New Tool Airfix Vulcan 1/72 - Black Buck rebox announced

[JohnT]

1 hour ago, Space Ranger said:

The only complaint I have about Airfix is that they have not scaled their 1/48 Javelin and Hunter(s) down to 1/72!

 

47 minutes ago, Patrick Martin said:

and the Sea Vixen and Walrus

PM

 

40 minutes ago, Space Ranger said:

Yep. Them, too!

 

29 minutes ago, stever219 said:

Or their 1/72th Harrier GR. 1, 3 and 7 up to 1/48th.

 

13 minutes ago, Space Ranger said:

Well, I am not a 1/48 builder, but on behalf of those who are, I fully endorse your position and second the motion.

Got a flashback there to the Judean Peoples Front Modelling Club Faction. I mean what has Airfix ever done for us?

[Adam Poultney]

while we're talking about what we want from Airfix.....

valiant reissue when?

Edited August 26, 2020 by Adam Poultney

[Aeronut]

33 minutes ago, stever219 said:

Or their 1/72th Harrier GR. 1, 3 and 7 up to 1/48th.

I reckon Airfix were going to announce those kits at Telford in November but now that SMW has been cancelled 😞 they're not going to happen. 🤪🙃

BTW with SMW cancelled when will Airfix dangle next years designer drug of choice before our noses? Making us wait until Christmas/New Year for the full range announcement is the height of cruelty. 

[Dave Fleming]

1 hour ago, Space Ranger said:

The only complaint I have about Airfix is that they have not scaled their 1/48 Javelin and Hunter(s) down to 1/72!

 

It's interesting, since Hornby took over they haven't downscaled any subject that they did in 1/48th, but they have upscaled several subjects the other way (P-51, Defiant, Blenheim, Sabre, Ju87, Tiger Moth)  for example. What that tells you I don't know, but I'd love to see the Sea Vixen and Javelin in 1/72.

 

But I am in no doubt they won't upscale the Vulcan! ( back on topic!)

[Denford]

This is my theory why Airfix upscale but don't downscale.  Let's us address it to Tiger Moth fans: available in both scales.

 

Those who built the 1/72: did you like it so much that you bought a 1/48 rendering when it became available?  Quite possibly.

 

But supposing the 1/48 version had been released first, you bought it and liked it.  Then a 1/72 issue is released: would you buy it because you had already built the 1/48 version?  I think not.

 

Well that's my theory: others might wish to comment

 

[TEXANTOMCAT]

Yep that makes sense which is why I think they’ll release a new tool 72 Chippy and then a 48th one.

it’s also much cheaper to gauge the popularity of a particular type in the smaller scale I guess! 
 

back to the tin triangle...

 

 

TT

 

 

[Adam Poultney]

Just thinking about finally preordering mine. Two on release and probably another 3 or 4 in December. Hannants says expected September, does this sound right? I thought it was November they'd be released...

 

4 hours ago, Dave Fleming said:

I am in no doubt they won't upscale the Vulcan! ( back on topic!)

Well if we get a halfway decent plastic Vulcan in 1/48, sign me up! Two if it's a B1/B1a of course. But that kit I don't think would sell well enough to justify, just too big. Delta wings like the Vulcan's are not small. 

I wonder if someone could justify a less detailed one to reduce tooling cost and price..... You can't exactly see much in Vulcans - some of mine are missing the cockpit internals entirely! 

[Meatbox8]

7 hours ago, Space Ranger said:

The only complaint I have about Airfix is that they have not scaled their 1/48 Javelin and Hunter(s) down to 1/72!

Ahmen to that.

[Meatbox8]

9 hours ago, Adam Poultney said:

This! All three V Bombers in 1/72 with modern toolings? Brilliant! Airfix are the only brand they produces a decent set of them in 1/72.

Now we just need another brand to see the success of the new Vulcan and bring out their own one but a B1/B1a. And then a Victor B1 (and tanker variants).... And then a Sperrin.... Then an Avro 707... And a HP88..... Then a Valiant B2..... Ok I'm probably not bring realistic but come on, a Vulcan B1..... If I'm planning on buying 5 of these ones I'm scared to think what my back account would be like if there was a Vulcan B1 kit available

I'm not sure that a manufacturer is ever going to release a 1/72 kit of the Vulcn or Victor B.1, alas.  I can see a manufacturer bringing out a 144th version of each though, which woud do for me.   

