How good is Airfix at following product suggestions?

[fightersweep]

11 minutes ago, The Tomohawk Kid said:

 

If I recall rightly Nimrod was marketed as a limited edition with pre-orders only securing the kit. If someone doubled the order quanity, that is a heck of a mistake and completely undermined the original marketing strategy. I imagine a P45 followed.

 

Tommo.

I would imagine so too! The conversation occurred during one of the regular Airfix rep visits, and he was trying to offload a load of Nimrod kits onto me (happy to take them and we RRP'd them at £15!) Naturally, I asked why the overstocks...bad sales? and was told about the over production. I have mentioned this here before, and if I remember rightly, was told that this possibly happened on a second production run. As I say, don't know for certain, just recounting what I was told at the time. 

Edited April 14, 2019 by fightersweep

[RichG]

47 minutes ago, fightersweep said:

If I recall rightly Nimrod was marketed as a limited edition with pre-orders only securing the kit. If someone doubled the order quanity, that is a heck of a mistake and completely undermined the original marketing strategy.

Of course the Airfix of 2007 (Nimrod era) was effectively a different company then. The Britmodeller thread of the day makes interesting reading

 

 

The excitement of the pending release of the long awaited Nimrod kit is almost palpable with people discussing how long they had it on preorder and how many copies they were going to buy, options for what if's  etc. Any manufacturer reading that thread would have rightly believed they had struck the mother lode - a sure fire winner.

 

There was debate that the 'Limited' label attached to the Nimrod kit was actually misleading.  Essentially the Airfix product run being set to meet the demand registered by the retail outlets rather than a specified amount, so the hysteria that followed the previous TSR.2 might not be repeated. It was suggested Airfix would be producing in excess of 23000 - so if that was based on retail orders (perhaps already inflated by retailers themselves to catch the enthusiastic demand on release)  was actually doubled by mistake... 

 

Well as i say makes interesting reading in the context of this thread's original post.

 

Rich

 

[fightersweep]

@RichG

 

Interesting points Rich, particularly the mention of pre-release threads and opinions on new subjects. The release of the Airfix 1/24 Mosquito and Tamiya 1/32 Spitfire IX came about the same time, remembering the huge boxes that arrived in the warehouse one day. Previously, I had read many threads stating that nobody really bought Airfix 1/24 kits, and that the Tamiya 1/32 Spitfire was the uberkit that would outsell all...or opinions to that effect. I remember the figures clearly. In the first two months, we sold 137 Airfix Mosquitoes and 48 Tamiya Spitfire IXs. Go figure as our American friends often say!

 

Steve

[Tbolt]

1 hour ago, upnorth said:

Airfix has been bitten once or twice in the past by following modellers' suggestions. Their 1/72 Supermarine Swift and Nimrod kits were cases in point.

 

People got misty and nostalgic for a kit of the Swift to round out their early Cold War RAF Germany collections. Airfix took a loss on that kit as the sales didn't reflect the demand that was there.

 

Same story with the Nimrod kit, lots of energetic talk on the forums and lots of suggestions of it made to Airfix. What happened when the kit was released? Shops anded up having to sell it at deep discounts just to move them out the door.

 

I'd rather see Airfix scale down their 1/48 Sea Vixen and Javelin kits to 1/72  before putting out a new tooling.

I always thought the Javelin would have sold better in 1/72nd scale, I don't know how well the 1/48th scale kit did.

[fightersweep]

I haven't as yet emailed any of my suggestions to Airfix, although I did bend many a rep's ear and the management team at the annual Hornby trade weekends. If I was though, I would suggest a 1/72 Harvard II and a Dh Hornet or Sea Hornet (in any scale would be nice). If I was to field an idea for the next 1/24 kit, I would probably beg them to put the research on the 1/48 Spitfire XIV into a 1/24 release. Only because I would sell my entire stash to build a bunch of 1/24 Spitfire XIVs.

 

I think manufacturers do listen. I remember nagging the Italeri reps about the company re-releasing the Esci 1/24 Transit as I didn't want to pay £200 plus on eBay for the privilege of building one. Lo and behold, they did a few years later. Not saying I had anything to do with it, but I bought five out of gratitude anyway!

