cherisy Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Hi Can anyone shed a light on what colour the B43 as fitted to RAF Phantoms in the early 70s were? I am aware that training " shapes" may have been white and have read some where that the live versions were silver Can anyone put me right on that? Many thanks in advance 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 I think live US produced nukes in that time frame were silver, but I don't think any pics of them fitted to RAF Phantoms have yet appeared, so don't know 100% 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 as far as I'm aware it was B57, smaller and lower yield to 43, fitted to RAF Phantoms. The weapon was normally painted white, but Like Dave I have never seen pictures, @Starfighter may know? If you want to use B43 all pictures and video clips I've seen show it painted white. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, 71chally said: as far as I'm aware it was B57, smaller and lower yield to 43, fitted to RAF Phantoms. The weapon was normally painted white, but Like Dave I have never seen pictures, @Starfighter may know? If you want to use B43 all pictures and video clips I've seen show it painted white. The BDU 12 (training version of the B57) was white, don't know about the live round. Selwyn Edited December 17, 2019 by Selwyn 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 The base color was gloss white. Some were solid white while others had a red-brown or black radome. The solid white versions were intended for low-level, laydown delivery and had a nose cone that was jettisoned to expose a "spike" for impact. The radar equipped weapons were presumably intended for higher altitude deliveries and were typically seen on strategic bombers like the B-58 and FB-111A; although fighter-bombers carried them too. Regards, Murph 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherisy Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) On 17/12/2019 at 16:36, Murph said: The base color was gloss white. Some were solid white while others had a red-brown or black radome. The solid white versions were intended for low-level, laydown delivery and had a nose cone that was jettisoned to expose a "spike" for impact. The radar equipped weapons were presumably intended for higher altitude deliveries and were typically seen on strategic bombers like the B-58 and FB-111A; although fighter-bombers carried them too. Regards, Murph That's Brilliant thanks Murph. The Eduard instructions mention white or gull grey but one thing over learnt is dont always take them as gospel Edited December 19, 2019 by Julien please dont quote all the pictures Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherisy Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 7 hours ago, 71chally said: as far as I'm aware it was B57, smaller and lower yield to 43, fitted to RAF Phantoms. The weapon was normally painted white, but Like Dave I have never seen pictures, @Starfighter may know? If you want to use B43 all pictures and video clips I've seen show it painted white. Thanks Chally. I did read that somewhere but also conflicting stories that it was the B43 too. I did look for an aftermarket B57 but couldn't find one 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 14 minutes ago, cherisy said: That's Brilliant thanks Murph. The Eduard instructions mention white or gull grey but one thing over learnt is dont always take them as gospel I've never seen nor heard of them in gull gray, just gloss white. The same color scheme (gloss white with solid or radar noses) applied to the B57. Spectre Resins produced a resin 1/72 B57, but they seem to be out of production now. LINK You may have luck finding them on ebay or the buy/swap sections at the various model sites. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starfighter Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, 71chally said: as far as I'm aware it was B57, smaller and lower yield to 43, fitted to RAF Phantoms. The weapon was normally painted white, but Like Dave I have never seen pictures, @Starfighter may know? If you want to use B43 all pictures and video clips I've seen show it painted white. I can confirm that the live rounds WERE white with a black nose cone, as were the training "Shapes " and always loaded on the centreline ( Station 5 ) Edited December 17, 2019 by Starfighter 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Here is a BDU-24/C training version of the B43: https://catalog.archives.gov/id/6440690 Jari 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xvtonker Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 4 hours ago, Selwyn said: The BDU 12 (training version of the B57) was white, don't know about the live round. Selwyn The live rounds were painted white. I remember them from doing QRA with the FGR.2 Phantoms at RAF Bruggen in the 1970's XVTonker 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) @Starfighter @xvtonker can you remember how it was attached to the centreline station, was literally