 

 

[AlCZ]

LoL... Vulcan is beautiful aircraft & i awaited 1/72 Falkland War variant... But 1/48 was enormous big...I can' t see a bill for quarter scale Vulcan mould. B-52 is most important type and after (near) 70 from maiden flight still don' t exist 1/48 long run kit (HpH is L E w. Gigantic price tag...) IMHO Airfix never released a quarter scale Vulcan (too expensive, too big and with one combat mission). Any WW 2 R.A.F. Heavy bomber was better choice (or B-24 )...

1/72  Vulcan is accetable in size & price, but Quarter scale ? You need a Manor for gigantic models of this size.

[Adam Poultney]

1 minute ago, Meatbox8 said:

I'm not sure that a manufacturer is ever going to release a 1/72 kit of the Vulcn or Victor B.1, alas.  I can see a manufacturer bringing out a 144th version of each though, which woud do for me.   

 

 

Mikromir brought out a Victor Bk1a last year. This is my one as XA940, the only standard Victor B1 in camo (although I didn't realise the leading edge needs modding for that airframe). They said they plan to do a Vulcan B1, but they have also said other projects are a higher priority and they don't have the time to do it yet. So I'm watching their Facebook page closely for the first sign of the kit being worked on. For now it's all obscure ww2 era stuff and submarines. 

[Albeback52]

15 hours ago, Denford said:

This is my theory why Airfix upscale but don't downscale.  Let's us address it to Tiger Moth fans: available in both scales.

 

Those who built the 1/72: did you like it so much that you bought a 1/48 rendering when it became available?  Quite possibly.

 

But supposing the 1/48 version had been released first, you bought it and liked it.  Then a 1/72 issue is released: would you buy it because you had already built the 1/48 version?  I think not.

 

Well that's my theory: others might wish to comment

 

I definitely prefer 1/72 so, my personal choice would be not to buy a larger 1/48 version.

I would not, for example consider a 1/48 Phantom, Buccaneer, Lancaster, Vulcan etc.

This choice is largely dictated by cost and storage space.

 

Looking at it the other way, it would depend entirely on the subject. I built both the Sea Vixen and Javelin largely because they were the only

modern toolings available,not because of scale.

I would have preferred them in 1/72 and, would buy them in that scale if offered now.

I built the Airfix 1/48 Lightnings again, because they were the most modern kits available when issued. I would however buy 1/72 versions in spite of them and, not because of them.

Hope that makes some sort of sense.😉😊

 

Allan

[Truro Model Builder]

16 hours ago, Denford said:

This is my theory why Airfix upscale but don't downscale.  Let's us address it to Tiger Moth fans: available in both scales.

 

Those who built the 1/72: did you like it so much that you bought a 1/48 rendering when it became available?  Quite possibly.

 

But supposing the 1/48 version had been released first, you bought it and liked it.  Then a 1/72 issue is released: would you buy it because you had already built the 1/48 version?  I think not.

 

Well that's my theory: others might wish to comment

 

I think you've hit the nail squarely on the head. I have noticed that in my own modelling. I have upscaled my subjects a few times, but never downscaled.

[IanC]

I did downscale. Once. But not Airfix - I bought the Tamiya 1/72 Bf 109G because I was so impressed by the 1/48 version. 

 

But generally, as far as aircraft are concerned, I only build 1/72 models, even if the old Mk 1 eyeballs would now prefer a larger scale.

 

 

[Adam Poultney]

I have downscaled with some aircraft. I did it with a Victor, but that was because of which variant the kit is, although I plan to buy more 1/144 ones. I did it with vulcans, smaller kits means I can build more of them. 

[Violet Club]

Hi All,

 

I will love also to see a Javelin and a Sea Vixen in 1/72 scale and also a Cold War RAF Set (like the one released for WW2 period) with refuelling vehicles, bombs (Include nukes like the Blue Danube and Yellow Sun) and other material...

 

One thing I wonder is why new kits aren't engineered such a way to produce further versions, for example, why the new Vulcan B2 is not kitted for a possible B1 version later.

