The Spadgent Posted August 30, 2019 Share Posted August 30, 2019 Well that’s a bit quick. I have used regular tin foil in the past. “On my Torino” but I need BMF in my life. Is it a one shot deal with the sticky side? Is there a chance to re position or is that never going to happen? Great build BTW and I’m on page one for once. 🤗 Johnny Damn it!!! So close. 🤣😂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookenbacher Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Very cool experiment Ced, looking forward to more foiling. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted August 31, 2019 Author Share Posted August 31, 2019 15 hours ago, The Spadgent said: Well that’s a bit quick. I have used regular tin foil in the past. “On my Torino” but I need BMF in my life. Is it a one shot deal with the sticky side? Is there a chance to re position or is that never going to happen? Great build BTW and I’m on page one for once. 🤗 Johnny Damn it!!! So close. 🤣😂 Well it is an 'Easy Assembly' Johnny! I'm no expert but my experience with the BMF is that it is a 'one shot deal' with the sticky. I had tried to save off-cuts and use them but they do seem to have lost their stick. Of course you can buy BMF adhesive… once it's down though I think it will tear if you try to pull it off so, as others have said, cut oversize and position gently to start with. We shall see! 8 hours ago, Cookenbacher said: Very cool experiment Ced, looking forward to more foiling. Thanks Cookie Tailwheel doors sanded and scribed and tailplanes fitted: 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted August 31, 2019 Author Share Posted August 31, 2019 On 30/08/2019 at 03:45, stevehnz said: Ced, if you can be bothered, the P-47 had/has a prominent intake splitter under the engine withjn the cowl opening which delievered air to the turbo (centre part) & the oil coolers, (outer parts) the HB kit has a total lack of anything in this area other than a humungous void which definitely repays some attention here. https://www.lonestarflight.org/public/styles/crop_wide/public/_PM23219.jpg?itok=TwNM83jn Just for you Steve on a quiet Saturday afternoon: Trouble is it has to be painted red. Like the inside of the cowling. Other say 'paint before foil'. Hmmm. Grey gearbox, black lumpy bits? Later. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevehnz Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Looks good Ced, a big improvement on the kit version. I like the idea of using a piece of tube like that. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted August 31, 2019 Author Share Posted August 31, 2019 Thanks Steve Some painting done: Now I can mask up for the red nose bendy bit. Fun. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 6 minutes ago, CedB said: Now I can mask up for the red nose bendy bit. One rarely hears such a phrase these days outside of the more outré Berlin leather bars. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted September 1, 2019 Author Share Posted September 1, 2019 Thanks Tony New eyes late last night and some fiddling showed that masking before the nose was on was going to be tricky impossible so I painted some red on the inside (including the splitter) and glued the nose on: Some spots of glue in the slots on the engine and it pushed on much better than the dry fit. Happy with that. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbudde Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 A bit late here. But better now, before it*s finished tomorrow. Nice start. Cheers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted September 1, 2019 Author Share Posted September 1, 2019 Hi Ben I don't think it'll be finished tomorrow, especially if I carry on with the foil. Johnny @The Spadgent asked if it was a 'one shot deal' with the BMF so I thought I'd try it. Oh alright, I'll admit it - I cut the foil to go on the diagonal panel with the er, panels and the aileron then remembered the grain in the foil. "Aha!" I thought, "what if I cut the spare off and try to position it in the gap?" Stuck down OK and the double thickness where I overlapped is only visible if you look really closely. Those who've seen my NMF builds before will know that I like the AK True Metal paste so I put some Dark Aluminium (right) and Aluminium on to compare: Interesting 'effect' on the paste; I've not had that before. Maybe because I applied it thinly and burnished with the cotton bud (up and down, left and right) too soon. I may try another coat later but I quite like the effect. One thing I couldn't do with paste: BMF on the cross and front frames and BRT around the bottom. I like that, a lot. It would be even better if I'd been more careful. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 I like that canopy framing Ced! But still not convinced by the foil elsewhere And the paste looks to have gone on really strangely.... Keith 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 29 minutes ago, keefr22 said: I like that canopy framing Ced! But still not convinced by the foil elsewhere And the paste looks to have gone on really strangely.... Keith I have to concur with Keith here. Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 I'm afraid I have to agree. Ian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted September 1, 2019 Author Share Posted September 1, 2019 3 hours ago, keefr22 said: I like that canopy framing Ced! But still not convinced by the foil elsewhere And the paste looks to have gone on really strangely.... Keith 2 hours ago, giemme said: I have to concur with Keith here. Ciao 2 hours ago, limeypilot said: I'm afraid I have to agree. Ian Thanks Keith, Giorgio and Ian I have to agree too. I did another coat of paste: …photographed at that angle to show the difference between the normal Aluminium and the Dark. It still looks a bit, er, weird though eh? Anyway, if I have to paint before foil I'd can't avoid the red nose any longer… Is there something in the 'Canopy Survival Kit'? I normally get this out for jobs like this, gaze at the various shapes and then put it back in the packet, unused. This time though I found some shapes that were close enough: Not as pointy as they should be but hey, what's the alternative. Answers on a postcard to… I then spent AGES covering the rest to avoid overspray: What a mess on the bench. Then it was 5 minutes in the spray booth and off with the masks: That little oops rubbed off with a cotton bud. More foil then? I'm not becoming a fan I must admit… Maybe I'll even up the current panels, maybe do a few more, then finish with the paste… Thoughts? 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 Great job with the engine cowling As for the rest, since this is an experiment, I'd say keep experimenting ... Ciao 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 Paste Paste Paste I have not become a fan of Bare Metal Foil in sixty odd (very odd modelling) years, can't see it happening now 😕 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 The variety of metal effects that can be produced by various media is fascinating Ced. Always find though that the biggest problem with appearances is the lighting: bench and domestic lighting are nothing like the general effect of daylight that we generally see actual aircraft in that I find myself easily confused by what might in fact be an acceptable look in the end. Any chance of an outdoor shot so we could see the results in daylight? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 2 hours ago, CedB said: Thoughts? 1. I like your red nose....!! 2. The paste still looks weird to me. Maybe its just the macro pic but it looks rough and lumpy and doesn't seem to have covered that well. Not like the results you've had with it before.Wonder if the stuff goes off? 3. Why has that bit of foil next to the paste turned blue - reflection? K 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 1 hour ago, perdu said: I have not become a fan of Bare Metal Foil in sixty odd (very odd modelling) years, can't see it happening now 😕 10 years more than me Bill, but I second that! What did the similar stuff used to be called - Metalskin? I may be wrong but I seem to recall a tie in with Rareplanes vacforms? I think a lot of their display models were covered in it. I seem to recall a Seversky P-35 being on the front of the packaging....? (I've probably still got the stuff somewhere, never throw anything away!) Keith 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 Back in the days when I owned several more bad habits than today I used to skim the tissue layer from the inner foil linings on my fag boxes and use the foil thus revealed if I needed, really needed to 'skin' a model It had its own very fine and durable adhesive layer that stuck well and took to burnishing firmly down It also responded to slight abrasion in order to change the look of various panels, polishing too (E E Lightning wings have an apparent grain if you examine the surface reflectance) I had moderate success with it but found BMF less receptive to 'change' by treatment And incredibly expensive compared to stuff we normally threw away ☺ 😇 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted September 2, 2019 Author Share Posted September 2, 2019 15 hours ago, giemme said: Great job with the engine cowling As for the rest, since this is an experiment, I'd say keep experimenting ... Ciao Thanks Giorgio Keep experimenting? Well, I did bookmark Old Man's post on using kitchen foil treated by boiling in eggshell but, although his results are great, it's a step too far for me I'm afraid - I don't think Mrs B would be too pleased to come back to the mess! I might do a few more panels but I'm not really liking the results to be honest (see below). 15 hours ago, perdu said: Paste Paste Paste I have not become a fan of Bare Metal Foil in sixty odd (very odd modelling) years, can't see it happening now 😕 Thanks Bill - to start with I thought you were having problems with your computer! What IS he trying to paste? Then I got it - use the AK paste, right. 