Late Entry - by a Gnat's whisker..

[nimrod54]

9 hours ago, Hockeyboy76 said:

Tamiya Pink primer is an excellent primer if your going to paint yellow or orange. 

 

[alhenderson]

So, deadline day. I'm here to offer my apologies to the headmaster for the tardiness of my homework 😔 Still painting the orange bits. If it wasn't for the frankly abysmal quality of the Humbrol 209 I would probably be finished.

 

I'm going to sound like a broken record here, but it really is awful. Three coats now.  First one took almost two days to dry in the sitting cupboard, subsequent coats are a lot quicker for some reason. And whilst the colour is looking better, the coverage is dreadful. There are bits of silver that leaked through the masking which don't look like they're ever going to get covered properly.

 

Don't suppose anyone has any clever ideas that might improve the coverage of this stuff? I had a look the other day to see if I could find an alternative, but there didn't seem to be one.  Or am I doomed to be forever painting this thing, like some kind of wierd groundhog day?

 

Thanks,

Al

[Hockeyboy76]

I take it you did the basics, give it a good shake in the tin, then stir. Sometimes some of the paint separates and you get all the good gunk at the bottom. Sometimes it’s worth shaking, stirring then put the lid on and shaking again. You could also try a “solid orange” like Revell enamel 30 or Humbrol 18 first, then over coat when dry with the dayglo orange. 

[alhenderson]

53 minutes ago, Hockeyboy76 said:

I take it you did the basics, give it a good shake in the tin, then stir. Sometimes some of the paint separates and you get all the good gunk at the bottom. Sometimes it’s worth shaking, stirring then put the lid on and shaking again. You could also try a “solid orange” like Revell enamel 30 or Humbrol 18 first, then over coat when dry with the dayglo orange. 

It's certainly had a damn good stir with the end of the paintbrush. Haven't shaken it, mind.  Have seen people mention here that they've used screws and nails to stir with to make sure they get all the gunk out. Maybe I'll try that...

 

Thanks for the hints on the other orange, as well!

 

Al

[Hockeyboy76]

17 minutes ago, alhenderson said:

It's certainly had a damn good stir with the end of the paintbrush. Haven't shaken it, mind.  Have seen people mention here that they've used screws and nails to stir with to make sure they get all the gunk out. Maybe I'll try that...

 

Thanks for the hints on the other orange, as well!

 

Al

Happy to help. I use cocktail sticks, or parts of the plastic sprue to mix with. 

Some of the newer Humbrol paints aren’t that great and do suffer from “bits” in the paint. 

[alhenderson]

Latest update on the Fiery Orange Saga.  Nipped to Hobbycraft yesterday with the intention of getting some proper orange as suggested above.  Instead noticed that they had the acrylic version of Humbrol 209, so I thought I'd try that instead.  Being a cheapskate, I wasn't about to buy that *and* a backup orange.  Net result - the acrylic is no better than the enamel (well, actually I think it is *slightly* better, but not better enough to warrant continuing with it) so I now need to fork out for the petrol for another trip to Hobbycraft.  Joy.

 

If anyone needs a tin and a half (yep, I have used half a tin of this stuff on just this gnat!) of Humbrol Fiery Orange, I would be more than happy to see the back of it!!

Might get this finished for the end of the next trainers GB 🙂

 

Al.

[PLC1966]

On ‎6‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 11:59 AM, Hockeyboy76 said:

A hairdryer should help with the paint drying. 

The cheapest possible hairdryer does it for me

[PLC1966]

4 minutes ago, alhenderson said:

Latest update on the Fiery Orange Saga.  Nipped to Hobbycraft yesterday with the intention of getting some proper orange as suggested above.  Instead noticed that they had the acrylic version of Humbrol 209, so I thought I'd try that instead.  Being a cheapskate, I wasn't about to buy that *and* a backup orange.  Net result - the acrylic is no better than the enamel (well, actually I think it is *slightly* better, but not better enough to warrant continuing with it) so I now need to fork out for the petrol for another trip to Hobbycraft.  Joy.

 

If anyone needs a tin and a half (yep, I have used half a tin of this stuff on just this gnat!) of Humbrol Fiery Orange, I would be more than happy to see the back of it!!

 

As a brush painter, I have been playing around with both the Revell and Humbrol Acrylic and Enamel Dayglo Orange/Red. And my testing has proved they are all rubbish.  What has come up okay is the Vallejo Orange over a Vallejo or Games Workshop yellow.  There is an Orange in the Games Workshop Range that looks like Dayglo which would probably go well as well. 

