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Choice of paint - so confused


mbthejester

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Hi all,

I really need some help building what paints I really need, I am starting from scratch, and struggling to remember (not built a thing for 30yrs) what paints I need, be really grateful if you good folk could help with the basic must have colours that any model may need.

 

Have my first 4 kits to do British tracked armour spanning 1944/5 to current, main body colours are easy, it’s the all the rest, Black,White,Blue,Red, Gloss and Matt etc 

 

will end up doing some detail for the first time bit of dirt/mud and rust and worn areas too, but need to walk before I run getting all the basic must haves.

Have been looking online, more I look more lost I get and could easily spend a fortune on various paint sets by the makes that are new to me such as AK and Mig 

 

Cheers

Mark

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A couple of key points to start with. Are you brush painting or using an airbrush? Have you decided on acrylics or enamels - if you haven't then that choice may be influenced on where you are painting and if smell is an issue (enamels generally have more of a strong smell than acrylics).

Mark

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Hi Mark,

thanks for reply 

sorry forgot to add Acrylic due to no dedicated modelling room, Brush and will be getting first Airbrush next few months. 
 

Can’t believe how much grief this is turning into, so much for a relaxing hobby lol 😂 

cheers

Mark
 

 

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Acrylics are broken down into two main groups, real (water based AK, Vallejo, Mig Ammo) and water soluble (alcohol base Tamiya, Mr Hobby Aqueous).  The latter smell more than the former, you can use water with either but better to use a thinner especially for alcohol based, I'd recommend using the manufactures thinner until your up to speed and want to start experimenting. 

 

All you need do is decide which you want to use or rather not use, if smell or sensitivity/health are issues probably water based.  Alcohol based is in my opinion the easiest, to use, gives consistently good results, water based can be a bit trickier, suffering more tip dry which needs a little more knowledge and possible products to overcome.   My recommendation would be Tamiya or Mr Hobby, using their thinners :yes:    

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6 hours ago, mbthejester said:

Have my first 4 kits to do British tracked armour spanning 1944/5 to current, main body colours are easy, it’s the all the rest, Black,White,Blue,Red, Gloss and Matt etc 

main body colour is going to be SCC 15 green for ww2,  then Bronze Green, not so up on the modern colours.   I mention this as British armour colours have come a long way since 30 years ago.

5 hours ago, mbthejester said:

sorry forgot to add Acrylic due to no dedicated modelling room, Brush and will be getting first Airbrush next few months.

suggest Vallejo Model Colour, it brushes very well.

Various members here brush paint exclusively,  and get very good results.

basic colour sets are often available at a discount, but don't trust Vallejo's colour naming...

 

 

@PlaStix has a youtube showing how he does it.

 

re AK paint and Real Colour,  certainly the ignored the advice of their British consultant @Mike Starmer

useful thread here,  https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235049761-british-olive-drab-no15/

 

There are a series of mixes for Vallejo here

https://alliedarmour1940.wordpress.com/vallejo-paint-mixes-for-british-armour/

 

Quote

SCC 15 (Olive Drab)

1pt 70888 Olive Grey [92] + 1pt 70924 Russian Uniform WWII [094] (Mike Starmer, 2009)

24 (Deep Bronze Green) (pre war and post war)

2 pts 70922 USA Uniform [084] + 1 pt 70888 Olive Grey [092] + 1 pt 70822 German Camo Black Brown [150] (Mike Starmer, 2010)

70975 Military Green is just slightly lighter than the BS.381 standard (Mike Starmer, 2019)

I mixed SCC 15 from this, and the Tamiya mix also by Mike Starmer, they came out the same. 

 

also well worth a read

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235047244-ww2-german-track-colour/

 

Just as it discusses track colour, which again is not what is usually thought.

7 hours ago, mbthejester said:

Have been looking online, more I look more lost I get and could easily spend a fortune on various paint sets by the makes that are new to me such as AK and Mig 

 

DON'T BELIEVE THE HYPE! 

 

OK, I'm being cynical, but these companies make products that then become the go to standard, because they exist. 

Some I'm sure are very good,  some of the colours, well,  read the SCC15 thread above.

