BlueNosers352nd Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Done lots of spraying over the decades with a Paasche V, Paasche H and Iwata BCS (used Paasche VS cups) and never really had an issue spraying. Now I have this H&S Evolution Silverline 2-in-1 (.2 and .4 sizes) and I am getting spitting of paint at the beginning of the spray and then some random single spits while spraying across the project. In the past (prior to the H&S) I'd just toss some paint and thinner in the cup, back feed to stir and test. Add a touch of thinner or paint, depending on what's needed, and try again. Sometimes tweak the air pressure and viola. After a while it became second nature so it was quick to mix and spray. It's doing it on both Mr Surfacer 1200 and Tamiya (in this case a yellow). A while back I was using some blues/whites like the colors on a Corsair and I don't recall this issue........but that was over a year ago. Tamiya paints was used their, along with the H&S. It doesn't seem to matter if I use Mr Color Thinner or Mr Color Self Leveling Thinner. Never had a problem with them in the past. It's a brand new bottle of Tamiya Yellow as well. It doesn't seem to matter if I dial the PSI down or up. I haven't been measuring ratios as I've always done it by feel and adjusted as needed. I try to shoot around 15psi and adjust the paint mix from their, or make slight adjustments to PSI. I've open the valve on the bottom of the air compressor tank and no moisture plus I have an inline moisture trap that I opened the valve up. Been using that combination for a long time. I don't know if the H&S works a little different than the Iwata. Tip sizes are similar, .35 on the Iwata and either the .2 or .4 on the H&S. I've torn the brush down and clean it out. Could it be the lacquer thinner I use to clean it? Used on all my Paasches and Iwatas for a long long time without issue. I'm just dumbfounded at this point. Side note: If it wasn't for the cup falling out of the Iwata I'd try that out and see what happens. I think that after using it for a long time the mounting point for the cup is worn out and doesn't hold tightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Cracked nozzle or the needle not seating properly against the nozzle. Paint slips through (between them or through the nozzle crack), gathers on the nozzle cover and then it spits out. I've had similar issues with my Ultra, the needle got some wear on the tip (where it sits against the nozzle) and it wasn't "sealing" properly anymore. Polished it with some nail files and Tamiya Compound and it's fine. Since you've had yours for a while I imagine you have the old nozzle/needle. They replaced them (I believe) this year precisely because they were prone to cracks and wear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little-cars Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Or it could be a tiny bit of gelled paint in the nozzle, a build up of paint on the aircap, (small hole or shroud), or possibly a slightly bent needle. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 4, 2019 Author Share Posted December 4, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, bmwh548 said: Cracked nozzle or the needle not seating properly against the nozzle. Paint slips through (between them or through the nozzle crack), gathers on the nozzle cover and then it spits out. I've had similar issues with my Ultra, the needle got some wear on the tip (where it sits against the nozzle) and it wasn't "sealing" properly anymore. Polished it with some nail files and Tamiya Compound and it's fine. Since you've had yours for a while I imagine you have the old nozzle/needle. They replaced them (I believe) this year precisely because they were prone to cracks and wear. I'll have to do some polishing and see what happens. Disappointing as neither set has much time on them. Edited December 4, 2019 by BlueNosers352nd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Using a magnifier you should check the nozzle first. Also Paul makes a very good point. Is there any buildup on the needle cover during spraying? That could explain your issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 4, 2019 Author Share Posted December 4, 2019 The initial spitting happens after you spray, then go back to spray just by pressing down on the trigger for AIR ONLY. Like their was some paint left at the tip. On any airbrush I've ever used their was always some dried paint on the inside of the needle cap, like from air swirling around, but never had this spatter before. After work I'll have to go soak the nozzle and see what I can do, plus look at it under magnification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 4, 2019 Author Share Posted December 4, 2019 Ok....tore down the whole unit, cleaned it all out. The .4 definitely has some issues. I don't any high magnification devices other than an optical visor...........and my prescription glasses are little behind. So seeing a crack or something is impossible. What caught me was why doing a test run after cleaning with the .4.....even with the trigger completely forward and only pressing for air I get a fine paint out of it. Same with thinner, it just flows out with only the trigger pressed for air. Again, with only the visor and my behind the times glasses I think the end of the nozzle isn't perfectly round. Whether that is a tear or just out of round. So at minimum I probably should order a new nozzle for the .4 After all the cleaning, I did minimize the while spraying single bit splatter to only a couple. But the pre splatter is there still. I put the .2 in and only did thinner to see if anything came out with just air pressed and nothing came out. I did find some gun in the nozzle on the .2. I'm thinking it was some mission model paint. First time ever using that, so I guess I didn't clean it enough. I'm use to Mr Color and Tamiya paints. So maybe the .2 is ok. Again, like bmwh548 mentioned above....old needles and nozzles were replaced because of issues. So maybe that's the deal with the .4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 I have exactly the same issue you described on my Ultra. Polishing the needle when it starts behaving this way gets rid of it. Grab some nail files and some polishing compound and go for it. It takes me about 5 minutes - I put the needle in a cordless drill and spin it on a decent speed and pull it against the nail file; once I'm happy the "marks" are gone from the needle tip I polish it. Works fine afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 5, 2019 Author Share Posted December 5, 2019 1 hour ago, bmwh548 said: I have exactly the same issue you described on my Ultra. Polishing the needle when it starts behaving this way gets rid of it. Grab some nail files and some polishing compound and go for it. It takes me about 5 minutes - I put the needle in a cordless drill and spin it on a decent speed and pull it against the nail file; once I'm happy the "marks" are gone from the needle tip I polish it. Works fine afterwards. Having not done that, I can only imagine what happens. I'm surprised that doesn't alter the profile at all. Granted it's just nail files and not something more aggressive. I'm concerned with the nozzle and it doesn't look 100% round. I'll inspect again tonight when I get home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 It changes the profile ever so slightly, but it's proven effective. I've done it several times and the managed not to bend the needle. I would gladly swap the needle nozzle combo if someone would bother importing the new ones, but at the moment all resellers in my country have the older models only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little-cars Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 If you suspect the nozzle, but don;t have a magnifier, you can usually feel any split in the tip by running the tip of the nozzle down your finger. Also check that the needle isn't bent. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little-cars Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 On 12/4/2019 at 6:49 AM, bmwh548 said: Cracked nozzle or the needle not seating properly against the nozzle. Paint slips through (between them or through the nozzle crack), gathers on the nozzle cover and then it spits out. I've had similar issues with my Ultra, the needle got some wear on the tip (where it sits against the nozzle) and it wasn't "sealing" properly anymore. Polished it with some nail files and Tamiya Compound and it's fine. Since you've had yours for a while I imagine you have the old nozzle/needle. They replaced them (I believe) this year precisely because they were prone to cracks and wear. They developed the new needles after they were taken over last year. I've seen nothing about releasing a new nozzle, but some have been coming through with different markings on them, so I suspect one will be announced soon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 6, 2019 Author Share Posted December 6, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, bmwh548 said: It changes the profile ever so slightly, but it's proven effective. I've done it several times and the managed not to bend the needle. I would gladly swap the needle nozzle combo if someone would bother importing the new ones, but at the moment all resellers in my country have the older models only. Did some file and needle work. Improvement enough to get me through some painting so I can continue on. Random single spits are seldom now, but still there. I still get the initial spit but that is only if I do a big pull back for paint flow. Then the following spray spits. So for now I just spray away to get the spatter gone and continue. Doing a slight pull back for paint seems to avoid the big splatter and random spits (mostly). Also the filing and polishing did get rid of the spraying of paint when the trigger is fully forward. Getting closer. After spraying and did some more polishing and will test it out tomorrow. 1 hour ago, little-cars said: They developed the new needles after they were taken over last year. I've seen nothing about releasing a new nozzle, but some have been coming through with different markings on them, so I suspect one will be announced soon. I ordered a new needle and nozzle today from SprayGunner and they said they were version 2 but that was merely to add markings so it was easier to tell between different needles and nozzles. So probably early next week I'll see what the new .4mm set does. Edited December 6, 2019 by BlueNosers352nd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 8, 2019 Author Share Posted December 8, 2019 Word of advice, don't use the H&S blow back cap. I think it creates so much back pressure it locks/seizes up the whole brush. Have to pull the needle out to release the pressure. Plus now it will not stop blowing air. This developed after using the blow back cap. I have taken the whole thing apart, cleaned it and it still blows air without even pressing the trigger. Anyone have any thoughts on this constant air issue? About ready to toss it in the garbage (including the new needle/nozzle coming) and buy a new Iwata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 8, 2019 Share Posted December 8, 2019 Check the air valve. Maybe the "piston" is stuck in the pressed position (swollen rubber seal from thinner or maybe some dried up paint on the PTFE seal). I'm sure it's an easy fix, probably in the heat of the moment you mixed up some seals and the piston isn't moving freely up and down. I've used the blow back method on the Ultra with no problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueNosers352nd Posted December 9, 2019 Author Share Posted December 9, 2019 So because I was irritated at this airbrush I decided to just start messing with it and see what I could do. Put the smallest amount of 3 in 1 oil on one of those mini glue applicator things and wiped it around the pin where the trigger sits on it. Actuated the pin up and down and tried again. Still the air leak. So I said the heck with it and started messing with the air valve screw on the bottom. Loosening it made it worse. So I tightened and checked several times until it stopped. It seems odd that the screw is so easy to turn, like it's undersized by a fraction. Doesn't even feel like their is the slightest resistance to it. Then sprayed some Alclad on my project and it seemed to function fine..........other than that splatter at start (AFTER A FULL BACK PULL ON THE TRIGGER). Should that air valve screw be that easy to turn? We'll use it for a while and see how she goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwh548 Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 I believe so because I think it's meant to be sort of adjustable. As the seal wears off you tighten it a bit more. Sometimes you can block the airflow all together if you do it up fully so you need to back off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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