1/48 - Lockheed (C)F-104C/G/J/S-ASA/M & TF-104G/DJ Starfighter by Kinetic - released - new Hypersonic Models F-104B/D conv. set - new CF-104D boxing in 2024

[Filler]

Quote

 

9 hours ago, Stephen said:

Released.

 

https://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=KI-K48093

 

 

Fantastic. Any idea typically how far behind UK sellers are with their stock?

[exdraken]

6 minutes ago, Filler said:

 

Fantastic. Any idea typically how far behind UK sellers are with their stock?

Generally a month or two.

Typical sea voyage plus logistic in origin and destination. Lately container travelling time and cost have gone up...

Air mail is considerably faster, but for small volumes only of course

 

[Mike Esposito]

Jesus....20 usd to ship? 😯

Edited May 8, 2021 by Mike Esposito

[Stephen]

I received mine today, it looks very nice in the box. Still no centreline pylon though.

[franky boy]

17 hours ago, Stephen said:

I received mine today, it looks very nice in the box. Still no centreline pylon though.

That’s a bit of a miss on Kinetics part!
 

I built an Italian G recently and used the pylon from the Daco set for the Hasegawa kit. It just needs the gap underneath filling with some plastic card as it doesn’t quite cover the gap. Still a pain if you don’t have that set though. 
 

James 

[Stephen]

21 hours ago, franky boy said:

That’s a bit of a miss on Kinetics part!
 

I built an Italian G recently and used the pylon from the Daco set for the Hasegawa kit. It just needs the gap underneath filling with some plastic card as it doesn’t quite cover the gap. Still a pain if you don’t have that set though. 
 

James 

I've emailed Quickboost and suggested an F-104 centreline pylon in 1/48.  I would like to encourage others to do likewise.

[Ranger626]

I received my kit today.    Looks great.    And there is a centerline pylon included:   its part F11 on the new sprue.   Looks like it fits into the recess on part B6 on the ventral centerline (that recess was covered by part PE1 in all previous versions and also in this kit.    This, combined with the inclusion of a B57 nuke on this kit's F sprue makes me think a strike version F-104 G is in the pipeline. Hope they include the Italian version Orpheus pod in a future release.    I really like these Kinetic F-104 kits and hope they keep coming!

[Mike Esposito]

Are you referring to the 104S?

[Ranger626]

Yes, the new Kinetic 1/48   F-104G/S   kit 48093.

[Stephen]

17 hours ago, Ranger626 said:

I received my kit today.    Looks great.    And there is a centerline pylon included:   its part F11 on the new sprue.   Looks like it fits into the recess on part B6 on the ventral centerline (that recess was covered by part PE1 in all previous versions and also in this kit.    This, combined with the inclusion of a B57 nuke on this kit's F sprue makes me think a strike version F-104 G is in the pipeline. Hope they include the Italian version Orpheus pod in a future release.    I really like these Kinetic F-104 kits and hope they keep coming!

Happy to be corrected, I did just look at the instructions without looking at the sprues.

[Homebee]

New variant - ref. K48096 - Lockheed F-104C Starfighter

Source: https://www.facebook.com/Kineticmodel/posts/1889719344528501

Box art

 

Quote

48096 - 1/48 F-104C USAF

Owing to the total rework on the G91, we will push up the F-104C USAF to replace the original release schedule. Estimate release in Sept 2021

 

 

V.P.

[SAT69]

I'm building the Hasegawa 1/48 F-104C now but the Kinetic kit really appeals to me. Looking forward to its release.

[Masinissa]

Wow! A Kinetic F-104C. Even though I have the Hasegawa kit with the DACO aftermarket that corrects the shape and the potholes in the Hasegawa kit's wings,

I'll be getting one of these. 

 

Doesn't Kinetic use Cartograf to make their decals?🤔

[Stephen]

40 minutes ago, Masinissa said:

Wow! A Kinetic F-104C. Even though I have the Hasegawa kit with the DACO aftermarket that corrects the shape and the potholes in the Hasegawa kit's wings,

I'll be getting one of these. 

 

Doesn't Kinetic use Cartograf to make their decals?🤔

 Yes.

[franky boy]

Nice box art!

 

One for me please. 

[Mike Esposito]

Did the C have the larger vertical tail surface? 

[SAT69]

14 minutes ago, Mike Esposito said:

Did the C have the larger vertical tail surface? 

It had the same vertical tail surface as the F-104A.

[Mike Esposito]

Cool! Now I may have to buy the A! 😂

[Tiger331]

Slightly bemused while reading about all of the fretting over the accuracy (or otherwise) with the 'new' Kinetic F-104G/S issue. Based on personal experience, you can be sure that Kinetic are one of the better companies when it comes to seeking out or taking advice from SMEs during the project development phase. Granted, they do not always get it 100% right but, in general, they take on board a fair amount and then balance this with affordability etc during the production process. I had every confidence that they would get most of the F-104S idiosyncrasies right given that they also had a major hand in the production of the DACO Productions correction/update set for the Hasegawa F-104 Starfighter family and many of us know how fastidious Danny Coremans is when it comes to the accuracy. 

 

I also have little doubt we will see more boxings of the Kinetic F-104 to cater for some of the special-to-type equipment fitted to Canadian and Dutch F-104s to name but two.      

[Thomas V.]

What does affordability have to do with accuracy? There is a long list of Kinetic doing it wrong, thankfully their F-104 is truely Gold standard, unlike some other of their kits that claim/ wear that title, given complexity of F-104 everyone sceptical has every right to be sceptical about, not easy to capture all the differencies.