 

Also, it's possible to over complicate, and plenty of the online resources, especially youtube, show all sort of wonderful gadgets and flash builds,  often skipping over entirely inaccurate kits and poor paint matches....

There are a lot of 'fashions' and trends out there in modelling, just look at an old Modelling magazine and a new one.

 

I digress, but  if the techniques and materials you use for your model, get the results you wanted, then they are the 'right' materials and techniques. 

 

Finally, do a Work In Progress build,  you don't need a flash camera,  as long as what you are doing is visible,  say where you are skill wise,  and you will receive feedback, tips, suggestions and support.   Britmodeller is (apparently) one of the most pleasant forums,  and no matter what your standard, you will not get derogatory comments.

You also will see your work in context, which is also very useful. 

 

HTH

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Cheers for info, helped a lot, never thought of a work in progress, had in my head they are for the wizards, the photo part is the easy bit - main hobby is shooting Mil Aircraft.

 

if anyone has a list of the essential must have colours that would help, I just cannot remember what I had years ago 🤔 Expecting to have to buy 20 or 30 colours - inc the ones you only need for just one or two parts in a kit.

 

cheers all

😃

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, mbthejester said:

if anyone has a list of the essential must have colours that would help,

do you have anywhere local to buy paint? 

I dod't, so get stuff posted, which is OK for water type acrylics.

Creative models do a weekly specials,  and often have Vallejo sets

eg

http://www.creativemodels.co.uk/av_vallejo_game_color_set_introduction_set-p-11110.html

while  this is a Game colour set, I presume that they are the same as Model Colour, though it would be worth asking,  just with the sort of names Citadel use, but this is good starter set, 

as is this ( I bought this one) which are Model Colour.

http://www.creativemodels.co.uk/av_vallejo_model_color_set_folkstone_basics_x16-p-7286.html

 

Just they are £1.50 each, as opposed to £2.50 or so for individual ones if you get a set on offer. 

 

Creative do plenty of kits, and it's 'free' post over £30,    and they do all sorts of products.

 

for SCC15

http://www.creativemodels.co.uk/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=vallejo++Olive+Grey&x=0&y=0

plus

http://www.creativemodels.co.uk/av_vallejo_model_color_russian_uniform_wwii-p-7446.html

 

Ideally you want to try out some paints, to see what you get one with.  I like acrylics, but they not as forgiving and easy to use as say Humbrol enamel from 'back then'  if you want an enamel fix,  check out Colourcoats, by Sovereign Hobbies,  the boss post on here, and is dedicated to getting the colours as accurate as possible.

 

 

28 minutes ago, mbthejester said:

never thought of a work in progress, had in my head they are for the wizards, the photo part is the easy bit - main hobby is shooting Mil Aircraft.

 

Wizards, absolutely not. 

 

We also get lots of new members with "not built models for "20/30/40"  years, and I'm all a bit over whelmed.

a WIP is really worthwhile. 

My actual output is pathetic (lots of started projects) but I made myself do a WIP and finish it in March

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235052380-hurricane-airfix-72nd-fabric-wing-mki-oob/

done with my toytown camera! 

Used vallejo for a lot of this build.   I was really pleased how well using artists oil thinned with lighter fuel worked.  

 

Note, regarding my fashion comments,  certainly some modellers use other models as a guide to finish and techniques,  washes, pre/post shading, Spanish school etc etc,  but then fail to study photos of the real thing carefully, which is a skill in it's own right.   Note the reference pics I posted above.

 

In armour, this results in rusty tracks (see the link) and failure to understand the armour plate does not rust like an old car....

@Das Abteilung  has made some very interesting posts on this.

 

 

 

 

regarding @PlaStix  I looked up his paint tutorial, note the flat brushes. 

 

do check some of his builds, as they are very well described, and he uses mostly acrylics. 

 

one final point, the site search is not brilliant,  but if you add britmodeller into a google search, you can find a lot more threads.

 

HTH

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Cheers everyone, some great stuff on those links, never realised there was so much confusion on Olive Drab alone, first kit is Trumpeter Chally 2 with enhanced armour😃 Got the Eduard slat armour set for it.