[alhenderson]

7 minutes ago, PLC1966 said:

As a brush painter, I have been playing around with both the Revell and Humbrol Acrylic and Enamel Dayglo Orange/Red. And my testing has proved they are all rubbish.  What has come up okay is the Vallejo Orange over a Vallejo or Games Workshop yellow.  There is an Orange in the Games Workshop Range that looks like Dayglo which would probably go well as well. 

Thanks for that - glad its not just me!  I'm confused as to why these look OK when they are airbrushed, though.  I've never used an airbrush so don't really know the first thing about them, but I guess there's something in that process that makes it OK.  Maybe not having the paint 'pushed around' with the brush?  Experimenting with different paints is hardly a cheap option, either!

 

Al

[PLC1966]

18 minutes ago, alhenderson said:

Thanks for that - glad its not just me!  I'm confused as to why these look OK when they are airbrushed, though.  I've never used an airbrush so don't really know the first thing about them, but I guess there's something in that process that makes it OK.  Maybe not having the paint 'pushed around' with the brush?  Experimenting with different paints is hardly a cheap option, either!

 

Al

Hi Al,  I have the kit but have never Airbrushed,  But without trying to sound like I am talking down to you, it's just the way it is !!   

Wait till you get to Natural Metal Finish for Brush Painting.  😫

[alhenderson]

Nipped out at lunchtime and bought a tin of acrylic Humbrol 18 orange.  Got to be honest, coverage of that isn't much better than the flourescent orange 😞

 

IMG_20190613_212111 by Alistair Henderson, on Flickr

 

Nearest wing is the normal orange, furthest wing is the acrylic flourescent orange. Can still see the silver that leaked through the tape that I used to mask off the orange areas. That's *five* coats of paint on there!! I'm done buying new paint for this, and I'll think twice before buying any more Humbrol! Can't believe how bad it's been!  

 

Touch and go whether this thing even gets finished at the moment!

 

Al

[Hockeyboy76]

Ouch. I’m not sure what else to suggest here Al. Don’t want to give you some crap motivational sayings like “Everdays a school day”, But rest assured it’s not happening to just you or Humbrol paints. I’m using Mig Ammo Acrylic RAF colour set for my Harrier in the Sharkmouth GB. The green thinned beautifully and went on like a dream, the grey, I just can’t get to grips with. Thins awfully, brushes the same, brushing direct from bottle gives same results. 

[Army_Air_Force]

I used Humbrol 209 on my Broussard. I gave it a white under coat first then sprayed multiple very thin coats, baking each coat in my curing cabinet. I think with 209, spraying is the only way to go to get very thin coats on. The paint itself was stirred with my mini drill. I have an old Humbrol paint lid with a small hole in the top. A piece of 1mm wire extends through the hole and has a Z bend in the end to mix the paint. The other end goes in my mini drill at a slowish speed, but it mixes the paint very will. Sometimes I need to hold some tissue around the tin lid hole to stop the spinning paint from being drawn up the shaft towards the drill. The drill and tin need to be held firmly unless you want to decorate the whole room.

My curing cabinet was a very cheap but worth while addition to my workshop. It is an old set of plastic storage drawers in a wooden carcase. I added a shelf and lined the space with foam backed insulating foil. A 60watt light bulb is mounted in the top and quickly brings the temperature to around 27 degrees C. All my resin and paint work goes in there now to bake and it's amazing how quick paints will cure fully in "oven" conditions. See below for the paint finish and curing cabinet.

 

 

 

The curing cabinet, door open.
 

Edited June 14, 2019 by Army_Air_Force

[alhenderson]

2 hours ago, Hockeyboy76 said:

Ouch. I’m not sure what else to suggest here Al. Don’t want to give you some crap motivational sayings like “Everdays a school day”, But rest assured it’s not happening to just you or Humbrol paints. I’m using Mig Ammo Acrylic RAF colour set for my Harrier in the Sharkmouth GB. The green thinned beautifully and went on like a dream, the grey, I just can’t get to grips with. Thins awfully, brushes the same, brushing direct from bottle gives same results. 

Glad to hear it's not just me, although that's not good news for you 😔 the orange undercoat may have helped, it's certainly covered the silver, noe I've just got to cover that with the 209 🤔

 

The orange bits of this gnat are going to be significantly thicker than the rest of it!

