Short Sunderland Mk III - Italeri 1/72

[elger]

With my Airfix Lancaster which also has somewhat heavy panel lines I started with Mr Surfacer as well in an attempt to reduce them, but at some point realized that just blasting Tamiya grey primer from a spray can onto the plastic from what's normally considered too close a distance was more effective. Obviously that approach is rather indiscriminate and everything is covered in primer. If I build another kit with heavy panel lines I think I'll use that approach again.

[Martian]

I had the same sort of issue when I first got my H & S airbrush. I now give it a deep clean both before and after spraying sessions and when I change colours and have had no problems since then. The brush breaks down so easily it is no hassle to do this. Interestingly, my friend who recently got an H & S had the same issue as well, he now does the deep clean and has had no further problems.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Martian 👽

[AdrianMF]

14 hours ago, perdu said:

trench warfare

FWIW I just smear PPP across the panel lines with my thumb and wipe off the excess a bit later with a damp tissue. That worked for me on the New Airfix Spitfire, and Beaufighter wings on my Beaufort build.

 

Also FWIW,  I saw a lovely Italeri/SH Sunderland build at Telford and asked the chap what he’d done about the panel lines - he replied “nothing”, so it could be that it’s a big enough model to carry them off.

 

Looking at the pic of the primered subassemblies, the panel lines don’t look too bad at all.

 

Regards,

Adrian

 

 

 

 

[CedB]

2 hours ago, elger said:

With my Airfix Lancaster which also has somewhat heavy panel lines I started with Mr Surfacer as well in an attempt to reduce them, but at some point realized that just blasting Tamiya grey primer from a spray can onto the plastic from what's normally considered too close a distance was more effective. Obviously that approach is rather indiscriminate and everything is covered in primer. If I build another kit with heavy panel lines I think I'll use that approach again.

Thanks elger - trouble is, too much sanding afterwards and I'm very lazy!  

41 minutes ago, Martian Hale said:

I had the same sort of issue when I first got my H & S airbrush. I now give it a deep clean both before and after spraying sessions and when I change colours and have had no problems since then. The brush breaks down so easily it is no hassle to do this. Interestingly, my friend who recently got an H & S had the same issue as well, he now does the deep clean and has had no further problems.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Martian 👽

Thanks Martian  I'll try to remember to clean before AND after…

23 minutes ago, AdrianMF said:

FWIW I just smear PPP across the panel lines with my thumb and wipe off the excess a bit later with a damp tissue. That worked for me on the New Airfix Spitfire, and Beaufighter wings on my Beaufort build.

 

Also FWIW,  I saw a lovely Italeri/SH Sunderland build at Telford and asked the chap what he’d done about the panel lines - he replied “nothing”, so it could be that it’s a big enough model to carry them off.

 

Looking at the pic of the primered subassemblies, the panel lines don’t look too bad at all.

 

Regards,

Adrian

Thanks Adrian - good tip and I might use that later if there are any obviously 'trench' areas left  

 

 

But this morning I thought I'd try perdu's suggestions of the Mr Dissolved Putty:

 

 

Brushing across the trenches seemed to achieve the desired result:

 

 

Now, IF it doesn't shrink to nothing we have a winner.

Smells a bit though…

[keefr22]

I didn't realise you'd given up on using Klear to fill the trenches Ced - I take it that didn't work either? Your new attempts brought to mind something else I'd seen someone use on Italeri's 'detailing', and that was to use a Tippex correction pen & draw over the trenches with it. I was quite impressed with that so bought a couple to try myself and it did seem to be working - until I lost all interest in the thing and chucked it back in its box....

 

Keith

[Tomoshenko]

Nice work Ced, like your posh airbrush. Trench warfare is certainly turning into a war of attrition, though Adrian's suggestion looks to be the most effective. While we're talking airbrushes, ditto Martian's advice. I always give mine a deep clean, only way to be sure. Plus you can't go wrong with the advice of a Martian given they have "minds immeasurably superior to ours"

[CedB]

6 hours ago, keefr22 said:

I didn't realise you'd given up on using Klear to fill the trenches Ced - I take it that didn't work either? Your new attempts brought to mind something else I'd seen someone use on Italeri's 'detailing', and that was to use a Tippex correction pen & draw over the trenches with it. I was quite impressed with that so bought a couple to try myself and it did seem to be working - until I lost all interest in the thing and chucked it back in its box....

