Miles Master In Three Flavours, F340, Two finished, one for another day

[AdrianMF]

24 minutes ago, smellybeard said:

Frog Master is a nasty pile of misshapen unmentionable

I have been comparing it to both plans and the Pegasus Master 1 kit (see Trainers GB for the fun on that one!) and I'm aware that the cockpit and canopy are much wider than they should be, amongst other errors. However, I have deliberately ignored that aspect and I'm going to concentrate on fixing the fuselage profile and thinning the tail surfaces a bit so they don't look like planks. Also, trying to narrow down the front fuselage would play havoc with the beautiful fit of the wings to the fuselage. I can forgive a lot of the shape errors because it's a beautifully fitting kit, the outlines and profiles are pretty good (bar the rear fuselage) and the wideness of the cockpit area hasn't jumped out at me as a glaring error when I've been browsing through internet images and comparing them to the model.

 

I'm happy that it will look like a Master to me when it's done, and I appreciate the background information on the width error. Sadly you have been cursed with too much knowledge - I have been there with the Airfix IL-2 and the Frog Beaufort, which both turned into very long and torturous builds because I decided to try to fix everything!

 

Regards,

Adrian

[smellybeard]

50 minutes ago, AdrianMF said:

Sadly you have been cursed with too much knowledge

...and it will never go away or be forgiven. 

 

The Master I, II and Martinet interest me and the swoop of the standard Bristol Mercury power egg into the wing fillet and straight-sided cockpit area will torment you when get there. The Master III was ugly and dumpy before Frog got to it and that's perhaps why you haven't got the smellybeard frown yet.

 

Miles aircraft were largely designed with single curvature plywood surfaces and contributes to the look and character of them. In many cases plastic model designers tend to think of aeroplanes as all having complex curvy surfaces (and never having nasty undercuts in wing fillets).

[AdrianMF]

Sadly I'm away from home (third week away out of the last four) but when I get home I will take a look at the plastic and compare it to pictures of the real thing to see if a bit of creative sanding can't improve it.

 

Regards,

Adrian

[smellybeard]

I don't want to put you off but I want you to be happy when you do see it.

My latest plan is to saw the bulk of fuselage away from the wing root area, print bulkheads for the cockpit area and squish in the sides to meet them. With just two flat sides to the fuselage there won't be a lot of force involved so there's little risk of distortion later. The wing-root area can be reenforced and the wings constructed as a unit and added after.  I don't plan on completing any as Mk.III, so matching up with the original cowling will never be an issue. A new canopy will be part of the deal, however.

[smellybeard]

 

[Rabbit Leader]

Sounds like you might like to join us with a ‘Master’ Master build there @smellybeard?? C’mon, let’s see your words interpreted in photographs, it’ll really help the rest of us out who have or are planning to build one of these in the future.

 

Cheers and thanks for your comments.. Dave

[smellybeard]

I'm absolutely up to my roundels in a 1946 Velocette MAC and an NSU Supermax that have to be roadworthy by the end of September and I already have a wet-day project of an old Airfix Beaufighter running.

Edited July 18, 2019 by smellybeard

[Rabbit Leader]

35 minutes ago, smellybeard said:

I'm absolutely up to my roundels in a 1946 Velocette MAC and an NSU Supermax that have to be roadworthy by the end of September and I already have a wet-day project of an old Airfix Beaufighter running.

Besides the line about the Beaufighter, I have no idea what you’re talking about!! Ok... looks like your busy then, fair enough. 

 

Cheers.. Dave 

[AdrianMF]

Well, I’m back at the bench. I have a whole month and a half without travel ahead of me, so I’m looking forward to some quality model time!

 

So the two Masters are proceeding more or less in parallel:

 

You can see how clear the Falcon canopy is, and you can also see I messed up the FROG canopy windscreen removing it from the sprue, so I cut it out and will replace it. I’m also going to have the instructor’s canopy open, which solves the problem of the weird step in the FROG canopy.

 

Having been told that the Master is too bloated, I’ve had a look and I think I see the issue. I will sand the rear fuselage to thin it and square off the cross-section after I’ve reshaped the profile. I’m going to leave the front half alone because it all fits and I want to have some fun!

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[AdrianMF]

So, what’s this on the bench? Jellyfish??

 

It’s an Oyumaru mould of a FROG Blenheim Mercury engine to go inside my SBS cowling for the MkII and Martinet:

 

Time to get the Milliput out!

