Terry1954 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 If you mean the ones I've outlined, I enlarged as best I could and I would say canvas dodgers. I can just about make out the outline of the guard rail wires? It is a shame because reposting the enlarged picture on here, it comes out nowhere near as large as I see it in the raw. Suggest you click on image and see the enlarged version. May not be entirely helpful! Terry 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry1954 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Then my curiosity went further and search led to this picture, again enlarged.. I was curious regarding the area in red again (better outlined this time). Couldn't decide if that helps either way.......... Terry 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share Posted February 4, 2021 Terry, you’re seeing the same things as I am (you poor man - but in this instance that helps!); thanks. That second photo is hard to interpret with confidence, because I know from builders’ plans & the work I did a few months ago on the crash barrier that there was quite a lot of stuff under that pom-pom platform behind the island (“Phomene” fire suppressant generator, gas bottles for the Met balloon filling station, assorted sheaves for the barrier itself, lockers etc.), so it’s very hard to be sure exactly what you’re looking at across the deck in shadow. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share Posted February 4, 2021 This one (April 41) shows the pom-pom forward of the island definitely had blast shields round it - but you’d expect that. Those also look a good deal taller than the guardrails / dodgers / walls I’m talking about. Unless the steely-eyed WAFU in the background was extremely short. Others (also April 41) - though full of evocative &useful detail (for instance, it is interesting that there were still RAF maintainers mixed in with the matelots 18 months into the War and 2 years after Inskip handed Naval aviation back to the Navy) stop tantalisingly short at the edge, just missing what I’m looking for: 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 I don't understand why I keep being pulled into discussion here... 🤷♂️ I didn't do anything, I just like to see a well painted model, guv' .... or is it Captain, in this case? I know nothing of the details you are talking about, Crisp, but I do appreciate your meticulous attention to them - this is going to turn out great Once painted Alright, I'll get my Ciao 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iang Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 (edited) I think guardrails with canvas dodgers. The dodgers seem to start about half way along: I have a much higher res version, which shows the area more clearly. Edited February 4, 2021 by iang 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share Posted February 4, 2021 Superb! Thank you very much, Ian. As should be pretty familiar by now, a lot of the current workload is adding “busyness” to the ship - I am one of those people who finds a lot of ship models bland because there are too many areas of blank hull / deck, which are rare in real warships, where space is at a premium so tends to get used (yes, even in carriers there is never enough space). The down side of this is that it all takes a long time and sometimes you have days where a couple of hours’ work leaves little obvious difference. Of course it all adds up. Anyway... today I started painting the Night Life Buoys and their cages; just the copper balls to go (no photos). Then I continued working my way along the hull filling in little details like ladder rungs above & below the rectangular hatches (0.2mm NiAg rod) and more of the vent grilles (here visible either side of the 4.5” gun sponson on the right). I have no idea why those rectangular hatches (which opened) had ladder rungs below them - just that they did. Terry, I think it was you who asked about the winches (of which an example is visible in the hull bay centre right); North Star, with 3 or 4 different types in the set - tiny, but beautifully cast: More soon Crisp 20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry1954 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 It was indeed me, and looking at that shot above, I can see what you mean. They are superb. Also those ladder rungs above and below the hatches are exquisite touches of fine detail. Any model ship busy with such details is bound to take on a more realistic appearance. Nice job. Terry 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolarisPrime Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 (edited) 21 hours ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: Put it this way; if some kind critic stoops low over the finished model and says “I think you’ll find that her lower scuttles were plated over”, they might well be invited to investigate sex and travel Geez, how long have you been building models? This must be your first crack at it. 😜 If you took the actual ship from 1941 and used a shrink ray on the entire thing, some "expert" at Telford or IPMS would "stoop low" over your model and claim that your 507c was 3 shades too dark for a mid October Mediterranean afternoon. Actually most of the fellow modelers I have met at IPMS are great guys, but there is always one... Edited February 5, 2021 by PolarisPrime 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolarisPrime Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 On my build I just used the Tetra splinter shields for the area starboard of the superstructure. Both the Morskie and Kagero plans show splinter shields, however I am inclined to agree with the forming consensus that they are indeed canvas dodgers. In all the pictures everyone has posted they definitely have the look of canvas. In the picture @iang posted it looks like you can see a bit of the deck at the bottom of the canvas - meaning that the canvas starts a foot or so up on the railing. If it was a splinter shield there would not be a gap. The picture @Terry1954 posted also seems to show a little gap. Contrary to iang though, I think the canvas runs the entire length of the island. The demarcation half way along looks to me like a shadow across the canvas. You can see that the darker, forward portion of the railing obscures what is behind it so it can't just be a regular railing. There are a couple of nice pictures in Morskie that really look like canvas to me now that my mind is in that direction. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share Posted February 5, 2021 It looks as though the broad view confirms the way I was leaning anyway, which is towards dodgers. Thanks, everyone. That would also address one of the questions I had in my head, namely how the sounding machine (which the builders’ drawings show was fitted at the front of the island on the starboard side, just where we are talking about) - how that could have worked with steel splinter walls between it and the side of the ship. These machines (look at @foeth’s ridiculously beautiful Hood build for an example of one) involved a spar sticking out from the side of the ship and physical weights / wires going into the Oggin. The trouble is that now I have to build one (though even before I start I can exclusively reveal that it won’t look anything like as good as Evert-Jan’s!)! With steel I might have managed to convince myself that it had been removed, so left it out... [Nah. Who am I kidding?] By the way, without wishing to reignite this whole topic again, some interesting paint patching on the armoured belt in Ian’s photo (even allowing for exposure / computer reproduction of the picture)... 