bootneck Posted April 4, 2019 Share Posted April 4, 2019 Hi Folks, I am looking for photo's of Wessex having their blades re-attached, from the folded position, in readiness for flying stations whilst onboard carriers at sea. Carriers for this would have been Ark Royal, Eagle, and the Centaur class. This is for a diorama I would like to do, however my Google searches have come up with nothing. Any ex-Naval ratings out there have any images of this activity taking place? Also, who would do that work; yellow shirt aircraft handlers or brown shirt? cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 Surprisingly I dont have anything in my collection but I've chased up some old squadron oppo's to see if they have anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wafu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Hi Royal, I’ve a few pictures from my time on the Happy H as a JAEM many moons ago, I’ll dig them out and send them on. To answer your question though, the flight would do all the maintenance on the aircraft, the Yellow and Blue Surcoat were/are Cockhead’s (Aircraft Handlers to give them their true title) they would drive the tractors (blue) and supervise (yellow) the moves. The rest was down to the flight to provide chockmen for each wheel and a brakeman. Taking part art in the spreading and folding would be a Petty Officer supervisor (White Surcoat), and all the trade guys ie Brown for the Grubbers (mechanical trade) Green for the Greenies (electrical trade) Red coat with a black vertical stripe for the Bombheads (weapons) Green with a blue vertical stripe for the Pinkies ( Radio/Radar trade). The flight usually had a Cheif Petty Officer (Senior Maintenance Rating) x1 White surcoat with Squadron number and SMR on the back in a white rectangle. Petty Officer of each trade (total x4) with Squadron and trade Sup on in the white rectangle ie 845 M SUP. Leading Hand of each trade x4. Coloured surcoat with Sqdn then Trade LH ie 845 M L/H. Then each trade of Mechanic x4. Coloured surcoat with Squadron then trade ie 845 AEM. In warm weather the surcoat would be ditched with the foul weather jacket and overalls, we then wore working trousers (No 8’s) with a coloured long sleeve jersey in our trade colours and a white rectangle on the front and back. The front sometimes had your nickname on with the back being marked as above, mine had SCOUSE on. As for the folding and spreading of the main blades, you used the aircraft lift to bring the Wessex up to about cabin door height then spread the main blades with two guys lifting the blade at the tip whilst standing at flight deck height, two guys would be on the head, on each side, stood on the transmission decks, putting in the blade pins and securing the wrist pin to stop the blade rotating in flight. The port blades were rotated to allow stowage in the blade saddles and so had to be return to the correct position for flight. The Blue shirted chockhead would raise and lower the lift to deck height for each plate to be put in the spread position and held at the tip by two guys, the lift was then lowered with the aircraft on and so the blade was spread and the pin put in, sounds complicated but really isnt, a good flight could do this in 10 mins on a bust flight deck. Ill try to find a photo to show this more clearly. Hope this helps till then! One small thing, in the very early 80’s the Fleet Air Arm combined the Electrical and Weapons trades to form the WL branch, however the different colours existed on the flight decks with WL rating wearing either coloured surcoats and flight deck jerseys. That’s for you sprog WAFU’s lol. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeronut Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Were blade poles used to support the blade tips when the lift wasn’t available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted April 7, 2019 Author Share Posted April 7, 2019 Thanks Ian. I used to be 845's 'pet Booty' on board Happy H and at Yeovilton, it is from that time that I remember all this going on. I used to watch when the blades were being lifted by the pole support and it is this type of scenario that I want to represent on my dio. Most of the time, the aircraft were on there spots and so the blade unfolding was done on the stbd side however, if the aircraft was ranged over in the parking green, would the blades be done both sides simultaneously? As to the change of roles, my dio will represent work on a Wessie in the 1970's so the old colours and rates would be right. Looking forward to seeing your photo's, especially of guys on the transmission deck with their nylon/rubber hammers!! I seem to recall they also had a sort of cotter pin in their mouth? Mike 848 NAS, Culdrose/Albion 1970-73 845 NAS, Yeovilton/Hermes 1975-77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JagRigger Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Someone couldn't be bothered with the lift 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Wessex blade is attached to the head with two horizontal taper pins (hence the nylon hammer) they have a castellated nut on one end with a 'nappy pin' stopping the nut undoing, rather than using a split pin. There are pictures of gearboxes/heads in the walkaround section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted April 7, 2019 Author Share Posted April 7, 2019 2 hours ago, JagRigger said: Someone couldn't be bothered with the lift Thanks JagRigger, that's just the setting that I am looking for. Hopefully Wafu will be along soon with photo's of all the team in view and with a blade on the pole. