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Matave

Mosquito markings

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What colours are the chaff mission markings?

 

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Given the difficulty of interpretating colours from black and white photos it is difficult to tell and not knowing anything about the individual aircraft (serial or squadron) does not help. 

Having said that, it is obviously a light colour and my guess would be yellow as it would compromise camouflage less. 

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Allright, let's say it like this. I don't want any guesses or assuptions. I want those who really know to tell the colours. Therefore I didn't put any other data out now. It will come later on...

The Mossie version is in the picture by the way...😉

 

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55 minutes ago, Matave said:

I want those who really know to tell the colours.

It is doubtful that anybody does have a definitive answer to this, the response from @Mr Twhich you seemed happy to discard quite abruptly, is likely to be typical of what anyone can come up with. I'll be happy to be proven wrong though. Watching with interest.

Steve.

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Maybe it sounds a bit harsh I admit, but there are too many people who use the simple solution and just assume about a subject instead of doing research in the archives. Aspecially when it comes to colours and markings. The answer, I'm sure, is to be find in the archives. There are a lot of people, who search the archives. They deserve all the credit they can get. It's a heavy job!

There are also people who finds the answer in books and magazines. That is excellent if it's possible to trace the information source.

You all know this. There are too much fake or false information on the Internet. What one writes on the Internet becomes the truth tomorrow and that is something everyone should avoid.

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Whilst I agree with you in principle, I feel that you are very unlikely to find information about the colour of individual markings in any official archive.  These can be incomplete even with regard to what should be there - or what was there once but no longer exists.  Therefore a somewhat less dismissive approach will be welcomed when people to attempt to help.

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Posted (edited)

I am sorry that you did not like my attempt to help you. Although I have been acquiring books, magazines etc. since the age of 14 in 1968, I had not, looking through my stuff, come across this particular bit of nose art. That is why I asked about the serial or any other information about the Mosquito bomber with the two stage Merlins shown. Steve and Graham are right, mission markings and nose art tend not to be preserved in official archives, along with much else.  The only markings apart from serial and squadron codes that seem to have been 'officially' sanctioned were some markings of aircraft flown squadrons made up of exiled pilots (e.g. small flags of the occupied country), rank pennants for senior officers and markings on presentation aircraft and a complete list of those is unlikely to exist. As with all the belligerent nations in the Second World War, British censorship and strict rules on photography were in place and it is amazing that so many personal photos have survived. Unfortunately, but understandably, they often do not have detailed information as to colours and markings on them and so people end up making informed guesses. this is not ideal, but it is what happens.

Edited by Mr T

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Matave, if you don't like the information that has been provided here and feel you can be so rudely dismissive to those forum members, I suggest you get off your backside and do your own damned research! Your attitude is extremely suckish!

 

 

Chris

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Matave,

 

You're in Sweden - may I guess that this aircraft is also in Sweden?  If so, I suspect we're looking at the 25th Bomb Group Mosquito that landed there in April 1945.  Again, if this is so, the unit histories and known photo will not be of much help with the mission marking colors - and I've been looking at that unit since the early 1970s.  I suspect you'll have to work with your own best estimate.

 

Cheers,

 

 

Dana

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That is an airplane that was in service 75 years ago.  Do you really think there is someone out here who was there and saw it for themselves?  If you don’t have a color photograph or an eyewitness who was there that proves what color it was, there is literally no way to know something in 2019 that happened in 1944.  What you’re asking is completely unrealistic.  

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For the avoidance of doubt, certainly for the UK archives, I would reiterate what Graham said above and can confidently state from long experience that not all of the answers are to be found there.   The archives consist of those official documents that have been deemed worthy of preservation: ergo, some documents have been destroyed and disposed of.  But that is not the only hurdle, the document must also record the information that is being sought and furthermore record it accurately.  Neither is always the case.

In the case of colour schemes, it is pretty much established that standards for colours, schemes and code/serial fonts were on the whole set out.  I don't need to pose the question as to whether they were adhered to in every case, so the archive material may not be the definitive answer.

