Alclad

[Vinster]

Hi all so my next few upcoming projects will be metal finishes these projects include a C-121, P-51, P-47 and a vampire. The trouble is I have never used alclad and don't know what is needed I known need to lay down a black gloss coat but after the spraying process im not sure which of their varnishes to use as they have several different kinds. Would I use the Matt varnish or their clear. I hope this is an ok question to ask and thank you to those who answer.

 

Vini

[dnl42]

You need a gloss black undercoat for Alclad high-shine colors, like Chrome. These colors are quite fragile. Simply touching the Chrome will remove the paint. I haven't dared to put anything atop these colors.

 

While gloss black can be used for regular Alclad metallic colors, too, you can also use other under-coat colors, such as grey or white. In all cases, however, the under-coat will tint the Alclad, so don't try other colors unless you truly want that color to show. This property means you can get some tonal variations using different shades of grey. I exclusively use Mr Color Gloss Black (C33), Mr White Base, or Mr Surfacer as an under-coat beneath Alclad. When thinning any of these Mr Color paints, use Mr Leveling Thinner to a very thin consistency--like Alclad.

 

The key for all lacquers is they are the thinnest paint coat. Enamels (e.g., Humbrol, Colourcoat, and Model Master) are thicker. Acrylics like Vallejo and Mission Models are thickest. I actually don't use those acrylics just because the coat is so thick. Because lacquer paints are so thin, surface prep is critical. Make very sure you have a smooth surface. Lacquers will not hide imperfections--if you can feel it, you'll see it. As I normally use Mr Color paint, which are also lacquer paints, thinned Mr Surfacer 1200 and 1500 are my usual primer. They do hide slight surface scratches, but only slight scratches. They won't hide scribed lines or fine detail.

 

I use a 0.5mm nozzle for metallic paints to avoid tip clogging. I sometimes use a 0.3mm nozzle, but I do need to cough the airbrush a couple/few times in a session. I spray around 15 psi (1 atmosphere). Spray close-in, say 5mm to 45 mm. Make sure the paint is wet when it hits the surface. You can use a grazing light to see this. If you spray lacquers too far, they dry in the air forming a rough or even powdery surface. Finally, spray thin coats. Build up coverage before you spray a final gloss coat.  Lacquers dry quite fast, so it's easy to spray multiple coats in a single session. Finally, I use hardware store lacquer (cellulose) thinner to clean the airbrush--the stuff in a can.

 

Alclad and Mr Color go down so smoothly that I often directly apply decals on the paint without an intermediate gloss coat. I use Microscale Industries Micro Set and Micro Sol directly on all but Chrome and Polished Aluminium. I can't vouch for any other decal setting solutions directly on Alclad.

For clear coats, I use Microscale Industries Micro Flat, Microscale Industries Micro Satin, and Mr Color Gloss Clear (C46). Again, with the 0.5mm nozzle.

 

I do mask over regular Alclad with de-tacked Tamiya tape or Silly Putty. I lay the tape on the palm of my hand before applying it to paint.

 

HTH

-- 

dnl

Edited October 6, 2019 by dnl42
Gloss clear is C46.

[Space Ranger]

I don't know who started the claim that a gloss black undercoat was required. I see it all the time, but it is incorrect. You need to use an undercoat ONLY for these shades:

 

ALC-105 POLISHED ALUMINIUM

ALC-107 CHROME FOR PLASTIC

ALC-109 POLISHED BRASS

ALC-114 CHROME FOR LEXAN

ALC-115 STAINLESS STEEL

ALC-118 GOLD TITANIUM

ALC-119 AIRFRAME ALUMINIUM

ALC-122 MIRRORED GOLD FOR LEXAN

 

And even then, it does NOT need to be black; Alclad suggests a clear undercoat as well:

 

"Apply one of these primers before using High Shine ALCLAD:

ALCLAD GLOSS BLACK BASE ALC-304/305

ALCLAD CLEAR BASE ALC-303"

(http://alclad2.com/how-to/)

 

Also, as Brother dnl42 states, an undercoat will tint the Alclad. So why not use a gloss blue undercoat for upper surfaces, and a gloss tan undercoat for lower surfaces, so as to simulate the reflection of sky and concrete from a natural metal surface?