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

 

[JOCKNEY]

Hi @smellybeard

I couldn't help but notice you haven't got a Build in this GB, what can we put you down for ?

cheers Pat

[AdrianMF]

Cockpits are done:

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[Rabbit Leader]

Don’t tell me those belts are ‘scratch’ as well? They look amazing! Now you have a spare 1.5 months you say Adrian? ... let me see what’s missing and I’ll do up a quick list of Frog kits that could benefit with that Adrian ‘Midas touch’!! 

 

Cheers.. Dave 

[AdrianMF]

1 hour ago, Rabbit Leader said:

spare 1.5 months

Well, there’s this office I have to go to...

 

But seriously, I’m aiming to finish these three, I want to build my Mosquito as a PR  version using spare decals from my Tamiya boxing and I’ve got a really spawn-of-Satan Whitley that I couldn’t resist for a fiver - I know Tony’s doing one as an ID model but I’d like to see how well I could scrub it up.

 

PS: the belts aren’t ‘scratch’. They are provided free with a bottle of wine, all you have to do is cut a strip off!

 

Regards,

Adrian

[stevehnz]

27 minutes ago, AdrianMF said:

I’ve got a really spawn-of-Satan Whitley that I couldn’t resist for a fiver

Awesome, another tutorial for one I've got.

Steve.

[AdrianMF]

Well that’s not bad for a first attempt!

I didn’t pack enough Milliput into the gear case to start up, but all the cylinders have come out fine. Time for some more to make another cast and repair the hole in the first one.

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[AdrianMF]

... just realised that the Mercury rotates in the opposite direction to the Wasp. So I will have to cut off and reverse the blades. Not a biggie seeing as how the FROG Master blades are quite thick and not particularly aerodynamic in either direction.

[AdrianMF]

I have done another couple of mouldings and I think I’ve got my two engines:

The first one on the left has had the gear case repaired with a dab of Milliput when I moulded the second one, but the ring of bolts is quite non-planar, probably because I demoulded it too soon and distorted it when cutting off the flash between the cylinders.

 

The second one (middle) has had its gear case repaired and will be okay after a sanding.

 

For the third one I pushed small bits of Milliput right down into the end of the gear case before adding the rest, and it has come out complete.

 

The SBS cowling puts my moulding to shame but you won’t see much of the engine when it’s painted black and in the cowling. I need to repair the front of the cowling where my ham fisted sawing took off a bit of the front rim.

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[AdrianMF]

I’ve been taking on board the issues raised by the gentleman with the fragrant facial hair. 

 

On the left, the fuselage as reconstructed to get the correct profile taper with a slathering of filler, and on the right, sanded down to what I hope is a better cross section:

 

Looking at the pencil lines, the original fuselage on the left is curved in cross section. On the right fuselage I have sanded the lower portion to be flatter and vertical, and the upper portion to be flatter and slanted, so there’s a noticeable  change in direction where the white filler is. This all makes the rear fuselage a tad narrower:

 

So I think this addresses some of the issues and makes it look a bit more like the real thing.

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[AdrianMF]

The canopy with the botched and excised windscreen has got a new one:

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[smellybeard]

I think this illustrates the sections quite well...

 

[bigbadbadge]

Hi Adrian, the cockpits look absolutely fantastic, great work.  Wow miliput engines, that is amazing, is this some kind of saucery???

Great stuff Adrian gonna have to try and get some of the mould material and have a go at some moulding myself.

Keep up the good work

All the best

Chris

[AdrianMF]

Thanks Chris. Ebay is yer friend for Oyumaru.

 

For the engine mould I dropped a big piece into boiling water and then squished it over the engine. I was surprised how far around the cylinders it got, and how far down the propeller shaft hole. I even had to cut some away to get the original out! Previously I’ve only used it for fairly flat items like 1:1 decorative mouldings for a mirror frame and wheel hubs.

 

Regards,

Adrian

[AdrianMF]

I’ve taken a break from battling the heat and a dose of summer man flu to scribe some trim tabs and flaps, and to make some wingtip nav lights from left over clear sprue:

 

Thanks for looking,

Adrian

[Johnson]

Being (relatively) new, I'm still playing catch up on the FROG GB builds. I'm torn between spending time reading these great threads - and actually getting on with my own model! I'm also intrigued by the Oyumaru mould which I may have to investigate (once I've got to grips with the home made decals!).

 

Anyway, just to say this is a great thread, the cockpits and attention to detail is stunning.

 

Cheers!