 

Keith

Thanks Keith. It was working, sort of, but (like the Mr Surfacer) only slowly. Perdu's idea of the Mr Dissolved Putty has worked much better (see below)  

6 hours ago, Tomoshenko said:

Nice work Ced, like your posh airbrush. Trench warfare is certainly turning into a war of attrition, though Adrian's suggestion looks to be the most effective. While we're talking airbrushes, ditto Martian's advice. I always give mine a deep clean, only way to be sure. Plus you can't go wrong with the advice of a Martian given they have "minds immeasurably superior to ours"

Thanks Tomo  PPP and keep it clean - got it!

 

 

The Mr Dissolved Putty has worked well with little shrinkage and has been sanded:

 

 

 

Along with the fuselage seam:

 

 

Note the hole around the front top window? I was thinking 'Huh, that'll have to be filled' then I noticed that there's a dome to go over the top. Phew.

 

As that more or less completes the sanding so I started to look at assembling the other bits and pieces.

 

That's when it all started going wrong

 

Spot the (not) deliberate mistake:

 

 

And why doesn't this sit nicely?

 

 

Because I cleaned up the flash inside the coming that's not, er, flash:

 

 

…it's a support ring. Rats. I've glued that in pre-painting:

 

 

At least I can't mess up the cowlings (or can I?) so they've been glued with latex glue:

 

 

I'll rub off the excess and stick them on (with latex again) prior to a shot of primer.

 

Mojo squashed, again  

[giemme]

Sorry to hear about your mishaps, Ced 🤷‍♂️ Looks like they're all fixable, though

 

Ciao

[keefr22]

3 hours ago, CedB said:

and keep it clean

 

Have to say that I don't clean my H&S brushes (or any other brand in the past) before spraying, as I always give them a thorough clean after each spraying session, so I find a quick blast through with the relevent thinner for the paint to be used to check they're spraying OK is sufficient. For colour changes I clean out the colour cup, pull out and clean the needle, brush the nozzle with some thinner and then give it a quick blast through with some thinner and away to go.

 

Always works for me (famous last words!!)

 

Keith

[Biggles87]

Do you mean the deliberate mistake with the float struts or the one with the turret?

 

John

PS.  If you drop things fixed with latex glue do they bounce?

[hendie]

repeat after me Ced

 

 

I know I can do this

Though sometimes wonder why

I know I can bloomin' do this

At least it's not a Fly

[TheBaron]

Blimeyus Cedturion.

This beast is a test of all your characteristic patience and humour but you are definitely making progress, however hard it must seem being in the thick of it. Strewth, that's a lot of lines you've filled there but the results will definitely be worth it in the end.

 

Nice airbrush array too! (You can always relegate one to spray tanning...)

[malpaso]

As long as I'm just spraying Matt acrylics, my H&Ss (pauper - only two!) just get a spray through of thinners between colours - Carplan windscreen wash actually.  That can be for sessions over a couple of weeks.  Full strip down and clean in meths is mandatory after each metallic though, more  to avoid contamination of following colours. 

 

Or obviously if I get a thinning ratio wrong and it bungs up when a full strip is required.  After a couple of years I found on the online spares diagram (helpfully, NOT same as the one in the manual) there is another o-ring buried in the body of the airbrush which eventually gums up and stiffens the action.  A standard long shaft screwdriver removes its clamping ring.

 

Avoid Vallejo PU primers at all costs.  I discovered there's a reason the guy was giving £60's worth away...

 

Anyway glad to see your Sunderland coming on, the issues seem pretty similar to what I found on the Mk.1.  I didn't bother with filling the panel lines although they seemed a bit alarming whilst building, after Halfords finest and then Gunze and Tamiya camouflage they didn't seem so egregious.

 

Cheers

Will

[Ex-FAAWAFU]

My H & S experience is much the same as Keith’s & Will’s.  That said, I also have an old, cheapo Chinese job that I use for things like primer and metallics; the H & S is fab, but a little more temperamental than the Chinese one which would probably spray concrete.  Just don’t ask it to do anything delicate or precise.