 

Steve 

Edited April 14, 2019 by fightersweep

[Albeback52]

17 hours ago, Denford said:

There have been many similar postings on customer suggestions and why is such and such a subject has been seemingly ignored.

To repeat, Airfix's purpose IS TO MAKE MONEY.  Nothing else. 

The fact that such and such an aircraft is:

- Iconic

- No line up would be complete without it

- An important subject in (British) aviation

- Such and such an anniversary will soon fall due.

- "I know it would sell" ie I would buy it.

Are all totally irrelevant: it must make money.  True (no cynicism intended) they say they consider customers' requests, but then they could hardly say otherwise!

 

If you look at their output, roughly 5-6 new toolings per year, and the number of subjects they have yet to tool (to say nothing of re-tooling), it is clear why so many subjects seem forgotten.

 

So for the UK  alone, and in WWll, (which one could suppose is their 'core' area and so of priority) and in 1/72, they have yet to tool:

Tempest, Beaufort, Griffon Spitfire, Albacore, Barracuda, early Firefly (do they have something against Fairey ?), Seafire, York, Oxford, Rapide, Horsa, Roc/Skua (assuming the available data is adequate), 2 Stage Mosquito and 'stretching the boundaries a little' single seat Vampire, Lincoln and probably a few more!

 

Add to that, 'retooling', other scales, Post War,  and other Air Forces is surely clear why any particular subject remains seemingly ignored.  How long 'to clear' even the above somewhat restricted list?  Surely decades!

 

Whatever has been chosen but not yet announced, can only be at the expense of something else.  One could say that 'many be called but few be chosen'.

 

 

Possibly the truest statement yet!! I'm sure there was a story on B M a few years back about the Airfix rep at Telford whose response to a suggestion for a Supermarine Scimitar (another of those guaranteed best seller/no line up would be complete types) was an outburst of laughter!! Of course Airfix will LISTEN but, as you rightly imply,they also have to be sensible and pragmatic.

 

[Thomas V.]

1 hour ago, fightersweep said:

@RichG

 

Interesting points Rich, particularly the mention of pre-release threads and opinions on new subjects. The release of the Airfix 1/24 Mosquito and Tamiya 1/32 Spitfire IX came about the same time, remembering the huge boxes that arrived in the warehouse one day. Previously, I had read many threads stating that nobody really bought Airfix 1/24 kits, and that the Tamiya 1/32 Spitfire was the uberkit that would outsell all...or opinions to that effect. I remember the figures clearly. In the first two months, we sold 137 Airfix Mosquitoes and 48 Tamiya Spitfire IXs. Go figure as our American friends often say!

 

Steve

As someone who was also shifting trasport boxes at the time,  can say that in 2009 and later, majority of Tamiya and other far eastern manufacturers were bought via Asian online shops unlike Airfix. Prices being substantially lower than through local distributor.

In my opinion aside from first release, Mosquito re-pop is a sales flop due to Tamiya 32nd kit., which brings me to say that in my long term ( 30+ ) years od dealing with Airfix-they don't listen, nor customers nor distributors/retailers.

 

[viscount806x]

5 hours ago, fightersweep said:

 I would suggest a 1/72 Harvard II

 

Steve 

Certainly the lack of a modern tooled Harvard II in 1/72 is a bit odd considering the numbers built. A multi purpose kit using the different canopies etc. would achieve some interest wouldn't it? May be not exciting enough perhaps.

[fightersweep]

38 minutes ago, viscount806x said:

Certainly the lack of a modern tooled Harvard II in 1/72 is a bit odd considering the numbers built. A multi purpose kit using the different canopies etc. would achieve some interest wouldn't it? May be not exciting enough perhaps.

Totally agree! It would get me excited though, especially if most of the options were in one box. I think the aftermarket decal folk would get a bit excited too at the opportunity to tackle the endless potential options. Well, we know Airfix are seemingly replacing their old kits, and their Harvard, as we all know, is very, very old....so maybe one day? 

[Andre B]

1 hour ago, fightersweep said:

Totally agree! It would get me excited though, especially if most of the options were in one box. I think the aftermarket decal folk would get a bit excited too at the opportunity to tackle the endless potential options. Well, we know Airfix are seemingly replacing their old kits, and their Harvard, as we all know, is very, very old....so maybe one day? 

