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Lord Riot

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I begin to think that Revell received the wrong Frame E from Hasegawa. My Hasegawa examples carry the correct main wheels, parts for the Sargent Flecther tanks and "Turkey Feathers" for the General Electric engines (F-4J).

 

Troffa: I'll post some pictures when my camera battery is charged.

 

Antti

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5 minutes ago, 71chally said:

ah yes, 43 and 111 were the FG.1 Squadrons, however both had the odd FGR.2 at some stage, including XV406 which operated with both units.

 

Don't forget that Treble One were originally an FGR2 unit . They only re-equipped with the FG1 after 892 Squadron disbanded , in the interests of commonisation at Leuchars . 

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Thanks very much for that Antti, sounds like your boxing's sprue E (presumably from the F4J kit) s a much more suitable addition for the British phantom kits, and negates the need for the white metal parts. Nice to know!

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Some great info here, I'm going to have to do the FG1 soon. 

 

I don't recall the RAF FG1s having such a long nosewheel, would it be better using the kit FGR2 part and adding an extra tow bar to it?

 

Great chart that @71chally! Helpful if building an earlier Phantom what load to add too, recce pods, etc.  I notice the bases for 111 and 29 are the wrong way round though. 

Edited by Lord Riot
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46 minutes ago, Lord Riot said:

I don't recall the RAF FG1s having such a long nosewheel, would it be betterbusing the kit FGR2 part and adding an extra tow bar to it?

No, the FG.1 nose leg is much beefier looking because of the extra extendible section, the FGR.2 nose leg would look odd with the extra torque link (not two bar). As already mentioned, all FG.1s that were used by the RAF retained the original nose leg but had the extra extendable section disabled.

 

-Daz

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Got my camera up and running again. Here is Frame E from Hasegawa boxing

 

8db17dd6-e8b7-4019-a5f7-78f836161987.JPG

 

And a detail shot showing the main wheels together with Aires resin parts.

35b60b42-0139-43bb-9c01-ffa2558853ab.JPG

 

And finally; my current project. I scaled up the Airfix Phantom "Stencils Placement Guide" and started to compare it's dimensions against those published in "Plane Captain's Handbook" and in A.P.101B-0900-6A2. My findings so far:

 

- the scaled up Airfix drawing matches exactly with the data published in A.P.s and in manufacturer's data

- the  Hasegawa kit's nose is slightly out of shape otherwise the front fuselage matches the drawing nicely up to FS 249.65

- the kit's fuselage is some three millimeters too narrow between air intake lip and FS 355,38 (1,5 mm to be added on fuselage sides)

- the kit's intakes are slightly too wide

- the kit has the fuselage side door sizes wrong

 

resized_05e94438-7322-4206-a586-03490642

 

Antti

 

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There is an original Hasegawa FG1 kit on ebay at the moment, and price is (so far) pretty reasonable with 4 days left to run. EBay number is 163652744129

 

Would save all the faffing about 😊

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The Hasegawa FG1 kit is nice, but a lot of parts are generic, it lacks the correct shape intakes due to this (its missing the correct slope down towards the front of the intake from the middle of the body). But can it still be made into a great model.

 

Darren

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8 hours ago, MADMUSKY said:

The Hasegawa FG1 kit is nice, but a lot of parts are generic, it lacks the correct shape intakes due to this (its missing the correct slope down towards the front of the intake from the middle of the body)

 

Darren

Care to explain, please?

 

-Daz

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This link will take you to a site, courtesy of Modelling Madness, that lists every Hasegawa F-4 Phantom II kit and all the British Phantom kits, including the Revell repops, (as of February 2015). The list includes which sprues each kit contains. The British Phantom list can be found below the list of the different sprues in the kis. That sprue list contains a description of what each sprue contains. The page also has lists of the Hasegawa F-15, F-16, F-22, F-14, F/A-18 legacy Hornets and F/A-18 Super Hornet kits.

 

http://modelingmadness.com/splfeat/kr/has48d.htm

 

If you want to know what is included in one of these Hasegawa kits, this site will tell you.

Enjoy!

 

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I had a look at that site the other day, and I'm  not sure it's entirely accurate for the latest hasegawa issues as Antii has demonstrated. I think the Hasegawa kits have what the table identifies as Sprue "Es", 23 parts with J style mainwheels. The revell repop still has the original E, 23 parts but with USAF style wheels. I will have a look later on, but as its easter im stuck in Ikea with the wife. 

 

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19 hours ago, MADMUSKY said:

The Hasegawa FG1 kit is nice, but a lot of parts are generic, it lacks the correct shape intakes due to this (its missing the correct slope down towards the front of the intake from the middle of the body). But can it still be made into a great model.

 

Darren

I've noted this also. When viewed from the side the top of the intake is too straight. It looks like an F-4J or F-4E intake. The intake in British Phantoms has it's highest point at FS 249.65 and the line should slope all the way up to this station. After that it should also slope slightly down again toward the rear fuselage.

 

Also the intake opening in Hasegawa kit is too wide. As you all know there has been a lot of conversation about the British Phantom's engine air intakes. Quite many modellers seem to believe that because the Spey as a turbofan required some 20 % more air than the G.E. turbojet engine, the intakes of British Phantoms were 20 % wider. Well yes and no. If you are designing a subsonic aircraft this rule is somewhat true concerning the size of the the intake opening. But when designing a Mach 2+ capable aircraft you have to deal with the so called "oblique shock waves". The interior dimensions of the British Phantom are bigger because of this shock wave control. This in turn can be seen as different fuselage shape and dimensions. The intake openings are almost the same size in British and American Phantoms. The compressor inlets have almost the same diameter in RR Spey and General Electric.

 

As I mentioned earlier it seems that the Hasegawa fuselage is also some three millimeters too narrow when compared against manufacturer's data (see post #36).

 

Kind Regards,

Antti

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1170444 (2)   

 

f-4j-phantom_155759 (2)

 

 

 

Compare the FG1 at the top to the F-4J below, you can see the difference in the angles from the intake going rearwards. its one of those things that not many people notice, but once you do you can see it in a lot of pictures.

 

Darren

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Thank you Darren,

 

that's exactly what I tried to explain. In the upper picture you can also see how the intake slopes slightly down after the highest point. The shape is correct in the Airfix FG.1 kit but unfortunately Hasegawa kits got it wrong.

 

Cheers,

Antti

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5 minutes ago, Antti_K said:

Thank you Darren,

 

that's exactly what I tried to explain. In the upper picture you can also see how the intake slopes slightly down after the highest point. The shape is correct in the Airfix FG.1 kit but unfortunately Hasegawa kits got it wrong.

 

Cheers,

Antti

I think Hasegawa just re-designed the rear and bottom wing assembly for making the British Phantom leaving them with Generic parts for all their Phantom kits. Obviously saves on cost.

(The pictures help show it better than trying to explain to people)

Darren

Edited by MADMUSKY
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Hello John,

 

Thank you for the pictures🙂 The first drawing comes from the "Plane Captains' Handbook - F-4K/M". I'm confused about the wing Buttock Line measurement as it says 51.92 at the root. The measurement is exactly the same in F-4B and F-4J manuals and yet the British Phantom's fuselage is wider at this point. The other copy you posted earlier in another topic (from Phantom's AP) gives different and even more confusing measurements.

 

Or am I missing something?

 

Antti

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