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Pete in Lincs said: There are pictures of gearboxes/heads in the walkaround section. There are, Mike actually took them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 And very grateful we are too. It was a long time ago when I played with these things. I do remember trying to balance the wobbly end of a blade on top of that damned pole though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tramatoa Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) It’s all a bit fishy to me........... Edited April 7, 2019 by Tramatoa 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted April 8, 2019 Author Share Posted April 8, 2019 Who let that Crab cab onto one of HM's carriers?? Nice photo but could still do with finding something that showed the guys working on the camera side. cheers Mike 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 Look how old that Wessie was, I'd love a shot of the nose area Might even have one of the earlier style intake noses on her Come on Mike you can do it from that one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted April 8, 2019 Author Share Posted April 8, 2019 It's not the aircraft as such, it is more about the position/poses of the deck crew during the unfolding operation that I am looking for. I plan to use a Mark 1 Models Wessex in 1:144 scale for this. Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roof Rat Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 Hello Mike Just to explain "what's occurring" in Tramatoa's picture and tied-in with Pete in Lincs comment, to help with the process of either spreading or folding Wessex main rotor in high wind conditions the forward lift had a "wind-stop" as shown in the picture. This placed the rotor head just above flight deck level allowing the blades to be walked into position. The process would start and finish as normal with a grubber positioned by the rotor head with two more manning the blade handling pole positioned on the lift, the blade was passed from lift level to the flight deck where the raising of the blade was done by "hands-on". The theory being it was a safer procedure in high winds than trying to balance the blade with the handling pole, with the process reversed for folding. I cant be certain but judging by the deck markings and the clothing worn by the crew I think the photo was taken on one of the early Commando Carriers. If your still awake I hope that was of some interest. All the best RR 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Swindell Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 7 hours ago, bootneck said: Nice photo but could still do with finding something that showed the guys working on the camera side. Working? I can see 2 guys on the wessex rotor head putting pins in, 2 guys on the flight deck holding the blade up, and if the photo is an official one, a photographer behind the camera The rest of them look like goofers, presumably if there is anybody else on the camera side, they're goofing too! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wafu Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 4 hours ago, Roof Rat said: Hello Mike Just to explain "what's occurring" in Tramatoa's picture and tied-in with Pete in Lincs comment, to help with the process of either spreading or folding Wessex main rotor in high wind conditions the forward lift had a "wind-stop" as shown in the picture. This placed the rotor head just above flight deck level allowing the blades to be walked into position. The process would start and finish as normal with a grubber positioned by the rotor head with two more manning the blade handling pole positioned on the lift, the blade was passed from lift level to the flight deck where the raising of the blade was done by "hands-on". The theory being it was a safer procedure in high winds than trying to balance the blade with the handling pole, with the process reversed for folding. I cant be certain but judging by the deck markings and the clothing worn by the crew I think the photo was taken on one of the early Commando Carriers. If your still awake I hope that was of some interest. All the best RR Spot on RR, with the picture and your text it explains the action we used to use on the Hermes to reduce damage to the blades during folding and spreading in high winds or if the flight could talk the FDO (Flight Deck Officer) into letting us do it. Let’s face it, all of us on here who have actually spread one of these things would take an easier option if provided, no? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) Posted a few years back but may be relevant to this thread. The unofficial guide to blade folding a Wessex 31B (816 Squadron watch 3 style) 1. Grab 3 oppo's from the crew room, ignore the pee'ing and moaning that will surely follow. 2. Draw a blade fold kit from the tool store 3. Ensure somebody remembered a set of blade fold saddles 4.Whilst the saddles are being fitted check the rotor brake is off then relocate thy self to the transmission platform. 