Jump to content

Beaufighter 20mm ammo cans- dimensions?


Jim Kiker

Recommended Posts

Hi all,

 

I am interested in improving the 20mm ammo cans that are in the 1/48 scale Tamiya Beaufighter kit.  I have a technical drawing showing the feeds, but what I need is the dimensions of the cans themselves.  Any light you can shed will be most helpful.

 

Thanks in advance, Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would presume these are the same 60 round drums for Hispano cannon as used in the Spitfire with the B wing?

 

 

hispano1-1.jpg

from here https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/381994-spitfire-iib-wrong-cannon-armament/

 

@brewerjerry  or @Selwyn  would be people who might know more? 

 

this image of a Beaufighter appears to show belt feeds,  

 

Armourers_of_No_89_Squadron_RAF_servicin

 

which would make sense for later versions as the drums had a smaller capacity,  60 round IIRC,  and in the case of the Spitfire, the c wing had 140 rounds in the box.

This maybe wrong, as done from memory, and right now i don't fancy searching about seeing what the net has to say...  so happy to be corrected.

HTH

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds right. I seem to recall reading that in the early days a navigator / radar operator in a Beaufighter was responsible for swapping out the 60 round drums when they were empty with spares carried in the fuselage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

43 minutes ago, EwenS said:

Sounds right. I seem to recall reading that in the early days a navigator / radar operator in a Beaufighter was responsible for swapping out the 60 round drums when they were empty with spares carried in the fuselage.

Not a fun task, especially in turbulence or a manoeuvring aircraft.  See for example Rawnsley and Wright's Night Fighter, by a man who was there!

Edited by Seahawk
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi all,

 

Thank you for the various replies.  Yes, this is in regard to the 20mm shown the the first reply; however, as was pointed out, only a very few first airframes used the 60 round drums.  "Night Fighter" by Jimmy Rawnsley is one of my favorite books on wartime experiences, and removing the empties and fighting to get the loaded drums installed while in a running battle was a pretty amazing feat in my book!  After that small first batch, the Beau received large rectangular boxes for a significantly larger load of ammo for each cannon.  The Tamiya kit has two rectangular boxes with no detail.  Having a picture of the feeds is certainly useful, but it is the boxes that can be seen between the crew stations when everything is buttoned up.  So I continue the search- what were the dimensions of those four boxes?

 

Thanks and cheers, Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Jim Kiker said:

The Tamiya kit has two rectangular boxes with no detail.  Having a picture of the feeds is certainly useful, but it is the boxes that can be seen between the crew stations when everything is buttoned up.  So I continue the search- what were the dimensions of those four boxes?

Hmm,  well, I presume somehwere online there are some better shots of this, the cutaway Beaufighter nose that is/was at RAF Museum Hendon, 

p2544711219-4.jpg

from https://johnhumephotography.zenfolio.com/p208119748/h97AD3633#h97ad3633

 

as can be seen the ammo boxes are visible.

 

this may help

BRISTOL+BEAUFIGHTER+TECHNICAL0415.tiff

 

From

http://self-preservationsociety.blogspot.com/2013/10/bristol-beaufighter-again.html

 

If nothing else you could make a good guesstimate, also, you can get an idea from the shell size of the 20mm round....

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi

   checked my copies of manuals, everything  but the dimensions

 

but this may help if the link works ok

flight magazine 21 dec 1939 

 

https://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1939/1939-1- - 1599.html

 

 

if the drawing is to scale

barrel length is 5ft   7 1/4 in

 

  cheers

   jerry

  

 

Edited by brewerjerry
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Jim Kiker said:

The Tamiya kit has two rectangular boxes with no detail. 

 

given the parts are hard too see, and that if the Aires resin is 'correct'

845_rd.jpg

 

Tamiya for comparison

beaufightericjv_int3.jpg

 

the Tamiya boxes are a basis too add detail, and look  to about the right basic size and shape.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jim.  Unfortunately I can't help with the 1:1 measurements of the 20mm ammunition cans, but hope the pics below will help.

 

I have included a photo of the cans from the Revell 1:48 kit. Slightly better than those Tamiya provided! Can't give you exact measurements as the battery in my digital calipers appears to have died!

 

Cheers,

Pete M.

 

1vtcKjf.jpg

 

usqrMO3.jpg

From the TFX manual

 

jwdDYm0.jpg

 

From my files...sorry I have no credit listed for that one.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

For Troy, Chris, and Jerry, thank you for your inputs; they all help get me to the point where I can approximate the dimensions well enough to serve my purpose.

 

For Pete, always a pleasure to see you on the 'net, my friend.  Thank you for the picture of those kit parts, the drawing, and the picture.  Very helpful!

 

Cheers all, Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jim. I was made redundant in June, and as I'm now 69 decided it was time to retire! Plenty of spare time to help out where I can on the various forums I haunt!!!!

Revell have also simplified the cans a bit but they have got them closer to the real shapes than the 'boxes' that Tamiya gave us. Got a new battery for my digital calipers this morning so here are some measurements that may help further. Hope you can make sense of it with all the 'red lines'!

 

iVQStpa.jpg

 

Cheers,

Pete M.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On ‎04‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 20:00, Troy Smith said:

Hmm,  well, I presume somehwere online there are some better shots of this, the cutaway Beaufighter nose that is/was at RAF Museum Hendon, 

 

 

There are some in my walkaround shockingly !

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Julien, thanks for the pictures and the additional information they contain.

Pete, having drawn a few red lines in my time I have NO problem reading the data.  The additional information is just what I needed to "top off" and prepare for making some new boxes.

 

Cheers, Jim

Edited by Jim Kiker
Missing word- text should have read ".. no problem..." My bad!
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...