[Vinster]

19 hours ago, dnl42 said:

You need a gloss black undercoat for Alclad high-shine colors, like Chrome. These colors are quite fragile. Simply touching the Chrome will remove the paint. I haven't dared to put anything atop these colors.

 

While gloss black can be used for regular Alclad metallic colors, too, you can also use other under-coat colors, such as grey or white. In all cases, however, the under-coat will tint the Alclad, so don't try other colors unless you truly want that color to show. This property means you can get some tonal variations using different shades of grey. I exclusively use Mr Color Gloss Black (C33), Mr White Base, or Mr Surfacer as an under-coat beneath Alclad. When thinning any of these Mr Color paints, use Mr Leveling Thinner to a very thin consistency--like Alclad.

 

The key for all lacquers is they are the thinnest paint coat. Enamels (e.g., Humbrol, Colourcoat, and Model Master) are thicker. Acrylics like Vallejo and Mission Models are thickest. I actually don't use those acrylics just because the coat is so thick. Because lacquer paints are so thin, surface prep is critical. Make very sure you have a smooth surface. Lacquers will not hide imperfections--if you can feel it, you'll see it. As I normally use Mr Color paint, which are also lacquer paints, thinned Mr Surfacer 1200 and 1500 are my usual primer. They do hide slight surface scratches, but only slight scratches. They won't hide scribed lines or fine detail.

 

I use a 0.5mm nozzle for metallic paints to avoid tip clogging. I sometimes use a 0.3mm nozzle, but I do need to cough the airbrush a couple/few times in a session. I spray around 15 psi (1 atmosphere). Spray close-in, say 5mm to 45 mm. Make sure the paint is wet when it hits the surface. You can use a grazing light to see this. If you spray lacquers too far, they dry in the air forming a rough or even powdery surface. Finally, spray thin coats. Build up coverage before you spray a final gloss coat.  Lacquers dry quite fast, so it's easy to spray multiple coats in a single session. Finally, I use hardware store lacquer (cellulose) thinner to clean the airbrush--the stuff in a can.

 

Alclad and Mr Color go down so smoothly that I often directly apply decals on the paint without an intermediate gloss coat. I use Microscale Industries Micro Set and Micro Sol directly on all but Chrome and Polished Aluminium. I can't vouch for any other decal setting solutions directly on Alclad.

For clear coats, I use Microscale Industries Micro Flat, Microscale Industries Micro Satin, and Mr Color Gloss Clear (C46). Again, with the 0.5mm nozzle.

 

I do mask over regular Alclad with de-tacked Tamiya tape or Silly Putty. I lay the tape on the palm of my hand before applying it to paint.

 

HTH

-- 

dnl

Thank you, I use Tamiya lacquers all ready bit im quite excited to try Mr Colour and I already have some mr surfacer I've not yet used. I'll go over it with a really fine grit sanding sponge before I paint hank you.

[Vinster]

19 hours ago, Space Ranger said:

I don't know who started the claim that a gloss black undercoat was required. I see it all the time, but it is incorrect. You need to use an undercoat ONLY for these shades:

 

ALC-105 POLISHED ALUMINIUM

ALC-107 CHROME FOR PLASTIC

ALC-109 POLISHED BRASS

ALC-114 CHROME FOR LEXAN

ALC-115 STAINLESS STEEL

ALC-118 GOLD TITANIUM

ALC-119 AIRFRAME ALUMINIUM

ALC-122 MIRRORED GOLD FOR LEXAN

 

And even then, it does NOT need to be black; Alclad suggests a clear undercoat as well:

 

"Apply one of these primers before using High Shine ALCLAD:

ALCLAD GLOSS BLACK BASE ALC-304/305

ALCLAD CLEAR BASE ALC-303"

(http://alclad2.com/how-to/)

 

Also, as Brother dnl42 states, an undercoat will tint the Alclad. So why not use a gloss blue undercoat for upper surfaces, and a gloss tan undercoat for lower surfaces, so as to simulate the reflection of sky and concrete from a natural metal surface?