[CedB]

On 30/11/2019 at 18:24, giemme said:

Sorry to hear about your mishaps, Ced 🤷‍♂️ Looks like they're all fixable, though

 

Ciao

Thanks Giorgio  The fixable has been fixed!

On 30/11/2019 at 18:50, keefr22 said:

 

Have to say that I don't clean my H&S brushes (or any other brand in the past) before spraying, as I always give them a thorough clean after each spraying session, so I find a quick blast through with the relevent thinner for the paint to be used to check they're spraying OK is sufficient. For colour changes I clean out the colour cup, pull out and clean the needle, brush the nozzle with some thinner and then give it a quick blast through with some thinner and away to go.

 

Always works for me (famous last words!!)

 

Keith

Thanks Keith, great tips  

On 30/11/2019 at 20:31, Biggles87 said:

Do you mean the deliberate mistake with the float struts or the one with the turret?

 

John

PS.  If you drop things fixed with latex glue do they bounce?

Both! I'm not dropping anything to test it!  

On 30/11/2019 at 22:13, hendie said:

repeat after me Ced

 

 

I know I can do this

Though sometimes wonder why

I know I can bloomin' do this

At least it's not a Fly

I know I can do this

Though sometimes wonder why

I know I can bloomin' do this

At least it's not a Fly

 

Your wish is my command!  

On 30/11/2019 at 23:23, TheBaron said:

Blimeyus Cedturion.

This beast is a test of all your characteristic patience and humour but you are definitely making progress, however hard it must seem being in the thick of it. Strewth, that's a lot of lines you've filled there but the results will definitely be worth it in the end.

 

Nice airbrush array too! (You can always relegate one to spray tanning...)

Thanks Tony

On 01/12/2019 at 08:45, malpaso said:

As long as I'm just spraying Matt acrylics, my H&Ss (pauper - only two!) just get a spray through of thinners between colours - Carplan windscreen wash actually.  That can be for sessions over a couple of weeks.  Full strip down and clean in meths is mandatory after each metallic though, more  to avoid contamination of following colours. 

 

Or obviously if I get a thinning ratio wrong and it bungs up when a full strip is required.  After a couple of years I found on the online spares diagram (helpfully, NOT same as the one in the manual) there is another o-ring buried in the body of the airbrush which eventually gums up and stiffens the action.  A standard long shaft screwdriver removes its clamping ring.

 

Avoid Vallejo PU primers at all costs.  I discovered there's a reason the guy was giving £60's worth away...

 

Anyway glad to see your Sunderland coming on, the issues seem pretty similar to what I found on the Mk.1.  I didn't bother with filling the panel lines although they seemed a bit alarming whilst building, after Halfords finest and then Gunze and Tamiya camouflage they didn't seem so egregious.

 

Cheers

Will

Thanks Will, great tips too  I think my main problem is with the fast-drying Stynylrez - I need to speed up in the future!

On 01/12/2019 at 11:21, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

My H & S experience is much the same as Keith’s & Will’s.  That said, I also have an old, cheapo Chinese job that I use for things like primer and metallics; the H & S is fab, but a little more temperamental than the Chinese one which would probably spray concrete.  Just don’t ask it to do anything delicate or precise.

Thanks Crisp  I had been using a cheapo job too but it's one of those with the tiny, tiny nozzle that has to be removed with a spanner. Nightmare to deep clean. I'll hold on to it though; might come in.

 

 

So, two days and nothing done! Both days were family events - enjoyable but involving some imbibement that precludes (safe) modelling afterwards.

Today though I had some mojo, perhaps inspired by this:

 

 

Shadow of my 'Crikey' on the wall. I don't know why I've not noticed it before. Coming over all Baronial  

 

Finally the final coat of primer has been applied:

 

 

including a blast on the prop blades prior to yellowing the tips. They are yellow aren't they? Better check…

[keefr22]

15 minutes ago, CedB said:

 

Shadow of my 'Crikey' on the wall.

 

Love that! Looks like his wingman emerging from the cloudbank behind him - brill !!

[giemme]

Smooth primer coat, Ced - as in your best tradition

 

The first pic is very evocative!

 

Ciao

[Greg Law]

This is looking good. I take it, it will join the other plane on the ceiling.