[alhenderson]

37 minutes ago, Army_Air_Force said:

I used Humbrol 209 on my Broussard. I gave it a white under coat first then sprayed multiple very thin coats, baking each coat in my curing cabinet. I think with 209, spraying is the only way to go to get very thin coats on. The paint itself was stirred with my mini drill. I have an old Humbrol paint lid with a small hole in the top. A piece of 1mm wire extends through the hole and has a Z bend in the end to mix the paint. The other end goes in my mini drill at a slowish speed, but it mixes the paint very will. Sometimes I need to hold some tissue around the tin lid hole to stop the spinning paint from being drawn up the shaft towards the drill. The drill and tin need to be held firmly unless you want to decorate the whole room.

My curing cabinet was a very cheap but worth while addition to my workshop. It is an old set of plastic storage drawers in a wooden carcase. I added a shelf and lined the space with foam backed insulating foil. A 60watt light bulb is mounted in the top and quickly brings the temperature to around 27 degrees C. All my resin and paint work goes in there now to bake and it's amazing how quick paints will cure fully in "oven" conditions. See below for the paint finish and curing cabinet.

 

 

 

The curing cabinet, door open.
 

That's a lovely looking Broussard! I think what you've proven is that the right tools for the job are vital. At this point, I'd have trouble justifying an airbrush, never mind a curing cabinet! 😁

 

Al

[alhenderson]

Out of sheer frustration I had a moan on the Humbrol website about these paints, expecting to be completely ignored.  After a bit of back and forth, I received the following today:

 

Dear Sir.

The Enamel paint that you have used is from a batch made in 2014 

the acrylic was old china paint.

what i will arrange is to palce some new pots in the post for your use

 

regards

 

I sent them the tracking numbers from the bottom of the pots.  My initial thought was to go back and say there's no point sending me any more because I'm fed up of the stuff (and the idea of undercoating with regular orange has given me an improvement).  But I am curious to see if the new paint they send me is any better..   

 

Al.

[Hockeyboy76]

3 hours ago, alhenderson said:

Out of sheer frustration I had a moan on the Humbrol website about these paints, expecting to be completely ignored.  After a bit of back and forth, I received the following today:

 

Dear Sir.

The Enamel paint that you have used is from a batch made in 2014 

the acrylic was old china paint.

what i will arrange is to palce some new pots in the post for your use

 

regards

 

I sent them the tracking numbers from the bottom of the pots.  My initial thought was to go back and say there's no point sending me any more because I'm fed up of the stuff (and the idea of undercoating with regular orange has given me an improvement).  But I am curious to see if the new paint they send me is any better..   

 

Al.

Nice one Al. I’m still waiting on a reply about missing Harrier decals. I hope the new paints are better. 

[Colin W]

Well the plot ( if not the paint ) thickens. Rumour was that Humbrol were so fed up with poor quality from China they moved production back to the UK. This is perhaps the first indication what those issues might be. 

Please check out the replacement paint and post your thoughts on here. 

 

Colin 

[alhenderson]

29 minutes ago, Colin W said:

Well the plot ( if not the paint ) thickens. Rumour was that Humbrol were so fed up with poor quality from China they moved production back to the UK. This is perhaps the first indication what those issues might be. 

Please check out the replacement paint and post your thoughts on here. 

 

Colin 

I certainly will post my thoughts,  I have deliberately not finished off the dayglo orange so I can try the new paint.  Paint was supposed to be in the post by the end of the week, so hopefully will turn up in the next few days...  Hopefully it will indeed have thickened..

 

Al.

[alhenderson]

Finally got the replacement paint from Humbrol this morning.  Not one tin, but 4!! 2 each of the acrylic and enamel.  Slight overkill for the dayglo panels on a gnat!

 

 

Have put on one coat of the acrylic, we'll see what happens.  Didn't seem too different at first glance 😞

 

Al.

[alhenderson]

In case anyone is still reading this forum...  Having tried the new paints that humbrol sent me, they seem to be no better than the originals I had bought.  I have now given up trying to get a decent coverage of orange - it's had upwards of 10 coats by now.  It looks awful, but time to move on.  The Gnat was only meant to get me back into the game so I'm not going to obsess over it.

 

Have learned one other useful lesson this week - don't put turps on a canopy 😞

 

Al.