With respect to personal markings, these were non-official, so unlikely to be officially recorded anyway.  Being personal non-official markings, pictures tend to turn up only as personal photographs surface, be it in a book or from a relative etc.  IF and again, a huge if, these have not been lost or discarded in the three quarters of a century that has elapsed since they were taken, they are near to exclusively black and white with all of the vagaries of storage, processing and film type.  

Personal markings tended to be painted with whatever paint came to hand.  Often this was stock standard paint.  Occasionally, and often the case with a particularly talented artist, they might source some extra material from somewhere.

We are very lucky that comparatively so much of the 8th and 9th USAAF was recorded in colour, but so much wasn't.

 

I fear that that black and white image is all that you can ever find, and even that is very fortunate to exist when so many aircraft were never recorded in any kind of photograph.

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On 5/19/2019 at 12:39 AM, Mr T said:

Given the difficulty of interpretating colours from black and white photos it is difficult to tell and not knowing anything about the individual aircraft (serial or squadron) does not help. 

Having said that, it is obviously a light colour and my guess would be yellow as it would compromise camouflage less. 

WOW, I'd say that response was a little harsh......... with that, I would guess you may have lit a fire or two, and may not get the information you are 'demanding'.......... I do understand and get that you would like to obtain accurate information, and I agree that there is a mountain of garbage on the internet, but I for one have found the guys and gals here MOST helpful and very friendly, but blasting back because someone gave you an educated guess, may not be the best road traveled..... for what it's worth, and I guess it won't be worth much, but I would say the markings are yellow as well, if one takes the photo and compares the 'color' to other B&W photos of a known color, like a roundel, maybe it could be compared for a fairly accurate guess, and as Jordi mentions, he is right about the a/c being in service 75 years ago...... most if not all of us know some of the information is a best guess at best.... even IF some of the guys who flew the aforementioned a/c they may not even remember themselves, my 97 year old dad is sharp, but is fuzzy on his RCAF squadron aircraft from back in the day.................... so maybe a little honey instead of vinegar, might garner you more information and a good positive dialog........................ just a random thought to ponder...................

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Posted (edited)

If you shake a tree you will see what's falling down. I'm not surprised of your different kind of response. And you are right in many ways.

Yellow colour is a qualified guess... but...

 

Let's get down to the brass tacks.

 

Dana: You're quite right. You and I did discuss this particular aircraft on another forum years ago. I'm still dealing with the case. At that time I'd only had one picture, the right hand side of the nose . Now, I've got several others.

 

This aircraft is the Mosquito PR Mk. XVI NS650 from the 25th Bomb Group (Rcn), 654th BS, USAAF at Watton. It had to force land in Sweden 3 april 1945 after a Graypea mission against Kiel.

At the Squadron there were also Mosquitos that flew Blue stocking missions, wheather reconnaissance. They also got mission markings which is well documented. So why shouldn't the Graypea missions be as well? I'm sure the answer is out there somewhere.

 

https://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=126

 

Edited by Matave

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Your image is not visible. Please re-post.

 

 

Chris

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15 hours ago, dogsbody said:

Your image is not visible. Please re-post.

 

 

Chris

it was not embedded correctly, plus it says not allowed to be reproduced so a link is the only way it should be on BM anyway.

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On 5/19/2019 at 6:10 PM, Matave said:

I don't want any guesses or assu(m)ptions. I want those who really know to tell the colours.

Well I have a friend whose grandfather worked in Swedish military intelligence and she has inherited all of his old logbooks, notes and photos etc but it's likely that even if his files included information about this that there would not be a colour picture so I won't assume anything.

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5 hours ago, Julien said:

it was not embedded correctly, plus it says not allowed to be reproduced so a link is the only way it should be on BM anyway.

I did try to link to a picture, but with no success.

 

The picture is on this page if you scroll down a bit.

https://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=126

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4 hours ago, Matave said:

I did try to link to a picture, but with no success.

 

The picture is on this page if you scroll down a bit.

https://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=126

The owner has marked the picture not for reproduction and disabled hot linking which is why it wont link.

 

No one should use pictures in threads where they are marked as such, or subject to copyright. They should only use links.

 

Julien

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