 

got a local hobby craft and a model shop that does mainly railways, nothing specialised local 

 

thanks all 😀

 

 

 

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@Troy Smith had most excellent advice. Try some different brands and see what works for you! Other things being equal, locally available paint is worth some preference points.

 

I use multiple paint types. My first choice is Mr Color, a lacquer. These are best airbrushed. With good technique, they produce an amazing finish--second to none. Lacquers dry very quickly and produce the thinnest coat. After Mr Color, I use Alclad lacquers for metallic finishes. They are quite similar to Mr Color.


Enamels are a little thicker. They do need curing time. I'll use Colorcoats and Humbrol these days if I use an enamel. I only airbrush lacquers and enamels.

 

I use Games Workshop paints for brushing. These acrylics are easy to use and thin with water, but are the thickest of the three types, even airbrushed.  I highly recommend Windsor & Newton Brush Cleaner and Restorer to clean your brushes if you use one acrylic paints.

 

When you're first starting out, use the brand's recommended thinner before you try alternates.

 

Oh, and welcome aboard! :clap2:

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32 minutes ago, mbthejester said:

first kit is Trumpeter Chally 2 with enhanced armour😃 Got the Eduard slat armour set for it.

Have you worked with etch before?  

a quick look here

https://www.eduard.com/Eduard/Photo-etched-parts/Photo-etched-set/Challenger-II-Enhanced-armour-slat-1-35.html?lang=1

this set? 

Just if you have not worked with etch before, this maybe quite a steep learning curve. 

And liable to a sod too paint without an airbrush.  

Interestingly the Eduard site photos seem to show it assembled with the plastic rod shown in the instructions.   

Not meaning to put you off,  just a caution against frustration, as this looks tricky to assemble and paint. 

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Thanks for the welcome 👍

 

And no not used etched before, got the set for £6 so what I am having to spend to get started if I ruin some of it I won’t be too disappointed and probably have my airbrush set up by the time I am doing the Etched Slats, got the plastic rod for the Eduard set, went for that as it comes with jigs to help align the slats, I have got to get another Chally for the hull, so will have the entire top to Learn to play with the airbrush etc not in a hurry so no need to rush anything if I take my time, as long as I enjoy doing it that is the important part for me.

 

thanks all

 

Mark
 

 

 

 

 

 

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Very cheap kits and extra parts can serve as test beds, a.k.a., paint mules, to learn how to use your airbrush. Their complex shapes will help you learn how to handle airbrush and model. Once you've learned basic handling, you can use these to try various finishing techniques.

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If you are going to brush paint with Acrylics I would be careful with Tamiya as they dry so quickly and you end up leave brush streaks. I haven't done it but all reports point to that they spray beautifully. 

 

If you're going to brush paint for any length of time dilute your paints, even a newly opened one, with Flow Improver. It improves the finish no end. Slows drying slightly and gives a much smoother finish. Not quite as fine as air brushing but can get quite close. I use Windsor & Newtons from an art shop. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=w%26n+flow+improver&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari#lbl=OVERVIEW&pie=plaji-i   The bottle lasts for a long time and I've used it with Xtracrylix, Revell Aqua, Humbrol, Tamiya, Citadel and Akan with no problems and great results. There are other brands and some paint companies like Vallejo do their own.

 

I would just just dive in and see how things go. This hobby is about enjoying oneself and producing models for ones own enjoyment so my advice is try things, don't be afraid to fail and just get stuck in. 

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Cheers for all the input, very much appreciated, got some paint now arrived today, Hataka Blue modern British, also got a couple of other Greens that nearly match the irr Green from Mr Hobby and Vallejo to try, not going to worry to much about the colour being exact (painted real vehicles from 4 ton Bedfords and Landys to 432’s and have seen some very rough paintwork slapped on lol) along with a couple of Desert Yellows a Steel/oily steel etc, and few other basics Red/Yellow and the likes, Trumpeter Chally lists 4 colours only,  should start next week and will see how it goes .

 

Cheers Everyone

Mark

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