14 hours ago, TheBaron said: The variety of metal effects that can be produced by various media is fascinating Ced. Always find though that the biggest problem with appearances is the lighting: bench and domestic lighting are nothing like the general effect of daylight that we generally see actual aircraft in that I find myself easily confused by what might in fact be an acceptable look in the end. Any chance of an outdoor shot so we could see the results in daylight? Thanks Tony You want me to go OUT??!! Good grief man… I can though stand by the window, just for you: You're right of course that the light, and the angle of the dangle, shows differing effects; for example in that last shot the AK on the front looks really shiny (I'll give it another coat I think). 13 hours ago, keefr22 said: 1. I like your red nose....!! 2. The paste still looks weird to me. Maybe its just the macro pic but it looks rough and lumpy and doesn't seem to have covered that well. Not like the results you've had with it before.Wonder if the stuff goes off? 3. Why has that bit of foil next to the paste turned blue - reflection? K Thanks Keith The paste does look weird so I'll give it another go over - the bit on the fuselage looks much better (see below). The BMF looks blue due, as you say, to reflection. I was wearing a blue t-shirt but I'm wearing a green one now: 13 hours ago, keefr22 said: 10 years more than me Bill, but I second that! What did the similar stuff used to be called - Metalskin? I may be wrong but I seem to recall a tie in with Rareplanes vacforms? I think a lot of their display models were covered in it. I seem to recall a Seversky P-35 being on the front of the packaging....? (I've probably still got the stuff somewhere, never throw anything away!) Keith 2 hours ago, perdu said: Back in the days when I owned several more bad habits than today I used to skim the tissue layer from the inner foil linings on my fag boxes and use the foil thus revealed if I needed, really needed to 'skin' a model It had its own very fine and durable adhesive layer that stuck well and took to burnishing firmly down It also responded to slight abrasion in order to change the look of various panels, polishing too (E E Lightning wings have an apparent grain if you examine the surface reflectance) I had moderate success with it but found BMF less receptive to 'change' by treatment And incredibly expensive compared to stuff we normally threw away ☺ 😇 Thanks Keith and Bill Ah, fag packet foil, another pleasure denied us by the Nanny state… 😜 So, where are we IMHO? The BRT is great where details like rivets need to be added but MY ROLL (YMMV) is too thick for fine panel coverage; it's really hard to see the sunken lines once it's on and scribers go wherever the mood takes them (like on the panels I tried to find) The BMF is harder to apply (it almost always rolled up when removed) but it's very thin and goes into detail really well. It's also burnished really well around bumps although it did crease from time to time and the creases are hard to get out. AK paste? I love it. I'll give the wings another coat and see how that goes. This morning I realised what a pain the red nose was going to be. I had to re-mask, this time on the paint, so that I could apply some AK aluminium: That bottom line looks bent doesn't it? It's not, honest: I think there may be some paint build up - check model - nope. Maybe where the panel line shines and distracts the eye? Oh well. The problem is I now need to mask the curved red to apply the tape. I wish I'd used the cutter now as, obviously, the cut would have produced both masks at the same time. I shall try to remember that for next time. You can see I've also assembled the tanks and added the 'missing panel' to balance up the wings. What now? Whitley. But then? Hmmm. The BRT won't be used for flat panels again but I WILL use it, like Tony, for representing tased panels, especially where they have details like rivets. The BMF will be put back in the drawer for the next time I need a metal frame or some small detail - it's great for that. Now I need to sort out the mask for the nose. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 3 hours ago, CedB said: for representing tased panels Oh strewth, you haven't bought a taser now - surely a tool too far?! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted September 2, 2019 Author Share Posted September 2, 2019 19 minutes ago, keefr22 said: Oh strewth, you haven't bought a taser now - surely a tool too far?! What? Now then, why is auto-correct changing 'raised' to 'tased'; it's not as though it's learning from my… oh wait, that article I drafted on 'How to deal with toe rags' Look what eventually stirred in the grey matter: 'Tape for Curves' - hey, I have those! Remember, stretch slightly and burnish down with a warm finger: Did it work? Yay! OK, it pulled the paint off in a tiny spot but that was soon dotted back in. Now turn over… 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 Keep it going, Ced Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 Nice job remasking the nose Ced, never an easy task. I have to say though, that I prefer the BMF look to the paste! However I do only use it on small panels. There aren't many WWI aircraft in bare metal! Ian 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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