That is a great I sea thank you and I know you said to use the alclad gloss black base but to save money would it be okay to use tamiya gloss black

[Space Ranger]

Here's what Alclad themselves have to say: "(Other hobby enamel paints are suitable-it is advisable to conduct a test on scrap plastic)"

 

I've heard of other using Tamiya Gloss Black and Model Master Gloss Black with success, but as I have not used them myself, I really can't give you any advice as to either. I would suggest conducting a test, just as Alclad suggests.

Edited October 6, 2019 by Space Ranger

[Space Ranger]

P.S. Alclad's "how-to" page is here:  http://alclad2.com/how-to/

[Filbert_Wang]

@Space Ranger and @dnl42 - this is all so useful, many thanks for posting. 

 

If I could add another question as a metallics newbie, how do you normally proceed with a scheme that is mix of bare metal and camouflage? I'm thinking for example of some Luftwaffe examples of the F-104 or the Electric Lightning Airfix kit. In this case would you paint the metal surface first, then mask to do the camouflage areas? Do you need to be careful using a standard acrylic over the chrome? (I generally use Mr Hobby, Tamiya or AK interactive)

 

[Space Ranger]

I usually spray metallics first, then mask, then spray camouflage. Except for Alclad, I use enamels exclusively, so can't comment on acrylics.

[Tbolt]

On 10/6/2019 at 12:46 AM, Space Ranger said:

I don't know who started the claim that a gloss black undercoat was required. I see it all the time, but it is incorrect. You need to use an undercoat ONLY for these shades:

 

ALC-105 POLISHED ALUMINIUM

ALC-107 CHROME FOR PLASTIC

ALC-109 POLISHED BRASS

ALC-114 CHROME FOR LEXAN

ALC-115 STAINLESS STEEL

ALC-118 GOLD TITANIUM

ALC-119 AIRFRAME ALUMINIUM

ALC-122 MIRRORED GOLD FOR LEXAN

 

And even then, it does NOT need to be black; Alclad suggests a clear undercoat as well:

 

"Apply one of these primers before using High Shine ALCLAD:

ALCLAD GLOSS BLACK BASE ALC-304/305

ALCLAD CLEAR BASE ALC-303"

(http://alclad2.com/how-to/)

 

Also, as Brother dnl42 states, an undercoat will tint the Alclad. So why not use a gloss blue undercoat for upper surfaces, and a gloss tan undercoat for lower surfaces, so as to simulate the reflection of sky and concrete from a natural metal surface?

 

That claim about a black undercoat was for the Chrome and was from Alclad themsevles. This was the instructions that came with Alclad II when they first came out:

 

 

Yes you can use a clear base if the plastic is very dark, otherwise it will not have quite the same effect for the high shine finishes, of course it depends what finish you are looking for, but black will give the strongest effect on them.

 

 

[Space Ranger]

3 hours ago, Tbolt said:

 

That claim about a black undercoat was for the Chrome and was from Alclad themsevles. This was the instructions that came with Alclad II when they first came out:

 

 

Yes you can use a clear base if the plastic is very dark, otherwise it will not have quite the same effect for the high shine finishes, of course it depends what finish you are looking for, but black will give the strongest effect on them.

 

 

Yes, black is required for some shades, just not all of them. Just as I said.

[Tbolt]

31 minutes ago, Space Ranger said:

Yes, black is required for some shades, just not all of them. Just as I said.

Okay, I must have missed where you said that. You mentioned several shades including Chrome and said the primer doesn't need to be black?

 

 

[Space Ranger]

4 minutes ago, Tbolt said:

Okay, I must have missed where you said that. You mentioned several shades including Chrome and said the primer doesn't need to be black?

Please refer to post #3 in this thread. And post #2 as well.

[Tbolt]

31 minutes ago, Space Ranger said:

Please refer to post #3 in this thread. And post #2 as well.

That's what I was referring to, but if you don't get what  saying, then don't worry about it 😄.