to what we see in the Fujimi kit (for example), or was there an adaptor/pylon in between? Edited December 17, 2019 by 71chally 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherisy Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 10 minutes ago, xvtonker said: The live rounds were painted white. I remember them from doing QRA with the FGR.2 Phantoms at RAF Bruggen in the 1970's XVTonker Thanks XVTonker. Now you are here I can pick your brains as I am looking at doing a ORA 17 Sqn FGR2. Using the new Airfix kit. Any pointers ? Ive only been able to source a B43. Were they fitted as well? Skyhawk mentioned in another thread that the fit was bucket of sunshine on station five. Two sgt Fletcher tanks and two sparrows on the rear cells ( I think) was there anything else ? Do you have any photos? 4 minutes ago, 71chally said: @Starfighter @xvtonker can you remember how it was attached to the centreline station, was literally to what we see in the Fujimi kit (for example), or was there an adaptor/pylon in between? Took the words right out of my mouth 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Nice film here on how the US Navy handled B43 and B57 weapons aboard ship and loading on to A-4s. Not a huge relevance to 1970s RAFG, but interesting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherisy Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) On 17/12/2019 at 20:58, 71chally said: Nice film here on how the US Navy handled B43 and B57 weapons aboard ship and loading on to A-4s. Not a huge relevance to 1970s RAFG, but interesting. But cool none the less Edited December 19, 2019 by Julien big quote 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Here's a BDU-38 (B61 "shape") mounted on the centerline of a USAFE F-4, also the centerline rack it was mounted on; you can see it had a very low profile. Both came from this thread at ARC LINK I suspect the setup on Brit Phantoms with nukes was similar. Below that are some live B57s (white) and B61s (silver) from cruise albums. Regards, Murph 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 Some walk around pics of various shapes: http://svsm.org/gallery/aircraft-equipment-weapons-nuclear Jari 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starfighter Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 The photo of the centreline rack is the same as used on our FGR 2's, and the weapon was mounted directly to that. QRA aircraft also carried two live Sparrow AAM's in the forward fuselage missile stations. HTH 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 8 hours ago, Finn said: Some walk around pics of various shapes: http://svsm.org/gallery/aircraft-equipment-weapons-nuclear Photos of Cold-War American Nukes taken by a Russian sounding individual - it does have a certain Dr Strangelove irony to it! Thank you Jari. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aardvark Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, 71chally said: Photos of Cold-War American Nukes taken by a Russian sounding individual - it does have a certain Dr Strangelove irony to it! The irony only at first glance ...open information from profile https://vova-modelist.livejournal.com/profile on LJ: "NAME: Vladimir Yakubov LOCATION: California, United States SITE: Silicon Valley Scale Modellers Blog Rules: ....... 3) I am a US citizen and served in the US Navy.... 4) I am a Jew, so using various bad words about Jews you will be banned. .........." Based on the experience of my communication with him, an adequate person and a good modeler. (As examples, Gunboat Bobr (Beaver), 1/700, Kombrig The model won first place in its category and was in second place in the vote in the nomination "best ship" IPMS USA Nationals. https://vova-modelist.livejournal.com/tag/models ) I don’t remember exactly, but in my opinion his parents immigrated to the United States when he was 14 years old and he is indeed a US citizen and served in the American Navy. I highly recommend it LJ: https://vova-modelist.livejournal.com/ there is something interesting to see (as examples, fresh): and reading! Therefore, for me in this gallery 11 hours ago, Finn said: Some walk around pics of various shapes: http://svsm.org/gallery/aircraft-equipment-weapons-nuclear Jari there is nothing surprising! B.R. Serge Edited December 18, 2019 by Aardvark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 Thank you for the information Serge, those Cutlass pictures are pure gold! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xvtonker Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 23 hours ago, cherisy said: Thanks XVTonker. Now you are here I can pick your brains as I am looking at doing a ORA 17 Sqn FGR2. Using the new Airfix kit. Any pointers ? Ive only been able to source a B43. Were they fitted as well? Skyhawk mentioned in another thread that the fit was bucket of sunshine on station five. Two sgt Fletcher tanks and two sparrows on the rear cells ( I think) was there anything else ? Do you have any photos? Took the words right out of my mouth Now you're asking, it was nearly 45 years ago!! 