Isn't that the problem? Can an company that runs on economy put money in kits for a few obsessed modellbuilders?

 

But with an smaller market that depends more on the obsessed modellbuilders can company's like Airfix afford not to listen?

 

And still there are no new and accurate Harward's or P-51B's in 1/72 scale. Nor an Scimitar...

 

Cheers / André

[IanC]

On 4/13/2019 at 7:32 PM, Denford said:

The fact that such and such an aircraft is:

- Iconic

- No line up would be complete without it

- An important subject in (British) aviation

- Such and such an anniversary will soon fall due.

- "I know it would sell" ie I would buy it.

Are all totally irrelevant: it must make money. 

 

 

I don't think these criteria are totally irrelevant.

 

They surely go some way towards informing decisions - which is presumably why a Pulqui (which I had to look up..) is far less likely to be kitted than a Mosquito or Vampire.

 

Profit is the bottom line, but you need to have a hunch about what stands a good chance of making you some money. Otherwise you may as well pick subjects out of a hat.

 

 

 

Edited April 14, 2019 by IanC

[LN-KEH]

4 hours ago, viscount806x said:

Certainly the lack of a modern tooled Harvard II in 1/72 is a bit odd considering the numbers built. A multi purpose kit using the different canopies etc. would achieve some interest wouldn't it? May be not exciting enough perhaps.

I fully support this - it fits with the other trainers released by Airfix and it has been in service with many other countries as well besides the UK.

They can probably release a new variant every year, but they need to be clever when it comes to getting the variants right.

[Edge]

I don't normally join in these chats but, in the hope that Airfix are listening, I'll throw my two penneth in!

 

Theres definitely a gap in the market for 1950's-'60's RAF/NATO aircraft. I'm thinking (like others have mentioned) Javelin (lots of different marks but all similarly painted).

Venom & Vampire for sure, although the recent kits of the Vampire from Revell, Special Hobby et.al may dampen their enthusiasm for the Vampire. Again lots of different marks & colour schemes possible.

Sea Vixen. Possibly less attractive as other kits are available and with just UK users possibly less popular to other markets.

A modern 1/72 Harvard would, as has been mentioned, be welcomed by a great many of us. Plenty of variety in markings and versions to have a broad appeal I would have thought. 

 

Less likely unfortunately are subjects like the Anson, Hoverfly, Whirlwind, Sycamore and Belvedere helicopters. 

 

Edge

[Seahawk]

13 hours ago, Andre B said:

Isn't that the problem? Can an company that runs on economy put money in kits for a few obsessed modellbuilders?

Well, that's what their chief designer said they do at a talk I attended: use the profits from the big earners (Phantoms, Spitfires) to cross-subsidise the occasional more esoteric choice (he mentioned the Whitley and maybe the Swift).  What is undoubtedly true is that, the more desperate the company's financial position, the less freedom of manoeuvre they will have for such a policy. 

 

Afraid a Pulqui will have to wait in the queue behind my Blackburn Shark TT.III, which would be, as any fule kno, a sure-fire best seller.

[Agent K]

On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 1:48 AM, Sturmovik said:

I requested Airfix if they could upscale their A-4Bs in 72nd to 48th, and suggested making a brand new tool Pulqui II in the same scale. The first one is sorely needed IMO, and the second one would be great to have. For me at least.

Is Airfix good at following customer suggestions?

I'd suggest that they wouldn't design, produce and release a new kit purely based on your request!!!!

 

They might listen to and canvas some opinion, and if the data suggests there might be an appropriate volume of sales, and profit margin etc. etc. they might investigate. There is a lot more selecting projects for production than just peoples requests. 

 

How many times have we seen people requesting particular kits, only to then whinge about the cost when it is released and not buying it.....

[Ad-4N]

On 4/14/2019 at 3:52 AM, upnorth said:

Airfix has been bitten once or twice in the past by following modellers' suggestions. Their 1/72 Supermarine Swift and Nimrod kits were cases in point.

 

I bought both.  I did my part.  Having said that, I know those kits were for enthusiasts like me, not the grandma who is picking up a kit for Liam at Target.  