5. Rotate the rotor head into the correct position 6. Go back to the cockpit and reapply the rotor brake, note that the (expletive) thing wont build up pressure in three pumps 7. Climb back up to the transmission platform, note which of the aforementioned oppo's has scarpered up the other side and thusly avoided blade pole duty. 8. Rotate the blade sleeve lock ratchet knob until the locking pin with draws 9. If you are on the port side, firmly grasp each of your two blades in turn and rotate the blade 180 degrees. This is to be done swiftly and without strain lest thy oppo's heap scorn upon you. 10. Remove the safety lock from the castellated nut on each upper blade retaining pin. Never undo the bottom ones. 11. Attach the blade pin removal tool to the upper blade retaining pin, question the parentage of the individual who cross threaded it last time without telling any one. 12.Wind the tool in until it becomes tight. 13. Ensure there are two burly sailors on the blade pole then, in a loud clear voice yell "UP" 14. When the blade is lifted lightly belt the name of the Almighty out of the pin with a plastic mallet then quickly remove the pin and slip it into an overalls pocket. 15. Continue to yell "UP" to the two blade pole operators, this can be followed with "For (expletive) sake" if required 16. When your game of "hide the blade pin" is nicked the blade is then lowered and rotated back into the saddle. 17. Repeat the process for the remaining blades. 18. Launch yourself smartly over the rotor head and attempt to pee off down the other side of the aircraft away from the two now very annoyed blade pole operators. 19. Ignore any threats of retribution because as we know they did the same thing to you yesterday! 20. Go write up the dicky rotor brake in the TA100. No girly down the lift rubbish for us Aussies 💪 Edited April 9, 2019 by NAVY870 Spelling a 3 year old would be annoyed by. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wafu Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 8 hours ago, NAVY870 said: Posted a few years back but may be relevant to this thread. The unofficial guide to blade folding a Wessex 31B (816 Squadron watch 3 style) 1. Grab 3 oppo's from the crew room, ignore the pee'ing and moaning that will surely follow. 2. Draw a blade fold kit from the tool store 3. Ensure somebody remembered a set of blade fold saddles 4.Whilst the saddles are being fitted check the rotor brake is off then relocate thy self to the transmission platform. 5. Rotate the rotor head into the correct position 6. Go back to the cockpit and reapply the rotor brake, note that the (expletive) thing wont build up pressure in three pumps 7. Climb back up to the transmission platform, note which of the aforementioned oppo's has scarpered up the other side and thusly avoided blade pole duty. 8. Rotate the blade sleeve lock ratchet knob until the locking pin with draws 9. If you are on the port side, firmly grasp each of your two blades in turn and rotate the blade 180 degrees. This is to be done swiftly and without strain lest thy oppo's heap scorn upon you. 10. Remove the safety lock from the castellated nut on each upper blade retaining pin. Never undo the bottom ones. 11. Attach the blade pin removal tool to the upper blade retaining pin, question the parentage of the individual who cross threaded it last time without telling any one. 12.Wind the tool in until it becomes tight. 13. Ensure there are two burly sailors on the blade pole then, in a loud clear voice yell "UP" 14. When the blade is lifted lightly belt the name of the Almighty out of the pin with a plastic mallet then quickly remove the pin and slip it into an overalls pocket. 15. Continue to yell "UP" to the two blade pole operators, this can be followed with "For (expletive) sake" if required 16. When your game of "hide the blade pin" is nicked the blade is then lowered and rotated back into the saddle. 17. Repeat the process for the remaining blades. 18. Launch yourself smartly over the rotor head and attempt to pee off down the other side of the aircraft away from the two now very annoyed blade pole operators. 19. Ignore any threats of retribution because as we know they did the same thing to you yesterday! 20. Go write up the dicky rotor brake in the TA100. No girly down the lift rubbish for us Aussies 💪 13 was always entertaining if they were of different stature😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bell209 Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 I assume oppos = operators = slack aircrew (oh, wait, that's a tautology!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 On 4/8/2019 at 11:51 AM, perdu said: Look how old that Wessie was, I'd love a shot of the nose area Might even have one of the earlier style intake noses on her et voila, https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205164837 From the same event Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 Yes gottit! I'd thought that might have been the earliest generation of intakes and I see one pair of long jetpipes and one of the earlier short ones All based round the intake shape that was 'issued' with the Frog Wessex HAS1/31 If one allows for the pair of Gnomes down the hole it could be a very 'different' Walter for a collection 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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