Crusader Mk.1. Camouflage scheme.

[Bullbasket]

I saw this in an AFV RFI thread, and I just wondered if it is genuine. I've seen it on Grants and possible Shermans, but I've never seen a Crusader in this scheme. Is it genuine?

 

Thanks for any help.

 

John.

[AntPhillips]

Hi John, I've also seen that scheme and could swear I've also seen the photographic evidence that backs it up, but I'm buggered if I can find it now, I'll continue to look and will post if and when I find it.

[Bullbasket]

10 hours ago, AntPhillips said:

Hi John, I've also seen that scheme and could swear I've also seen the photographic evidence that backs it up, but I'm buggered if I can find it now, I'll continue to look and will post if and when I find it.

Thanks Ant. Much appreciated. I've got a Mk.1 to build, and this scheme really appeals to me.

 

John.

[JackG]

There was a bit lengthy discussion over at Missinglynx, and it includes comments from researcher Mike Starmer:

 

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/missinglynx/non-standard-british-camouflage-colours-in-north-a-t315985.html

 

 

regards,

Jack

 

[Bullbasket]

15 hours ago, JackG said:

There was a bit lengthy discussion over at Missinglynx, and it includes comments from researcher Mike Starmer:

Many thanks for that Jack. It stops me posting a question on there and getting a snotty response along the lines of "this topic has already been covered" from you know who.

It's a very interesting thread and does answer a few questions. The fact that the darker colour has been described as "muck" and "sludge" would suggest a shade of brown, and it also fits in with the Grant that I finished many years ago in a similar scheme.

 

Thanks again.

 

John.

[Mike Starmer]

 This Crusader I is finished in a mid 1942 brigade scheme, 22nd A,B mid 1942 unit scheme , brown colouring, some cement or plaster material is reported to be used here, NOT bronze green.   At this time the regulation finish was overall Light Stone No.61 for all vehicles applied at base workshops.   Without getting complicated, there was some ambiguity in the early 1942 MEGOs which some brigades exploited to add their own patterns and colours.  By October 1942 this all changed and those designs rapidly disappeared via Monty's strict hand.

[Mike Starmer]

I should have made it clear that this Crusader would have been painted at base workshops in overall Light Stone and had the disruptive design applied at brigade level.  Sometimes these type of designs were not continued over the top of tanks.  The painters only thought of ground level observation so parts of the design often just overlapped onto the top surface, not joined up across it.  Grants certainly carried it but Shermans did not.  There is only one picture of a Sherman showing a white undulating line along the side with  darker areas beneath it.  That dark area is shown on artwork as green, which I doubt since it is tonally only just darker than Light Stone.  It may be Camcolour buff, not as dark as the green which came into use at the time.  If you wonder why only the one Sherman and unfinished, it is likely that GHQ had ordered an immediate cessation of unauthorised painting since a whole new set of camouflage diagrams had by then been issued. 

[Bullbasket]

Thanks for the replies Mike. They've answered a lot of questions. Happy New Year to you.

BTW. How's the Matilda book coming along?

 

John.