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Sea Vixen FAW.1x2


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A quick Monday lunchtime update just to report on significant progress, but first a quick squint at recently received papyri:

On 26/02/2021 at 19:54, Pete in Lincs said:

What awaits us in the future of printing? 

I'm yer man for false teeth Pete.

Just so long as you don't mind grey gnashers.

On 26/02/2021 at 20:08, bigbadbadge said:

a lovely Sea Vixen Model.

Thanks Chris - though oddly typing 'Sea Vixen model' into Gurgle at the moment, the algorithm throws this up as the first entry:

15208071880_b98893f6de_n.jpg

Looks like Ed Straker's caravan from UFO....

On 26/02/2021 at 20:25, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

!!!!!

:thumbsup2:!!

On 26/02/2021 at 20:25, CedB said:


 

 

 

 

(That’s me being speechless)

 

On 26/02/2021 at 20:33, perdu said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ditto

 

On 26/02/2021 at 20:35, bbudde said:

 

 

 

 

 

(Seconded)

I'm saying nothing lads... :winkgrin:

On 26/02/2021 at 20:57, Spookytooth said:

What a catch up, bleedin fantastic Tony.

Cheers Simon - just steeling myself to have to print them both all over again! :facepalm:

On 26/02/2021 at 20:59, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

That’s ridiculously good; I’d be ecstatic with that wing fold at a much larger scale.

Stay tuned....

On 26/02/2021 at 20:59, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

The Jurassic canopy mod is rubbish, though; no way will that polish out...

I didn't have any Cretaceous....

On 26/02/2021 at 22:46, Martian said:

I would say that I am speechless but everyone knows that, being me, that would be an utter lie! Fantastic work though.

Oh you big sweetie! :wink:

On 27/02/2021 at 01:07, AdrianMF said:

It’s one of those black obelisk moments for modelling.

If I throw it up into the air, will it turn into a bone? 🐵:hmmm:

On 27/02/2021 at 07:05, Brandy said:

I have a long way to go to get anywhere close to these standards of printing

Garn, you're flying along already Ian. :nodding:

On 27/02/2021 at 08:24, Hamden said:

I can only echo what everyone else has said!

Cheers Roger. :thumbsup2:

On 27/02/2021 at 10:07, giemme said:

I particularly like the exposed engines and how they blend in properly in the overall view of the model.

Thanks Giorgio. :thumbsup2:

There'll be some fun times ahead experimenting with getting all the various metal looks of the engines sorted!

On 27/02/2021 at 14:59, hendie said:

I got as far as Zyzzyva in the dictionary

Hear no weevil, see no weevil....

On 27/02/2021 at 15:12, Terry1954 said:

I'm curious as to where you plan to lose your calculated 10 gms of weight?

With the wings on she's going to rock back on her bustle even further, but thankfully there's room up front to bung some lead in to counteract this Terry.

On 27/02/2021 at 19:33, keefr22 said:

Wow.

 

That's it.

 

Keith

A man of short sentences Keith... 😁

On 28/02/2021 at 08:58, heloman1 said:

Been away from your build for a while Tony, exquisite workmanship... I do like the auxiliary turbine and tail hook.

Despite my best efforts I've failed to snap them off yet Colin! :laugh:

 

After digging out the greenhouse yesterday in preparation for Spring, I spent a joyless several hours revisiting the design for the PE as the longer I stared at the blasted things, the more dissatisfied I was with the slightly lumpen feel and lack of sharp angularity in places. This doesn't show up too clearly in photos but trust me it's there!

 

I finally tracked down the culprit to the frankly abysmal quality of the .pdf drawing out outputs from Fusion. I've already mentioned how - stupidly - Autodesk and Adobe refuse to speak to each other through the medium of .dxf/.dwg drawings these days, so the only option is to use the .pdf option. When you zoom right in to the drawings in IIlustrator though, you can see just how dire the raw outlines are - instead of a smooth vector graphic you get these horrible gnawed outlines made from hundreds of points and straight lines, instead of nice smooth curves and a minimum number of points.