[bbudde]

Great reflection on that Ced. Reminds me of Mike Oldfield's "Five miles out" cover!

The Sunderland is coming along very nice in a white coat!

Cheers Benedikt (Ben or whoever )

[rob85]

Fine primer work Ced! And in the grand scheme of things the errors are small and fixable to a man of your talent.

 

how very baron of you with the picture of shadows, very nice picture though and a great shadow!

 

Rob

[TheBaron]

4 hours ago, CedB said:

Coming over all Baronial  

 

1 hour ago, rob85 said:

how very baron of you with the picture of shadows,

Just wait til you see the size of that Sunderland shadow up there. It'll be like a bloody solar eclipse!

[Andwil]

3 hours ago, Greg Law said:

This is looking good. I take it, it will join the other plane on the ceiling.

I reckon he’ll float in the bath, or build a pond for it in the back garden.

 

AW

[hendie]

7 hours ago, CedB said:

 

 

 

 

I reckon you should grab a pencil and trace that silhouette on the wall at hourly intervals Ced - you could have a whole Squadron swooping down from the clouds  cornicing (and something to color in when the mojo is low!)

 

 

 

[Ex-FAAWAFU]

14 hours ago, keefr22 said:

 

Love that! Looks like his wingman emerging from the cloudbank behind him - brill !!

Either that or it was taken a split second after a very close “airmiss”

[CedB]

On 03/12/2019 at 17:08, keefr22 said:

 

Love that! Looks like his wingman emerging from the cloudbank behind him - brill !!

On 03/12/2019 at 19:58, bbudde said:

Great reflection on that Ced. Reminds me of Mike Oldfield's "Five miles out" cover!

The Sunderland is coming along very nice in a white coat!

Cheers Benedikt (Ben or whoever )

15 hours ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

Either that or it was taken a split second after a very close “airmiss”

23 hours ago, hendie said:

 

I reckon you should grab a pencil and trace that silhouette on the wall at hourly intervals Ced - you could have a whole Squadron swooping down from the clouds  cornicing (and something to color in when the mojo is low!)

 

Thanks chaps  Perhaps I should start a 'guess the shadow competition? Might keep you busy while my mojo's low?

Hendie I can't produce a squadron - the shadow's from the light bulb. Pity.

 

On 03/12/2019 at 18:16, giemme said:

Smooth primer coat, Ced - as in your best tradition

 

The first pic is very evocative!

 

Ciao

Thanks Giorgio - Stynylrez is my friend  

 

On 03/12/2019 at 19:25, Greg Law said:

This is looking good. I take it, it will join the other plane on the ceiling.

It will indeed Greg - as per perdu's request, in formation with the Nimrod  

 

On 03/12/2019 at 20:38, rob85 said:

Fine primer work Ced! And in the grand scheme of things the errors are small and fixable to a man of your talent.

 

how very baron of you with the picture of shadows, very nice picture though and a great shadow!

 

Rob

Thanks Rob  Yes, I don't no what came over me, very David Bailey.

 

On 03/12/2019 at 21:48, TheBaron said:

 

Just wait til you see the size of that Sunderland shadow up there. It'll be like a bloody solar eclipse!

Cripes! You're right!  

 

On 03/12/2019 at 22:46, Andwil said:

I reckon he’ll float in the bath, or build a pond for it in the back garden.

 

AW

Thanks Will, but I won't be testing my seams like that!  

 

 

 

Some mojo before bed so I made use of it. I have no idea why Italeri decided that they needed to emphasise 20^o twice in the instructions:

 

 

Maybe it's because the square location dots for the intakes aren't actually on the model? Oops.

Anyway, all the bits were assembled:

 

 

…and, because I don't need the props to spin on the ceiling but I do need to mask the engines I decided to glue in the shafts:

 

 

My idea of glueing the cowlings on with latex worked OK but I realised the the back of the cowlings doesn't touch the nacelle so there's a risk they'd be wobbly.

With all four assembled:

 

 

(No protractors now chaps - I'm not that accurate)

…all I needed to do was to cut some masks out from some 'that'll come in' packaging with the circle cutter:

 

 

They've been painted so I'll put them together next and stick 'em on the wings.