 

Despite this, i will buy it when it will be available !

 

All the Best,

 

XB-35

[Adam Poultney]

3 minutes ago, Violet Club said:

 

One thing I wonder is why new kits aren't engineered such a way to produce further versions, for example, why the new Vulcan B2 is not kitted for a possible B1 version later.

 

At least with the Vulcan, this would not be possible to do. 

It's not like the difference between a Spitfire Mk1a and MkVa where they're essentially the same airframe with a few differences that can be covered by a few extra parts. The Vulcan B1 and Vulcan B2 were very different aircraft. 

 

The obvious thing is the difference between the B1 wing types (original pure delta and Phase 2 kinked wing) and the B2 wing type (Phase 2C). The only common components between the wings were some fuel tanks. 

For comparison here's one of my Vulcan B2s, XH558, on the left back to back with one of my Vulcan B1as, XA906, on the right.

And some photos from cutting away the Phase 2C wing to make a Phase 2 wing

 

But that wing is only the beginning of the differences. 

The intakes were narrower, and by quite a bit. Early B2s (VX777 refitted with phase 2c wing, XH533-539, XH554-556) all had the narrow B1 intake as well as these started out as B1s on the production line, VX777 of course being the second Avro 698 prototype flew as one. But there's no surviving Vulcan B1 or early B2, so we only have drawings and photos to go off for the intakes. As they're narrower, they're also mounted differently in the wing and that throws the whole look of it off if you just put a thinner intake insert in with some milliput to blend it in, unless it's done absolutely right. 

 

Next big difference is the landing gear. Completely different. The nose gear was much taller and you'd need an entirely new part for that. The main gear, again that was different. Completely different shape and angle. The B1 sat with a visible nose up angle, and the B2 is almost level. 

 

Then there's the tail. The early Vulcan B1s, up to I think XA901, initially had the small tailcone of the prototypes. Some of these later received a longer version of the small tailcone, and all further B1s were built with the longer small tailcone. Both versions need an extended rudder as a B1a/B2 rudder won't fit properly, as can be seen in photos of XA900 and XA899 at Cosford before they were scrapped (what a waste). 

B1as had a tailcone similar to the B2, but the tip of it was different and it lacked some of the bumps of the B2 version. This of course had the shorter B2 type rudder. B1as also had one ECM plate fitted, but the B2 had these too. The B1a also needs a small wingtip extension adding. 

 

The whole engine area is different as well. No air scoop underneath, none of the pipes that run along the underside (often hidden by the ECM plates on B2s), completely different jetpipes, all sorts of differences there. 

 

Even then, there's more differences. On the B1 there's air scoops where there aren't any on the B2, not just the ones missing from the engines that the B2 has but the B1 lacks. The B1 had its pitots on the wingtips, the B2 had them on the nose, the B2 had a fair few aerials around the aircraft that the B1 lacked, but the B1a had some of them. Early B1s had a slightly different canopy with more squared panels than on the B2. Early B1s also had an extra airbrake panel, carried over from the prototypes but later removed.

I'm probably forgetting a fair few differences, and there's likely more that I've not come across, but even then just from what I can remember off the top of my head, it's a huge list

[Violet Club]

I understand, the B1 is a completely different aircraft from the B2

[PLC1966]

1 hour ago, Adam Poultney said:

At least with the Vulcan, this would not be possible to do. 

It's not like the difference between a Spitfire Mk1a and MkVa where they're essentially the same airframe with a few differences that can be covered by a few extra parts. The Vulcan B1 and Vulcan B2 were very different aircraft. 

 

The obvious thing is the difference between the B1 wing types (original pure delta and Phase 2 kinked wing) and the B2 wing type (Phase 2C). The only common components between the wings were some fuel tanks. 

For comparison here's one of my Vulcan B2s, XH558, on the left back to back with one of my Vulcan B1as, XA906, on the right.

 

And some photos from cutting away the Phase 2C wing to make a Phase 2 wing

 

 

 

 

But that wing is only the beginning of the differences. 