😂 Okay, from what I can remember the shape was loaded onto station 5 with a dedicated pylon, Sargent Fletcher underwing tanks and two Sparrows on stations 3 & 7. A single aircraft was housed in a Mk1 HAS and the associated ground equipment comprised of: Front & rear access ladders 25kva Houchin Standard single bottle fire extinguisher with extendable lance Chocks fore & aft of the mainwheels As the shape was American there were two guard huts outside the HAS, either side of the main entrance clam shell doors. One with a US Army guard and the other with a RAF policeman. Both live armed and carrying a M16 & 9mm Browning pistol respectively. How do I know the US guard carried a live M16? Well, on one particular practice launch the see-off crew, me & Davey Gowans, both young, keen Junior Technicians rushed out to the HAS and as I started to prepare the Houchin ready for applying ground power Davey forgot where he was in the excitement and instinctively started to climb up the pilots ladder to apply ground power. He made it to the second rung when he heard the sound of the M16 being cocked and an American drawl saying that if he went up one more step he'd have to be carried out of the HAS on a stretcher. Davey slowly came back down the ladder and sheepishly walked over to me by the Houchin. Fortunately he didn't have to change his underwear, and peace was made between the aircrew, RAF policeman and the trigger happy US guard. Needless to say, Davey never ever crossed the white line again! On another occasion, a FGR.2 was being unloaded when someone spotted a ban the bomb sticker on the bottom of the shape! A full unit inquiry was carried out, but they never identified the perpetrator.... XVTonker 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherisy Posted December 19, 2019 Author Share Posted December 19, 2019 22 hours ago, xvtonker said: Now you're asking, it was nearly 45 years ago!! 😂 Okay, from what I can remember the shape was loaded onto station 5 with a dedicated pylon, Sargent Fletcher underwing tanks and two Sparrows on stations 3 & 7. A single aircraft was housed in a Mk1 HAS and the associated ground equipment comprised of: Front & rear access ladders 25kva Houchin Standard single bottle fire extinguisher with extendable lance Chocks fore & aft of the mainwheels As the shape was American there were two guard huts outside the HAS, either side of the main entrance clam shell doors. One with a US Army guard and the other with a RAF policeman. Both live armed and carrying a M16 & 9mm Browning pistol respectively. How do I know the US guard carried a live M16? Well, on one particular practice launch the see-off crew, me & Davey Gowans, both young, keen Junior Technicians rushed out to the HAS and as I started to prepare the Houchin ready for applying ground power Davey forgot where he was in the excitement and instinctively started to climb up the pilots ladder to apply ground power. He made it to the second rung when he heard the sound of the M16 being cocked and an American drawl saying that if he went up one more step he'd have to be carried out of the HAS on a stretcher. Davey slowly came back down the ladder and sheepishly walked over to me by the Houchin. Fortunately he didn't have to change his underwear, and peace was made between the aircrew, RAF policeman and the trigger happy US guard. Needless to say, Davey never ever crossed the white line again! On another occasion, a FGR.2 was being unloaded when someone spotted a ban the bomb sticker on the bottom of the shape! A full unit inquiry was carried out, but they never identified the perpetrator.... XVTonker Great Gen and a brilliant story Thanks XVTonker. With all that Im good to go now. Talking of zapping the shape, during my days as Bruggen many years after yours and shortly after the first Tornados arrived ( 31 sqn I think) during the work up taceval our sqn WO had a wager with his opporsite number on 31 that we couldnt get into one of his HAS which were accross from our compound, and zap one of the Tonkas ( although we werent calling them that at the time) suffice to say it was duly done and we even kidnapped a couple of JTs . Said WO was asked to come and collect his blokes who were sat as guests our sqn bar. Cost him a few crates. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted December 19, 2019 Share Posted December 19, 2019 The relevant section has been deleted from the updated Phantom illustrated parts catalogue I have as it is an August 1989 amendment, but cross referencing with the F.4B T.O. it looks like this is the right bit of kit, but I bow to those with first hand knowledge. John 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted December 19, 2019 Share Posted December 19, 2019 @cherisy were you involved with nukes on Tornado at all? If you disappear from the face of the forum I'll take that as a yes! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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