MattSimps74 Posted October 7, 2019 Author Share Posted October 7, 2019 Hi Troy - thanks for the white spirit heads up - I never realised that!! Would you say actual turps is the thing? Or can you only get turpentine substitute these days? Either way that’s another evocative childhood smell so it’s win-win! Yeah mums old oil tubes did resurface but the lids were welded on after 40 years of sitting in a drawer, so I bit the bullet and bought some new ones. They’ll see me out though (unless I turn into Isleworth’s answer to Bob Ross) Cheers, matt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPDPenguin Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 There are no mistakes here on BM, just happy little accidents. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 2 hours ago, MattSimps74 said: Would you say actual turps is the thing? Or can you only get turpentine substitute these days? Either way that’s another evocative childhood smell so it’s win-win! You can use white spirit, but turpetine has a very specific smell, it's a natural product, but probably quite expensive.... I can't be faffed to google it up at the moment, try in an art shop..though given the expense of modelling supplies it may not be too bad. Turpentine may affect the underlying paint/varnish, so test one something first.. There is turpetine substitute, and specially refined low odour white spirit. @Beardie uses oils, and maybe able to add more. But try lighter fuel, I was able to varnish over the oil wash I did with acrylic varnish in a day or two. And that is cheap! Lighter fuel is 'light petrol' a 6 carbon molecule, (hexane), petrol about 8 carbon, white spirit is about 15 carbon, for comparison, diesel is about 25-30 carbon, and tar 45-50... just so you can see the relationship between molecule size/weight and volatility.... 2 hours ago, MattSimps74 said: Yeah mums old oil tubes did resurface but the lids were welded on after 40 years of sitting in a drawer, there are ways to loosening them, heating the lids up with a lighter or dunking them in solvent are both ways to loosen up old caps, along with pliers after said treatments, used carefully so as not to tear the tubes... HTH T 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 I don't believe there is any advantage in using genuine Turpentine unless you like the smell and aren't allergic to it. I do like to use it myself but it can take a little longer to dry and can be a little 'tacky' if you don't give it plenty of time. It's a distillate from pine tree sap and I believe the 'tackiness' is a little of the pine resin in the mix. It does actually make the paint film a little more flexibles but on a hard plastic model that isn't really necessary. If you are allergic to Genuine Turpentine or don't like the smell and don't like the smell of Turps substitute/white spirit I would recommend an artists odourless thinner such as the 'own brand' of Jacksons Art Supplies which you can find here: https://www.jacksonsart.com/jackson-s-shellsol-t-odourless-solvent-by-road-parcel-only This solvent which has the trade name Shelsol T is just like White Spirit except it's a more refined version which is all but odourless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattSimps74 Posted October 8, 2019 Author Share Posted October 8, 2019 Great - I consider myself fully informed, thanks for the advice everyone, looking forward to getting going when the paints arrive. I’ll have a go with the odourless probably, to preserve my popularity with the family-but then won’t they miss out on white spirit nostalgia when they’re older? Thanks chaps, much apppreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 Fortunately, I have a dedicated ‘ man-cave ‘ so I don’t spray in the house, and can choose what I like. I’ve recently re-discovered cellulose thinner for use with Tamiya paints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaotic Mike Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 48 minutes ago, Biggles87 said: Fortunately, I have a dedicated ‘ man-cave ‘ so I don’t spray in the house, and can choose what I like. I’ve recently re-discovered cellulose thinner for use with Tamiya paints. Is that any better than the normal thinners? I'd have thought it would be smellier, and harder to clean, so what advantages do they bring, other than the opportunities for substance abuse and making a home flamethrower? 😁 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 I got the idea from @giemme and find it just as good as Tamiya’s thinner and have not had problems cleaning after it. Where it really helps is for brush painting, I’ve had problems in the past with that. The smell doesn’t bother me, I have a good mask and my sense of smell is not wonderful anyway, I do get comments from SWMBO occasionally. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaotic Mike Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 Well, I've never been able to brush paint Tamiya, so I'm interested if cellulose thinners makes them tractable. I find Revell AquaColour the most forgiving paint for brushing. They also spray well once massively diluted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 5 hours ago, Chaotic Mike said: Well, I've never been able to brush paint Tamiya, so I'm interested if cellulose thinners makes them tractable. the problem often mentioned brushing Tamiya is the paint lifting the the previously done done parts? Nick Millman recommended using Liquietex retarder, I'm guessing the cellulose thinners acts in the way i describe the lighter fuel, by being very volatile, the solvent flashes off really fast making the paint dry fast and not lift? Is this what you mean @Biggles87, or something else? Apologies for the thread drift @MattSimps74 but hope of interest. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedders Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 Top work on the spine transplant. And the paintwork & decals look great too. Justin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 22 hours ago, Troy Smith said: Is this what you mean @Biggles87, or something else? Apologies for the thread drift @MattSimps74 but hope of interest. Yes, that’s exactly what I mean. I use several well thinned coats and leave half a day at least between each. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Just stumbled across this one - lovely work. Did you ever get to the end if the build Matt? J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattSimps74 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 Hi Jason, I’m afraid it’s been absorbed into another overly ambitious mega-build! The Seafire 47 is forging ahead though, detailing the engine and sorting the canopy at the moment, although struggling to find the time at present. Rest assured I’ll post up when it’s nearer the finish line. The other builds are under ‘sigh for a griffon x3’ if you fancy a look (sorry can’t figure out to link to another build thread within a post yet - would anyone be able to tell me how it’s done? Cheers matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Ah, alright thanks. 24 minutes ago, MattSimps74 said: can’t figure out to link to another build thread within a post yet - would anyone be able to tell me how it’s done? Cheers You just need to copy/paste the address of the relevant post. The BM fairies will do the rest and create a snazzy link automatically. And lo... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattSimps74 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 Aha! Genius! Thanks Jason, I’ll post some pics soon cheers Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Jones Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Nice build , but just one small point, you appear to have an E wing armament with outer .303 guns. The outer wing guns should only appear with the C wing , they were not fitted to an E wing and therefore no red cover patches would be seen . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattSimps74 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 Sure, Andrew that what I reckoned too, but the Aviaeology sheet I took reference from suggested that while the guns weren’t present on these early E wings, the blast tubes were, and were patched over as if the 303’s had been present. Maybe some overlap at supermarine, or they had a load of C wing leading edges that needed using up?! Cheers, Matt 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Jones Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 A photo of RM818 appears in Ospreys " Griffon Spitfire Aces " book , the aircraft would seem not to have the red patches on the wing leading edges. I would be very dubious about taking a profile from a decal sheet instructions as gospel, without any confirming evidence . Indeed, the colour artwork in the Osprey book depicts nearly all the MKXIV's as having the red patches over the gun ports , when it is obvious that the majority of them do not carry them except for those with the C wing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob85 Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 (edited) On 10/10/2019 at 3:59 PM, Biggles87 said: Yes, that’s exactly what I mean. I use several well thinned coats and leave half a day at least between each. John Never use a retarder with Tamiya when brushing, if you thin them with water they dry well and quickly and can be polished after 24 hours. John is right take your time with them and you will get nice clean flat cotes. I only ever brush paint and only really use Tamiya paint for it, thinned with water, then polished very gently with fine micromesh (however picked up the very helpful tip lately of using and old t-shirt) and never have a problem. Can’t speak for cellulose thinner but @Biggles87and @giemme definitely know their stuff so worth a shot! spitfire is looking very nice Rob edit: should have finished reading all the posts! Sorry I’ll he’s off to look at the other build! Edited January 29, 2020 by rob85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wince Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 (edited) May I jump in as a painter (fine art) and say that white spirits is a paint destroyer but can be used for oil washes effectively if used sparingly. Avoid turpentine substitutes as they are just white spirits. I personally use lighter fluid (beware it dries very quickly!!!) and be prepared that it can leave a residue but that can be cleaned up easily. Pure Turpentine is an oil more than a solvent and, whilst can be used for washes, it can go tacky if you use too much. It was used by artists as a painting medium and is technically a resin. Too much it will go sticky! Use odourless thinners by winsor Newton (sansador) as not only is it odourless (faint scent) it doesn’t go gummy. For oil paints, raw and burnt umber are drying pigments with burnt and raw sienna being slower drying. Don’t believe the bs that you can varnish over oil after a day. Give the earth pigments a week to dry as regardless of if it is touch dry, oil paints dry by oxidisation not evaporation. If you use white spirits, don’t use too much as it will dilute the oil too much. Edited January 29, 2020 by Wince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattSimps74 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 That's fine Andrew. Truth be told I'm not really going to lose any sleep over it, but well done for pointing it out. I've found the Avieaology sheets to be meticulously researched, they pride themselves on their semi-obsessive approach and I would trust them to know their onions. If you have your reservations, that's cool. I don't have a huge amount of time for modelling, and I enjoy the research phase as much as the next man, but there comes a point when one must just crack on. I've too many stalled builds these days, and I'm resolved to get several posted up in RFI this year!! Many thanks gents, I'll post again when I've done some actual modelling TTFN 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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