50993006986_42f1124545_c.jpg

Add to that the uber-heavy line weights this pdf output uses and you can see why I had to spend an inordinate amount of time changing every single line width in every single drawing and using the 'smooth' tool in Illustrator to manually turn all the curved outlines into, well, actual curves. The designs now have a crispness and smoothness that I'm happy with - I'm just waiting on fresh supplies of inkjet film from Dublin to print these up.

 

having started with a negative, let's spend the rest of the time on positives - the wingfold is in place!

50993006926_09c1cc0668_b.jpg

It does - as you would expect for any such feature - require a few dry fits to get your eye in on fixing it in three places simultaneously but once on, the combination of embedded hinges and a jury strut ensure that it is strongly secured in place:

50993123707_cd7519c1c8_b.jpg

The bit that really proved most pleasing was that large linkage that sits in the middle halfway along the wingfold:

50993006946_1b767af819_b.jpg

This is an incredibly delicate fragment that I was skeptical would actually print, but as it's one of those make-or-break details that for me are the key to a faithful reproduction of appearances, it had to be tried.

Splash a bit of silver on it and it'll be as good as...er..gold:

50993006931_dd2eccfa62_b.jpg

 

50993123652_7b70b8623b_b.jpg

Right.

Nose & grindstone have am appointment so I'll catch ye later.

Take care all.

:bye:

Tony

 

 

 

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For me Tony that linkage is the silver jewel of the whole build process, the linch pin to the entire fold sequence.

 

Absolutely fabulous.

 

I remember having assorted attempts at replicating that for my Sea Vixen, the Foxy Lady before I got something actually looking reasonable.

 

Maybe you could sell those to people with legacy models to build in their stashes.

 

Did I say FABULOUS, let's add tremendous too.

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8 minutes ago, Massimo said:

Ok, ok, the wingfold looks oke, but there's something in the nose weight that doesn't convince me...are you sure it should be like that?

:rofl:

It's a bit rough, isn't it? :rofl: Sorry Tony, we (Italians) need to keep an eye on the looks :winkgrin:  :rofl: 

 

The whole wingfold is just outstanding, with that printed linkage being the icing on the cake :worthy:  

 

Glad you sorted the PE roughness, too :thumbsup:

 

Ciao

 

 

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54 minutes ago, TheBaron said:

If I throw it up into the air, will it turn into a bone? 🐵:hmmm:

Tony, I've been thinking about this build, and I think it's significant for a number of reasons:

1) 3D printing technology is finally here in a high quality, affordable package.

2) This is done by a modeller going out and doing primary-source research. Not once have you said "The Airfix 1/48 kit does that, I will copy it and be done".

3) It is more detailed and more finely modelled than most of the kits out there.

4) It essentially comes with its own aftermarket. No need to replace sub-standard wheels or dodgy ejector seats.

5) It is not just the "only" kit or the "best currently available" kit, but it is the best option and is likely to remain so.

 

I strongly suspect that even if Airfix announced that they were scaling down their 1/48 Vixen (by all accounts, a great kit) tomorrow, almost all of us would still rather get our hands on yours. And that is a real game changer!

 

Regards,

Adrian

 

 

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1 hour ago, TheBaron said:

I finally tracked down the culprit to the frankly abysmal quality of the .pdf drawing out outputs from Fusion.

 

This may not be applicable to Fusion but in AutoCAD you can save as or print to PDF and as you rightly comment, the output is generally awful. However, if you plot (not print) to PDF you get an entirely different beast out of the other end.

If I remember rightly you mentioned you were using a soft brush to remove the film residue on the brass before etching?  I ended up using a very stiff brush as some of that residue was quite difficult to remove.  It made a big difference to the edge quality especially where you are half etching for relief.

This layered etch shows up the edge quality quite nicely

 

P2180001.jpg

 

That wingfold is a marvel to behold, or should the be beview?

 

 

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I see that the meteorite that was spotted across England the other night, landed on the nose of your model and by extremely lucky hap, ran completely out of momentum the nano-second before it touched the model and had cooled down enough so that your build was neither crushed nor melted. Some Earthlings are so jammy!

 

 

Martian👽

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3 hours ago, perdu said:

Did I say FABULOUS, let's add tremendous too.

