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rob Lyttle

737 Max

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4 hours ago, Adam Poultney said:

I wonder how possible it would be to modify a MAX airframe back to an 800, 900 or something very similar.

Not sure really but they wouldn't have as many orders for them that the MAX generated .Boeing would still have the problem competing with the Airbus NEo jets which kicked them off down the MAX with MCAS road in the beginning .

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Looks like someone did some simple maths. The monetary cost of losing one aircraft every 3 years or so was less than the cost to Boeing of making the changes and the downtime from the MAX fleet sitting on the ground. Especially if they could pass the blame along to the pilots.

 

Cold calculation!

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14 minutes ago, EwenS said:

Looks like someone did some simple maths. The monetary cost of losing one aircraft every 3 years or so was less than the cost to Boeing of making the changes and the downtime from the MAX fleet sitting on the ground. Especially if they could pass the blame along to the pilots.

 

Cold calculation!

But they were losing them every few months and that was with what, 300 flying?

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The regulators(not FAA) of various countries need to fly the MAX without MCAS.  Someone besides FAA/Boeing needs to see what this thing is doing when it gets to the sticky parts of the envelope. 

 

More than half of pilots in recent sim tests used wrong procedures to recover from AOA indication errors.

Mainly a training issue but, I truly hope that all the pilots get good training before RTS of the MAX

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safety/pilot-procedure-confusion-adds-new-complication-to-737-max-return/?fbclid=IwAR3R9dnXEtiROn6TQWTut63r5V6WKJj634NjmQtkcJ9WNb7JuyicCOXJVhU

 

787 Removal of leading edge foil

FAA engineers objected to Boeing’s removal of some 787 lightning protection measures.  Engineers overridden by FAA management.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/faa-engineers-objected-to-boeings-removal-of-some-787-lightning-protection-measures/

Edited by NoSG0

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Looks to me like testing directional changes (rudder tests?) at 10,110m running SE/NW (aircraft turns left then back right onto original course several times with speed changes) then they push speed from 418 to 623mph while heading east. Then lose 5400m during which the speed falls to about 350mph, so is clearly under control. Then a turn back west at their new altitude followed by more rudder tests (various turns to left and then returning to the original westerly heading) then home to base.

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I know it's too little too late, but at least the head of the FAA has said it won't get released into service until he has flown it himself and is satisfied it is safe.

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Frankly, ALL FAA and Boeing executives need to fly on these test flights before it's unleashed on the unsuspecting public again.

 

 

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We know how that goes, that's why they assistants, if they do. Boeing still thinks it'll make money on this? Are airlines just keeping existing aircraft flying longer? Wonder what's written in the contracts if these don't get approval. Maybe this was answered already.

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4 minutes ago, busnproplinerfan said:

We know how that goes, that's why they assistants, if they do. Boeing still thinks it'll make money on this? Are airlines just keeping existing aircraft flying longer? Wonder what's written in the contracts if these don't get approval. Maybe this was answered already.

My airline at wich i work is going to get them sooner then initial  because of the cancellations of certain airlines....

And do i trust the thing.....well i have too or else i have to find another job!!

 

cheers, Jan

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4 hours ago, janneman36 said:

My airline at wich i work is going to get them sooner then initial  because of the cancellations of certain airlines....

And do i trust the thing.....well i have too or else i have to find another job!!

 

cheers, Jan

Hope they work out.

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Well .. Boeing just announced that 737 MAX production is being halted in January .

 Boeing quote

 

The manufacturer said in a statement that it had 400 737 Max aircraft in storage. It said it planned for affected employees to "continue 737-related work, or be temporarily assigned to other teams".

 

Did I hear its cost them $9 billion so far mentioned ?

Edited by bzn20

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Well they have been buying their own shares to artificially keep the values up.

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7 minutes ago, bentwaters81tfw said:

Well they have been buying their own shares to artificially keep the values up.

Is that a friendly takeoover then?

;)

Sorry...

Hope this will be solved....

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It’s a suspension rather than the axe

 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/12/16/boeing-will-suspend-737-max-production-in-january.html

 

Given the length of the production chain and long lead times, how will this affect suppliers and more importantly for them, how quickly can they turn on the tap again, once/if this is all resolved?

 

Trevor 

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Wonder if the ones at the top are still getting their christmas bonuses? while the one who cleans washrooms has to worry.

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I wouldn't worry,  I'm quite sure the poor things at the top are being well looked after - this is the US after all......   

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28 minutes ago, Adam Poultney said:

I do wonder if a software fix can even reliably fix the MAX..... 

If it does, I sure hope they have multiple backups or something like that. Could only imagine the logistical nightmare if several hundred pax said they won't fly on the plane while at the airport and that's all the have sitting there are Max's.

Edited by busnproplinerfan

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1 minute ago, busnproplinerfan said:

If it does, I sure hope they have multiple backups or something like that.

Either that or a fully failsafe, easily accessible, intuitive override.  It looks like the new head of the FAA is in no particular hurry to get the modification(s) signed off in order to ensure that, as far as possible, there can be no re-runs of the Lion Air and Ethiopian Airlines crashes that led to this situation.  Despite his best intention we all know that💩 happens and there are just some things that simply cannot be legislated for, but it looks like whatever programme Boeing come up with next on his watch is likely to see greater and more in-depth scrutiny than the 737 MAX 8 did initially.

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Wonder if Boeing has lawyers drawing up complexly worded clauses etc that will keep Boeing from getting sued etc.

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By the time they've done everything possible to get it back flying , costs incurred with delays and compensation to airlines

1 hour ago, busnproplinerfan said:

that will keep Boeing from getting sued

We're past that . Can't cover that series of errors up . It's here is our chin …. Hit it

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If they keep building, will they ever make a profit? Costs of modifications, compensation to frustrated operators and parts suppliers, heavy discounting, falling share price etc etc.

 

Probably best to deliver the modded planes sitting in the parking lots, subsidise  -800’s as partial compensation for said frustrated operators and then start with a clean sheet.

 

808 anyone?

 

Trevor

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