts, but the wing, to build the F or G variants. I think the only G you couldn't build out of the box are the G-10 & G-12. I believe that AML at one point will even come out with conversions to do those. I have been very unhappy with the Eduard kits due to the "pregnant" appearance of them. About the same affect as the Airfix Spitfire Mk.VII but in my opinion even worse. Plus the omission of important detail and the un necessary other detail, the Zvezda wins hands down. I have only started my preliminary construction of my kit but will be doing a whole build thread once I finish building my CS-99 (G-12) build using the Eduard kit. I wish to bring up that the complete front end including the prop and spinner are oversized. The 1:1 prop should be 3m and not 3.11m. the spinner should be .75m and not .78m. The Zvezda kits are correct. This is how I have been able to do a side by side comparison of the two. Not to forget the UM/ICM kits which I originally started the CS-99 build and discovered how bad they really were. But for the $9 they cost me, they will provide a lot of nice interior detail parts and other spare parts also. They are quite nicely detailed but just have a very inaccurate outline. Since I wil be building a minimum of three two seat variants, these parts will turn out helpful. That is if I can't get rid of them in eBay first. I have them listed but they can always be taken off if I need the extra parts. I bought six and listed four. The other two are already being cannibalized for these projects.

 

 

Zvezda prop is black Eduard prop is gray.

 

 

 

 

Once again Zvezda black Eduard gray. the spinners are reversed between the props to dramatize the effect of the oversized Eduard parts. You can see the Eduard backplate under the Zvezda spinner.

 

Edited February 26, 2020 by Otakar