Thanks for your kind words as ever, First Lord of the SIHRSC. 🤗

3 hours ago, perdu said:

the linch pin to the entire fold sequence.

Most succinctly put Bill in that I don't know about you but that big silver knuckle is the first thing that grabs my eye every time you look at the actual aircraft with its wings folded and the first thing you notice by its absence from a kit.

3 hours ago, perdu said:

Maybe you could sell those to people with legacy models to build in their stashes.

'Legacy Linkages' would be one very specialist aftermarket company! :laugh:

3 hours ago, Massimo said:

are you sure it should be like that?

Is that a faint whiff of skepticism that I detect rising from the Bologna area Massimo? :rofl:

3 hours ago, Brandy said:

Refer to previous post for comments.

I refer you to my previous thanks also Ian. 😁

3 hours ago, giemme said:

It's a bit rough, isn't it? :rofl: Sorry Tony, we (Italians) need to keep an eye on the looks :winkgrin:

:rofl2:

Bloody typical.

itajo-45.png

3 hours ago, giemme said:

that printed linkage being the icing on the cake

And it's still not been broken Giorgio - despite being in my presence of several hours now!

3 hours ago, AdrianMF said:

Tony, I've been thinking about this build, and I think it's significant for a number of reasons:

Those are indeed most gracious thoughts Adrian and characteristically generous of you. :nodding:

 

It's by no means a perfect kit in the sense that a file and filler will still be needed to tidy the main joins of wings, fuselage and booms, for example, but hopefully posting raw shots of it without any filler allows people to judge this factor for themselves. In terms of accuracy of shape and form, it's been a surprise to me how much you really can achieve armed with a few key dimensions from the aircraft manuals themselves, triangulated with the wealth of imagery we have at our disposal from the web nowadays and the maintenance drawings to help in understanding what we're looking at. I think in a previous post I referred to this synthesis as 'mental photogrammetry', for such it felt like.

 

In terms of helping to work with imagery, this Pureref app I recommend to everyone for organizing reference images, incorporating locally stored images, manual screenshots and images from the web, all in a single array. I doubt I could have carried his project through to such an extent without being able to concentrate visual references in this manner.

2 hours ago, hendie said:

This may not be applicable to Fusion but in AutoCAD you can save as or print to PDF and as you rightly comment, the output is generally awful. However, if you plot (not print) to PDF you get an entirely different beast out of the other end.

Thanks Alan - you spurred me to do some digging around just now.

 

Fusion - alas -  I discovered lacks any kind of plot function that you draw attention to in Autocad however, I did stumble across a way of getting an (Illustrator-readable) .dxf out of the software - not that you'd know it from the documentation. Instead of using the drawing output module in Fusion, which yields an unreadable .dxf/dwg or an:

2 hours ago, hendie said:

awful.

.pdf - there's a 'save as .dxf' option hidden away as a right click function on the initial sketch menu item, eh vwulla:

50993044318_103b30c44a_c.jpg

Smooooth vectors baby, smoooth vectors....

2 hours ago, hendie said:

If I remember rightly you mentioned you were using a soft brush to remove the film residue on the brass before etching?  I ended up using a very stiff brush as some of that residue was quite difficult to remove.  It made a big difference to the edge quality especially where you are half etching for relief.

Do you know if it's safe to do that with the spray on photoresist I'm using as well Alan? A largely rhetorical question as you know damn well I'm going to try it anyway. :rofl:

(The quality of that etch in your image is sans pareil.)

23 minutes ago, Martian said:

I see that the meteorite that was spotted across England the other night, landed on the nose of your model and by extremely lucky hap, ran completely out of momentum the nano-second before it touched the model and had cooled down enough so that your build was neither crushed nor melted. Some Earthlings are so jammy!

😁

Thank God it wasn't an alien coprolite....

 

 

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9 hours ago, TheBaron said:

In terms of accuracy of shape and form, it's been a surprise to me how much you really can achieve armed with a few key dimensions from the aircraft manuals themselves, triangulated with the wealth of imagery we have at our disposal from the web nowadays and the maintenance drawings to help in understanding what we're looking at.