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iang Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 7 hours ago, PolarisPrime said: Contrary to iang though, I think the canvas runs the entire length of the island. The demarcation half way along looks to me like a shadow across the canvas. You can see that the darker, forward portion of the railing obscures what is behind it so it can't just be a regular railing. You are right, it does. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share Posted February 5, 2021 Oh I love it when a plan comes together. Postman just delivered some Master turned brass generic yardarms (Set No.2, if you know their output). Here one of the 60mm yards with the thinnest section at either end trimmed off by rolling on a hard surface under a new scalpel blade (which is how I cut all my brass tube, rod etc). Even better fit than I’d hoped. Now for the brackets, supports and fittings. This is about 35% longer than the ones Merit provide... C 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modelholic Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 Wouldn't brass rod with a constant diameter be better? The pics and diagrams posted previously don't show any taper from the middle towards the ends. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foeth Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 Usually booms (wood) were tapered and derricks (steel) not. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share Posted February 5, 2021 Tom, does the boom visible in this photo look to have a constant diameter to you? It certainly doesn’t to me... I’m also drawing on personal experience here; my first ships (Norfolk & Fearless) both used boat routines from booms more than once in my time on board, and as a junior Officer running the boats fell to me & my contemporaries; those booms were definitely not parallel sided, so I’m assuming the designs of 30 years earlier would be similar. The Master yards are too tapered for this purpose, but by using a yard that’s longer & taking off either end, that effect is reduced - once painted I think it will look convincing enough. Preliminary test with 0.2mm lead wire to give some visual interest with the assorted bands etc that are visible on Ark’s booms if you look closely. These are not yet tidied up - a dot of CA to pin the end, then carefully wrap round. Tomorrow I’ll tidy up and glue in place, but the concept works OK: More over weekend - weather forecast looks awful so might get some time at the bench Crisp 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolarisPrime Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: some interesting paint patching on the armoured belt in Ian’s photo Crisp, I think you are onto something here... Seems like pretty solid evidence that Ark Royal was briefly painted in Measure 32/11-RN Joint Admiralty/USN Never Ending Friendship camouflage - M32/11RNJAUSNNEF for short. But I am sure all you "experts" will tell me I'm full of it. 😏 Seriously though, it is interesting that it appears the newly painted areas reflect the sunlight much more than the older areas. I also think it shows how little time they had for regular maintenance. Bruce Edited February 5, 2021 by PolarisPrime 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 6, 2021 Author Share Posted February 6, 2021 Unexpectedly nice day here today, so got rather side-tracked with doing stuff to the garden... but I did finish tidying up the first boom, fettle & install its first support bracket (white styrene) and add the first of 12 (6 per side) davits overhead in the boat bays (visible on the right of shot). The BluTac is just to told the boom at the right angle while I measured & installed the bracket - now that I have a prototype, brackets for the other 3 booms will be easier. Next step is the boom hinge, which fits where the BluTac is! More tomorrow Crisp 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendie Posted February 6, 2021 Share Posted February 6, 2021 I haven't been able to visit this one for a few days but Wow! It was worth it for those updates. It's really coming together now. There was lots of boatspeak that went whoosh over my head but it gave me a few hours of staring at the picture trying to figure out which bits you were all talking about. I hope there isn't a quiz at the end cos I think I only got about 20% 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArnoldAmbrose Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 8 hours ago, hendie said: I hope there isn't a quiz at the end cos I think I only got about 20% Well done, improvements are always something to be proud of. Sorry, I couldn't help myself. This time I'll get my coat. That's a neat job with the boat boom, Crisp. Regards, Jeff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 7, 2021 Author Share Posted February 7, 2021 A few more additions before I settle down to watch the rugby... First up the Night Life Buoys painted up on their runner (with a spare); pleased with the Liquid Glass balls... Then the boom (starboard aft, this is), now glued in place with a brass hinge & styrene support at either end: seen from below for a change. I’m aware that I’ve studied this ship so much over recent months that it’s easy to forget that others might not know her so well... so here’s the area we’re dealing with: ...and here it is in styrene & brass, with the second of the davits fitted: Finally, this is the port side of the real ship, but the same area so very similar: More soon Crisp 21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 47 minutes ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: pleased with the Liquid Glass balls... It worked a treat! Getting closer and closer to the busy look of the real thing, as seen in your pics Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry1954 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 51 minutes ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: I’m aware that I’ve studied this ship so much over recent months that it’s easy to forget that others might not know her so well... so here’s the area we’re dealing with: Oooh look, actual naval aircraft, now your talking! Love the way that boom and the general detail has evolved on that starboard side. Top job. Terry 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courageous Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Superb work Crisp, those bays look really nice and busy. Stuart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 8, 2021 Author Share Posted February 8, 2021 Moved further aft today, sorting out the boat bay high up in the stern (I bet being lowered from that height in a boat was “interesting” in anything other than the flattest calm!), and fitting the platform for the starboard aft 44” searchlight I did other stuff, less visible, which will pay off tomorrow. In case any if you are wondering what the “sounding machine” I mentioned a couple of days ago was, I give you “Lord Kelvin’s Sounding Machine” from my father’s 1937 Admiralty Manual of Seamanship. About the same height as the guardrails, judging by that final diagram (which looks positively Victorian!). I think I have some spare PE gears etc that could do OK... [This was a device for measuring depth before the invention of the echo-sounder] More soon Crisp 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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