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Hasegawa 'whites'


Nocoolname

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I noticed in a number of my early-mid 2000's Hasegawa kits that the whites on the decals appear very 'off-white' to the point of being cream coloured instead. Does anyone know if there was a particular manufacturing problem at that time? More recent and even earlier kits have much sharper whites in the decals. 

 

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Hasegawa are infamous for their 'ivory'  whites.    One reason why their habit of doing boxings with only specific parts is so annoying, as often the decals are worthless....

Never seen a reason given though.

Does make me wonder if they improve once applied?   Given this posting.

 

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Hi, Nocoolname.

 

I think this is quite a common problem - I've seen a similar issue in some older Revell and Airfix kits. I'm thinking it might be due to either:

 

A. The conditions that the decals have been stored under over the years (in a loft? Too cold in winter and too warm in summer, perhaps).

 

B. (Maybe more likely) The dyes in Hasegawa decals are slightly less "stable" than in other manufacturer's markings. 

 

What does anyone else think?

 

Chris. 

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2 minutes ago, spruecutter96 said:

Hi, Nocoolname.

 

I think this is quite a common problem - I've seen a similar issue in some older Revell and Airfix kits. I'm thinking it might be due to either:

 

A. The conditions that the decals have been stored under over the years (in a loft? Too cold in winter and too warm in summer, perhaps).

that's yellowing of the varnish. Different problem.

 

2 minutes ago, spruecutter96 said:

 

B. (Maybe more likely) The dyes in Hasegawa

decals are slightly less "stable" than in other manufacturer's markings. 

no, Hasegawa Ivory whites are have long been moaned about on model forums,  and they were like that when brand new. 

Never seen an explanation for this offered.

google "hasegawa ivory white decals"  and you will see the problem has been complained about for years.

 

Hence me wondering if they improve if using the method described in the link. but I doubt it.   

 

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6 hours ago, Jordi said:

Of all the myriad things the Japanese have mastered and excel at manufacturing, waterslide decals is not among them.  It just seems beyond their ability for some odd reason.  That is strange, given the long Japanese history of fine art and high quality offset printing.  

Completely agree! I have learned to only use aftermarket decals with Japanese kits.

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16 hours ago, Jordi said:

Of all the myriad things the Japanese have mastered and excel at manufacturing, waterslide decals is not among them.  It just seems beyond their ability for some odd reason.  That is strange, given the long Japanese history of fine art and high quality offset printing.  

 

9 hours ago, dnl42 said:

Completely agree! I have learned to only use aftermarket decals with Japanese kits.

I linked this,  but if Japanese kit decals are so bad, then you would think there would be lots of AM ones in Japan, which there don't seem to be.

 

On 29/08/2016 at 23:26, Gary C said:

The best way to get all Japanese decals ( Fujimi, Hasegawa, Tamiya etc)to work as they're supposed to is use hot water and the correct setting solutions. You'll need a bottle each of Gunze Mr Setter and Mr Softer. Micro sol and others won't work as they're formulated differently. Do not use Gunze on Microscale or Cartograf decals as it will chew right through them.

 

Dip the decal in hot water, it doesn't need to be boiling but it does need to be fairly hot. The temperature of a drinkable tea will do. The glue is heat activated and is what makes up most of the thickness. If you dip it in cold water you'll spend the rest of the day waiting and cursing.

Lay down some Mr Setter, this is in the blue bottle. It acts as an additional glue. Slide the decal onto it and into postion and leave it alone. The decal should wrinkle a little.

Give it 10 mins or so and go over the decal with a brush with a little Mr Softer (green bottle) on it. Use sparingly as it is extremely hot. Too much and it will damage the paint, especially the weaker acrylics. The decal will now wrinkle a lot. Do not touch it as it is almost liquified at this point.

Once it is dry it will have smoothed out and will lay down beautifully over just about any raised or recessed detail you care to think of.

 

Used properly it is probably the best conforming decal process in the industry.

 

Used incorrectly and you'll be just another guy complaining about crap Japanese decals.

 

 

the hase white are a problem though, but I'm curious if they change colour when used? 

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I'm 100% certain the issue is using "ivory" pigmented inks, and I had resigned myself to the notion that Hasegawa's printer just couldn't do a "pure" white - until I picked up the old (circa 1990) Tornado IDS kit and was shocked to find pure white markings! 

spacer.png

 

What's even more strange is this sheet uses *both* the white (sword motif left of sheet) and the ivory (loze ge shapes at bottom, intended as backing decals for the black/red/yellow markings). Maddeningly, the smaller decals that have elements that should be white are printed in the ivory color instead. 😡

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21 hours ago, Troy Smith said:

 

I linked this,  but if Japanese kit decals are so bad, then you would think there would be lots of AM ones in Japan, which there don't seem to be.

 

Intriguing thread !!

 

About 25/30 years ago, Hasegawa did as part of their "Parts Series" which also included their weapons sets.  I picked up a bunch of them from a small model shop in downtown Dammam, Saudi Arabia, which sold models and etc downstairs and Waterford Crystal upstairs.  

 

I never saw them advertised in either the UK or Stateside modelling press.  The ones that I picked up are still good for use and the white is spot on,  The decals are not thick and lay down beautifully when used.  I recently saw an add on flea bay for set 72-014, RAF National Markings, going for around a tenner but thats about the only mention I have ever seen of them.  In Saudi, I paid 10 Saudi Riyals per sheet which, at the exchange rate at the time, equated to about £1-66 each.

 

Attached scans of the front and rear of the card on which the plastic bag containing the decals was/is attached - in this instance for the F-8 Crusader :-

 

spacer.png spacer.png

As far as I am aware, there were only ever 30 aircraft sheets produced together with 9 sheets of block colour and one clear (which I never saw), the "Silver Stripe" being most useful.

 

Example for the B-17F :-

spacer.png spacer.png

 

The images are straight from the scanner and have not been "shopped" in any way and as you can see, the decals sheets are still. after nearly a quarter of a century, still in very good order

 

Dennis 

 

 

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On ‎10‎/‎12‎/‎2019 at 11:44 PM, Jordi said:

Of all the myriad things the Japanese have mastered and excel at manufacturing, waterslide decals is not among them.  It just seems beyond their ability for some odd reason.  That is strange, given the long Japanese history of fine art and high quality offset printing.  

It's not an issue on recent kits, everything Hasegawa has released over the past decade or so is pretty good in my opinion. The older stuff, not so much.

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