I wonder when some of the "mainstream" kit designers are going to figure this out!

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Quick question seeing as this is THE Sea Vixen thread. I know the Unit is 893 Sq. RN is there a decal set for this unit as Id like to re-create this photo ? 
 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sea_Vixen_of_893_NAS_and_VA-55_A-4E_in_flight_1964.jpg

 

Already have the A-4 in these markings. 

Edited by Corsairfoxfouruncle
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Beat the software beasts!

Beat the software beasts!

 

Well done Tony, I love it when someone overcomes the 'competitive edge' features these idiots try to build in.

Just concentrate on the functions you lot - the secret is to rub the sticks together :D 

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4 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said:

Quick question seeing as this is THE Sea Vixen thread. I know the Unit is 893 Sq. RN is there a decal set for this unit as Id like to re-create this photo ? 
 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sea_Vixen_of_893_NAS_and_VA-55_A-4E_in_flight_1964.jpg

 

Already have the A-4 in these markings. 

Try the Big H.

 

Xtradecals 72077

 

P1010484.jpg

 

If you want it, its yours just PM me with the postal address you want it to come to.

 

I have built my Foxy Lassie now

 

 

 

I am sure there wont be any more from this workshop so why not re-cycle?

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Evening all. Months have become so annoying now that I'm temporarily reverting to the French revolutionary calendar on this thread -  happy Ventôse.

 

It's also been a regular pandemic hell of a week at work but I'm not going to seed the air here with a lot of negative ions, just to offer up as explanation that my mental energies weren't up to doing much on the aircraft until today. Thanks for all your kind comments Massimo, Michael, Corsairfoxfouruncle, Ced, CJ, Colin and Pete - please excuse in this instance the lack of individual responses but your words were cheering.

 

I'd started work last Sunday on producing a sharper set of PE masks in Illustrator and managed to get the job completed to my satisfaction earlier:

51009931022_498f3dbccb_b.jpg

The reduction in line weights have really crisped up the detail levels on areas like the wingfold lattice and windscreen framing for example.

 

I'd also ordered some extra gear to help with etching during the week so a fish tank aerator and a 1L plastic jar with removable strainer arrived in the post, from which I built an etching tank that would support the brass sheets in a vertical position and let the FeCl3 swirl around them. Following Alan's recommendation previously abut giving the plates a damned good scrub once the photoresist was developed, I did exactly that after exposing the new set of masks  on tom some scrap portions of photoresisted brass left over from last week, and was pleased to note that the spray-on resist remained firmly, well, sprayed-on in the exposed regions. As a novice I was just way too timid with that part of the process on the first couple of attempts.

 

There seemed little point in messing about after such an inactive week so I decided to go for it and do a test etch with the new rig, to satisfying results - especially on the smallest features:

51009829266_c01dca145b_b.jpg

The narrowest part of that etch lattice is about 0.3mm - any narrower and I don't think the part would retain enough rigidity as a unified structure at this scale. It's certainly a major improvement (in terms of the visual) over my first attempts, and once in place, fits in acceptably now with the surrounding structures I think:

51009829346_bbef6d450e_b.jpg

Also looking better in a sharper and less beefy incarnation is the smaller etch part that forms part of the aft latch mechanism:

51009931082_31dfd7518f_b.jpg

No matter how detailed your masks, I've really learned the lesson that cleaning-off any unexposed photoresist is an absolutely crucial part of the process in terms of yielding precise outlines and shapes. Aside from the addition of an aerator as well this time round,  I also stood the etchant container in a hot water bath ( an old tea tin filld from the kettle) and the etching times dropped dramatically, from about the 1-2hr etching time recommended using the Positiv 20 / FeCl3  combination, down to about 30 mins max. In fact so vigorous was the process that I nearly overcooked the job in such a small container;  I think it necessary next time to only turn the aerator on periodically in order just  to stir the mixture and move the sediments around. the level of bubbling was I think just a bit too enthusiastic in such a confined space.