[Tiger331]

On 6/6/2021 at 7:09 PM, Thomas V. said:

What does affordability have to do with accuracy? There is a long list of Kinetic doing it wrong, thankfully their F-104 is truely Gold standard, unlike some other of their kits that claim/ wear that title, given complexity of F-104 everyone sceptical has every right to be sceptical about, not easy to capture all the differencies.

 

Quite a lot actually, my friend. It's a reference to that determination between absolute accuracy and the affordability of a particular project. In my many years of working in the industry, I have seen individuals (manufacturers (big and small)) that have become so obsessed with accuracy for the few that they have missed the boat in catering for the vast majority. There is no point striving for absolute accuracy over many years if another manufacturer comes along and produces a 95% solution....this will satisfy all but the most fastidious of rivet counters (in other words the 'If it looks right, it probably is right and I'm happy with that' brigade who probably make up most of those interested in a particular subject) and leave that manufacturer striving for the 99-100% solution, blowing around in the wind. Like I also said (if you care to read the post more carefully) Kinetic do not always get it right but they are better than many of the others out there that have quite simply ignored friendly and helpful advice, even when it is so painfully obvious that their project development simply does not look right.    

[Thomas V.]

3 hours ago, Tiger331 said:

 

Quite a lot actually, my friend. It's a reference to that determination between absolute accuracy and the affordability of a particular project. In my many years of working in the industry, I have seen individuals (manufacturers (big and small)) that have become so obsessed with accuracy for the few that they have missed the boat in catering for the vast majority. There is no point striving for absolute accuracy over many years if another manufacturer comes along and produces a 95% solution....this will satisfy all but the most fastidious of rivet counters (in other words the 'If it looks right, it probably is right and I'm happy with that' brigade who probably make up most of those interested in a particular subject) and leave that manufacturer striving for the 99-100% solution, blowing around in the wind. Like I also said (if you care to read the post more carefully) Kinetic do not always get it right but they are better than many of the others out there that have quite simply ignored friendly and helpful advice, even when it is so painfully obvious that their project development simply does not look right.    

At least in my text there is no mention of so called absolute accuracy, mentioned does not exist in real life, nothing is 100%. Affordability and accuracy are not 

contradictory terms ( when speaking about shapes and sizes ), whether certain machine drills, mills a block of  future tooling right or wrong ( accurate or inaccurate ) costs 

the same. So..those obsessed with accuracy are missing the boat catering for vast majority ( that you feel comfortable speaking for ), how exactly would that be? ...missing the boat by producing more accurate product? 

I will stick with airplane modelling, where a panel, rivet pattern, windscreen frame can make difference between subtypes, that is the level of accuracy one must strive to achieve,

below that better not be in this business, and that is not absolute accuracy (that does not exist) but accuracy.

There are plenty of people who view this hobby far too seriously ( unfortunately that can also be a euphemism ) , but regarding condescending and derogatory term rivet counter for a normal person that strives for more accurate product ( as accuracy is paramount in scale modelling, that we hopefully can agree on ) is beyond comprehension, given that rivet counting designers are behind of what best of 2021 has to offer- literally.

As for Kinetic- agreed, they truly know to listen unlike some others, but are also prone to host of inaccuracies that are well. well below that 95%, so being amused by modellers rightfully being sceptical about certain details that make certain subtype, is in my view not amusing.

It is ( again in my view ) among other similar posts by the few-poorly masked agenda usually mystifying model kit production processes for purpose of either pushing sub standard products ( eg.Zvezda Mi-24 recently ), certain brands or validating sharp rise of kit prices ( mostly by new brands ), again both is legal and legitimate, but so is replying to such I would say not so benign and hobbyesque spirit and action.

[Tiger331]

Stepping out of this conversation since a). I have neither the time nor inclination to explain further and b). my points are clearly not well understood. ho hum.

[Mick_Gannon]

On 3/3/2021 at 3:20 PM, Homebee said:

Yessss. Thanks Stephen

- ref. K48093 - Lockheed/Fiat F-104S Starfighter 

https://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=KI-K48093

 

I don't wanna be unpleasant but the currently proposed box art (see herebelow) clearly displays a 132° Gruppo /3° Stormo aircraft, a tactical reconnaissance unit that never operated the F-104S variant but the RF-104G. See also in this artwork the R/F-104G single aft fuselage strake. So why the Sparrow missiles that only equipped the F-104S from the interception units?

By the way the F-104S "Spilone" in its pure interceptor sub-variant - or CI for Caccia Intercettore - had not only a distinctive double aft fuselage strake but also no cannon muzzle as the gun was removed to make room for the Sparrow avionics. Also to be noted the F-104S had larger air intakes inspection doors and a different engine nozzle.

Even with the best will in the world you don't transform a top F-104G kit into a F-104S one just providing a pair of Sparrow missiles.

So I don't expect a genuine F-104S kit but instead just a rebox from the G variant with AMI decals.    

 

 

V.P.

I am always amazed that people assume that the variant is going to be wrong before anybody has seen the plastic parts, I could understand all of the statements made that had they seen the new kit in the flesh, as it were, but by looking at the box art and making such statements means nothing to the potenial modeller, in fact is talking for the sake of talking based on nothing just MHO

 

Edited June 24, 2021 by Mick_Gannon

[redracer]

Referencing Tiger331 about accuracy.  There was a certain manufacture in California who was going to produce a kit of a 1/32 Spirit of St Louis or Ryan Special.  Design work was finished and moulds were cut, test shots produced, corrections made, more test shots.  I have seen the build up and it was absolutely stunning.  This was 15 years ago.  Have you ever seen the kit on the market?  No, because the manufacture was so intent on absolute accuracy that the tool maker said no more at some point and all money was lost.  So doing a kit with a balance between accuracy and affordability is just good business.  Raymond's F-104's are a good case in point.  Perfect?  No, but very accurate and they are affordable.