The intakes were narrower, and by quite a bit. Early B2s (VX777 refitted with phase 2c wing, XH533-539, XH554-556) all had the narrow B1 intake as well as these started out as B1s on the production line, VX777 of course being the second Avro 698 prototype flew as one. But there's no surviving Vulcan B1 or early B2, so we only have drawings and photos to go off for the intakes. As they're narrower, they're also mounted differently in the wing and that throws the whole look of it off if you just put a thinner intake insert in with some milliput to blend it in, unless it's done absolutely right. 

 

Next big difference is the landing gear. Completely different. The nose gear was much taller and you'd need an entirely new part for that. The main gear, again that was different. Completely different shape and angle. The B1 sat with a visible nose up angle, and the B2 is almost level. 

 

Then there's the tail. The early Vulcan B1s, up to I think XA901, initially had the small tailcone of the prototypes. Some of these later received a longer version of the small tailcone, and all further B1s were built with the longer small tailcone. Both versions need an extended rudder as a B1a/B2 rudder won't fit properly, as can be seen in photos of XA900 and XA899 at Cosford before they were scrapped (what a waste). 

B1as had a tailcone similar to the B2, but the tip of it was different and it lacked some of the bumps of the B2 version. This of course had the shorter B2 type rudder. B1as also had one ECM plate fitted, but the B2 had these too. The B1a also needs a small wingtip extension adding. 

 

The whole engine area is different as well. No air scoop underneath, none of the pipes that run along the underside (often hidden by the ECM plates on B2s), completely different jetpipes, all sorts of differences there. 

 

Even then, there's more differences. On the B1 there's air scoops where there aren't any on the B2, not just the ones missing from the engines that the B2 has but the B1 lacks. The B1 had its pitots on the wingtips, the B2 had them on the nose, the B2 had a fair few aerials around the aircraft that the B1 lacked, but the B1a had some of them. Early B1s had a slightly different canopy with more squared panels than on the B2. Early B1s also had an extra airbrake panel, carried over from the prototypes but later removed.

I'm probably forgetting a fair few differences, and there's likely more that I've not come across, but even then just from what I can remember off the top of my head, it's a huge list

Yeah, but other than that..............

[robvulcan]

I can’t believe the posts here. I haven’t been on here for ages sadly. I can’t believe how people are having a go at Airfix they are amazing !

I have had many dealings with them and they have always helped me get spares even through lockdown they explained they was not sending spares at the time then a few months later in the post come a new vulcan canopy.

It has always seemed to me some people like to moan to make themselves seem important. Some claims are obviously genuine but there is no company and no price point where QC issues don’t exist. But there are far more cases of people who don’t actually know what they are doing blaming their tools. Say like people who moan about humbrol paint (actually one of the best) sure you get an odd bad one but how rare that is and if used correctly it’s amazing.

but now it’s worse now we are moaning about kits that haven’t even been released. Thankfully we all know now the internet gives power to a minority of voices that seem to squeal the loudest but there are many more silent voices out there who can’t wait to build this and other great kits. 
As to the poster who has not made his old kit yet why not just graft a free fall Bombay on to the new kit and give the left over spares to me haha 😂 

I’ve missed this place  

[Space Ranger]

55 minutes ago, PLC1966 said:

Yeah, but other than that..............

"Aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

[Adam Poultney]

16 minutes ago, Space Ranger said:

"Aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

bringing this back to the topic of Avro aicraft, 1/72 Lincoln when?

[RichG]

39 minutes ago, Adam Poultney said:

bringing this back to the topic of Avro aicraft, 1/72 Lincoln when?

Getting near to the front of the Airfix queue now I reckon; if not next in line. I would guess within the next 3 years.

 

Rich 

[Adam Poultney]

7 minutes ago, RichG said:

Getting near to the front of the Airfix queue now I reckon; if not next in line. I would guess within the next 3 years.

 

Rich 

I hope so... they do like their heavy bombers. Although I'd prefer to see a Manchester kit....

 

And I wonder what this year's flagship product that would have been revealed at Telford will be....

Edited August 27, 2020 by Adam Poultney

[JohnT]

2 hours ago, Violet Club said:

I understand, the B1 is a completely different aircraft from the B2

Almost as bad as turning one of these

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreadnought-class_submarine

 

backdated to one of these 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Dreadnought_(1906)