 

Still to have a bash at is vacforming the canopy and windows prior test fitting all that stuff, plus I need to reprint a new set of main gear doors now that I've modified them into the correct separations. In light of this latter need, I'd mentioned over on Alan's Wapititillator thread about buying one of the newer Mars 2 printers at Easter, due to the accelerated print times. By blind luck I chanced across a lightning sale of said item on the French Amazon site and so by Friday, Robbie the Post was panting up the drive with this shameful Amazonia in both hands and a quizzical look on his face. I told him it was a sex doll of course in order to avoid the stigma of him finding out I was a modeller.

 

Haven't had a chance to crank out a print yet but it's all set up and ready to go; with having toi output both aircraft in their entirety all over again for the 'actual' build now, a second, faster, machine should take some of the time pressure off, being able to have two sets of prints going at the one time. Of course, just having worked out a series of layer height / exposure  time sweet spots on the previous version of the Mars, I've now got to go through it all again working out corresponding times for the new printer... :laugh:

 

One thing I won't be using from now on though in regard to resin printing is the Chitubox software - I'd sung the praises of recent upgrades as well you know but tbh the software just isn't developing rapidly enough and at a deep enough level to be a reliable workspace for me. The increasing number of crashes I've been experiencing with each update, allied to it freezing altogether during some slicing operations indicate that I've reached the limits of what it can do for me.. As a result I've switched over to the paid version of the Lychee slicer and wish I'd done so a long while back - the smooth nature of interaction with your assets and sheer depth of features for working with them are a necessity once your subjects reach a particular complexity.

 

I'm not going to badmouth Chitubox though - it's free and been responsible for introducing me along with many other people to the delights of 3d alchemistry. For smaller and less complex projects it's still absolutely fine imo, but once your models reach a certain level of complexity in terms of the number of components and level of detail, it starts to stagger and it's time to move on.

 

Spring is here though - look at the Ventosian light today:

51009933307_d66a070ed3_b.jpg

:bye:

Tony

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Nice work on the P.E. Tony.

I have seen a few of "Plasmo`s" vids on You Tube, quite enlightening indeed for mere mortals like me.

 

 

Question for you though.

You said that you would be using Alcad 2 primer, have you tried it out on any misprints just to check that there is no problems or reactions with the resin.

 

Stay safe.

 

Simon.

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Lovely etching job, Tony :clap: Glad to see you got the hang of it :thumbsup:

 

Nice spring pic too - it was like that during the week here too, then last night it snowed again on the nearby mountains.... :cold:

 

Ciao

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Great things happening here Tony.  I'm glad that several manurfactoreurs can see this here on bm.

Great etching skills now, just by trying and doing it. Chapeau!!

P.S.: Nice spring photo and the tree in the middle of the street here has decided that spring has to come now, although it is really cold overnight here at the moment Not quite convicing at all. Spring would be nice!

Cheers

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18 hours ago, TheBaron said:

By blind luck I chanced across a lightning sale of said item on the French Amazon site and so by Friday, Robbie the Post was panting up the drive with this shameful Amazonia in both hands and a quizzical look on his face.

 

Back in Scotland there's a little beastie called a green man 

(Roslyn Chapel was always one of my favorite days out.  I was always knocked out by that stonemasonry, and so many wondrous stories to take in)

 

There's one (very green man) over here in the States now too. Color me greenly greenly envious.

 

on the positive side

 

18 hours ago, TheBaron said:

Of course, just having worked out a series of layer height / exposure  time sweet spots on the previous version of the Mars, I've now got to go through it all again working out corresponding times for the new printer... :laugh:

 

... I'm sure you'll share the necessary information before I have to go through the same trauma.  I'm very partial to Lychees so will need to look into that alternative though I can't say I have experienced any of the issues you describe with Chitubox. 

 

Have to say though that your etching is rather fetching Tony.  I've always been tempted to try one of those ultra cheap CNC routers and see how it handles 5 thou' or 10 thou' brass sheet.  I know they are intended primarily for wood and plastic but with a slow enough travel they may just work cutting through thin brass sheet (can you tell I got really faffed off with the etching process)

 

Thon wing fold is going to be a masterpiece when it gets to its finished state.

 

 

 

 

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