[Andre B]

I bought the Swift, the Lightning and the Sabre. I also have eight P-51D's, twelve Spitfire's in different variants, Hurricane's, Thypoon's and... ...so can I beg for an Scimitar? Or at least an accurate P-51B? An Mustang would at least be picked up by most of the buyers?

 

Cheers / André

[Harold55]

Having been in business myself for many years I thought I might chime in here.  certainly Airfix is in business to make money but to make money all companies need to listen to their customers and I am certain they do.  In fact very few customers actually provide any input, feedback or suggestions so the few that do are particularly valuable.  This is not the sole source of input as they would have market research, retail buyers, and a long history in the field so it is not as simple as adding up how many people asked for a 1/72 xyz and making the commitment but that said they certainly would keep track of what customers ask for.  So I would encourage anyone that if you have an interest in a particular subject/scale let the companies know.  Participate in those customer surveys and you will be one voice in an a thousand that don't so your input will have weight.

[cmatthewbacon]

On past form and following events at other companies, Airfix would do well to take the kits that are most suggested on their form at SMW and file them under "on no account make one of these", or at least put them to the bottom of the list...

 

😜

 

best,

M.

[Tbolt]

16 minutes ago, cmatthewbacon said:

On past form and following events at other companies, Airfix would do well to take the kits that are most suggested on their form at SMW and file them under "on no account make one of these", or at least put them to the bottom of the list...

 

😜

 

best,

M.

Some maybe but I bet they had a lot of suggestions for a 1/72nd Bucanneer over the last few years and if they don't sell well I'll buy a hundred myself 🤑

[Nocoolname]

On 4/13/2019 at 3:44 AM, Rabbit Leader said:

You never know your luck. 

Hasegawa recently reissued their 1/48 A-4C, so perhaps the 'B' may also get a re-release if sales of this kit are good. I bought a 'C' so that might help!  

 

Cheers.. Dave

Couldn't the 'C' be modded into a 'B'? I was thinking of doing this to create an Argentine A-4.

[trickydicky210]

The one thing that always surprises me is why a kit is chosen to be released in a certain scale I.e 1/72 and not 1/48 or vice versa 

 

subjects that spring to mind are the 1/72 sea king and Harriers, both would sell very well in 1/48 IMO. But like the rest of us I am

just a modeller with my own wish list. 

[Uncle Uncool]

On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 6:07 AM, Tbolt said:

and the Pulqui II no chance - you're asking the wrong company.

I concur. Perhaps the making of a 1/48 (resin) Pulqui II kit is more in the hands of Mr Heredia, owner of Aconcagua Resin Models, than it's in the hands of Airfix.

And being Sturmovik and I fellow countrymen with Mr Heredia, perhaps it's in the hands of Fran and I to get Mr Heredia going

 JuanCa, we want "they're" Pulqui II...  JuanCa, we want "they're" Pulqui II...  JuanCa, we want "they're" Pulqui II...

Oh, and while at it,  When are you going to finish that Morane-Saulnier MS.760 Paris kit...

Cheers,

 

Unc²

[Harold55]

1 hour ago, trickydicky210 said:

The one thing that always surprises me is why a kit is chosen to be released in a certain scale I.e 1/72 and not 1/48 or vice versa 

 

subjects that spring to mind are the 1/72 sea king and Harriers, both would sell very well in 1/48 IMO. 

This is a mystery to me also, particularly when you consider they are all done with CAD now and the substantial cost of that initial design.  Stepping up or down a scale even if it means adding or subtracting detail/parts to match the level appropriate for the scale would seem to me a no brainier.   This would also apply to rendering close versions in the same scale.  Some manufactures are very good at this while others just seem to forget they have this opportunity available (both in the original design and after the fact).

[NPL]

On 4/13/2019 at 4:13 PM, The Tomohawk Kid said:

 

I like to believe I'm reasonably well up on my aviation subjects, but I had to Google to find out what a Pulqui II was, I venture I'm not on my own. That tells you what chance that has of being kitted by Airfix.

 

Tommo.

Maybe it would have a chance somewhere, as it was designed by Kurt Tank.

 

Otherwise, I believe that Airfix is happy of getting advices, but following more than a few would most likely lead to the end of the industry.